Keep in mind that the Flames are also taking on Kuzmenko' contract at $5.5 million for an additional year, and Kuzmenko has been hot garbage this year. The cap consequences of the trade definitely came into play. Good on the Flame s for using that to their advantage though.
It was a good risk to take considering the haul they received. There's a chance this could be the guy that gets hubby going, A guy who has the skills but just needed a fresh start. This is one of those players that that we talked about with Florida , how they acquired low risk high reward players.
This could be our home run, and Conroy still has the bases loaded.
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During those 17 seasons, 560 teams did not win the Cup, if my expansion math is correct. How many of them had at least one center who shot right handed?
Let us know the list when your analysis is complete.
Hearing Conroy talk about dealing with Allvin is quite funny and insightful.
Conroy: Congratulations on your extension
Allvin: No talk, only trade.
Allvin learned from his first conversation with Conroy during the Zadorov conversations. You may not be aware, but Conroy will talk forever to a wall. The phone calls regarding the Zadorov deal likely didn't get to the main topic until at least after the first hour. Ain't nobody got time for that.
It was a good risk to take considering the haul they received. There's a chance this could be the guy that gets hubby going, A guy who has the skills but just needed a fresh start. This is one of those players that that we talked about with Florida , how they acquired low risk high reward players.
This could be our home run, and Conroy still has the bases loaded.
The way i look at a deal, what would you think of Kuzmenko if we got him exacly 12 month ago? Let's consider that a bit here. $5.5 mil for a guy who scored 39 goals? Worth the risk considering Flames likley are not a playoff team next year.
I'm thinking home run here too. Boesser took some of Kuzmenko ice this year. He will get a chance here.
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Jurmo is only 21 and has been playing against men in the SM-Liga. Depending on his contract situation, I could see him in a Wranglers uniform next season. The farm needs D.
Last edited by Reggie Dunlop; 02-01-2024 at 11:30 AM.
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Kuz has a higher cap hit than Lindholm. With needing to replace Dube once we took Kuz there isn't enough cap left to retain on Lindholm. I'm sure he would have with another team where there wasn't a bunch of cap hit coming back.
Why do the Flames care about cap space next year though? Kuzmenko is the type of UFA signing I would want to them take a swing at. Shoter term over pay and hope to flip the next deadline. Keeps spots open for Tanev, Hanifin, and a retention deadline deal.
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Why do the Flames care about cap space next year though? Kuzmenko is the type of UFA signing I would want to them take a swing at. Shoter term over pay and hope to flip the next deadline. Keeps spots open for Tanev, Hanifin, and a retention deadline deal.
I wouldn't rule out the Flames trying to actually just retool and picking up some UFAs. I obviously hope they don't and try to totally bottom out for 1-3 years.
I wouldn't rule out the Flames trying to actually just retool and picking up some UFAs. I obviously hope they don't and try to totally bottom out for 1-3 years.
No team but maybe the Coyotes actively try to do this.
I may be out to lunch but I look at Pavel Buchnevich return as a comparable to Kuzmenko if he can right the ship a little. Worst case his contract expires next year. If he turns things around, then he probably can bring back a higher pick (2nd) plus something. As bad as his season is going, he has only scored one less goal than Lindholm. Who knows, maybe something clicks and he scores 30.
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Keep in mind that the Flames are also taking on Kuzmenko' contract at $5.5 million for an additional year, and Kuzmenko has been hot garbage this year. The cap consequences of the trade definitely came into play. Good on the Flame s for using that to their advantage though.
Lindholm has been garbage this season...he has one more goal playing on the top line
So I would argue that VAN benefitted more by moving Kuzmenko than by CGY retaining, and CGY benefitted more by NOT retaining, than they would have gotten for the retention.
There's also diminishing returns to retention in this case. The plausible upside to retention here would presumably have been to get one of Vancouver's top 2 prospects. However it appears they were basically off the table*, so there's no meaningful upside to the Flames retaining. Getting a guaranteed 3rd rather than a 4th and/or even a conditional 2nd wouldn't really move the needle imo.
* I'm guessing they were off the table but it's a reasonable assumption. If the Tanev involvement angle was true, it probably related to getting one of those two. But even then, you get a diminished return on Tanev because it would only be the prospect. Vancouver had already given away their 2024 1st and I would think giving away the 2025 1st as well would have been off the table. Gotta go elsewhere for Tanev since the Vancouver well is effectively dry.
Lindholm has been garbage this season...he has one more goal playing on the top line
I don't disagree. Lindholm didn't look all that special defensively either. Surprising as he was going into a contract year. You'd think he would have non-stop hustle.
Let us know the list when your analysis is complete.
That's the point. If you are trying to identify something that you believe leads to winning, it has to be in comparison to the control group, which in this case is teams that didn't win. You would also expect that the 8 teams that got to the 2nd round would share this characteristic more than the 24 that didn't.
Not simply in isolation.
Probably all of the last 17 Cup winners had an American player on their team, which does not prove that you need an American player on your team to win.
Would have the Flames picked up Kuzmenko had the Canucks put him on waivers? Would any other team pick up his contract if the Flames waived him.
Why wasn't there a team ready to take Monahan for free. At least he had the obvious excuse of playing injured for 2 years. That is much more fixable than unwillingness to play defense system that is showing spectacular results for the team. That is something that takes years to fix and is a whole team problem.
That is a guy they want to keep away from Coronato and Honzek.
But let's give the Canucks an A on the trade anyways lol.
You could argue it's because he knew his time with the Flames was elapsing and was just biding his time, but this guy is in a contract year and that's the quality of play he's bringing each night.
Not great. Does he turn it around? Probably some added production.. but it would have to be quite the dramatic turnaround in short order if the Canucks are thinking of 2022 Lindholm.
The guy was the most invisible I can remember him being in red. Even before he broke out when he first arrived, he was more noticeable on the ice in a positive way.
That's the point. If you are trying to identify something that you believe leads to winning, it has to be in comparison to the control group, which in this case is teams that didn't win. You would also expect that the 8 teams that got to the 2nd round would share this characteristic more than the 24 that didn't.
Not simply in isolation.
Probably all of the last 17 Cup winners had an American player on their team, which does not prove that you need an American player on your team to win.
I would argue the control group is ALL teams. And it's an easier calculation:
1) What percentage of teams have a right-shooting C?
2) What percentage of cup winners do? (76%)
3) Is there a statistical difference?
Would have the Flames picked up Kuzemko had the Canucks put him on waivers? Would any other team pick up his contract if the Flames waived him.
There is no chance Kuzmenko makes it through the waiver wire.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ricardodw
Why wasn't there a team ready to take Monahan for free. At least he had the obvious excuse of playing injured for 2 years.
Two reasons: The Flames were in a position where they HAD to move Monahan. The Canucks were in a position where they would LIKE to move Kuzmenko. But also, Monahan looked washed. Kuzmunko just looks low on confidence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ricardodw
That is much more fixable than unwillingness to play defense system that is showing spectacular results for the team. That is something that takes years to fix and is a whole team problem.
Kuzmenko's issue wasn't an unwillingness to play the defensive system. It was in the offensive zone that he was getting in trouble. He wasn't a hard forechecker. I think it's pretty easy to see that was not his game and he just had a hard time doing it effectively. He has defensive lapses, but as someone who watched Monahan from the lens of an opposing team fan: Monahan had a lot of defensive lapses too. Heck, I often said that Monahan was a winger masquerading as a center on this site.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ricardodw
The Canucks made the trade quick before the trade deadline in case Conroy checked around on what the market value of Kuzmenko.
I know you're tongue in cheek here, but the early move is just how Allvin and his boss do business.
