Hart, McLeod, Dube, Foote, Formenton charged with sexual assault

[dino7c]

He was on the 4th line because his play was terrible

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

I fully believe they had no clue about pending charges. Dube was the first player to leave his team and so it's is believable they didn't know.

But now they do know, and their weak statement disappoints me as a fan of the team. I expected better if them.

Pending charges or not, they knew he was on that team.

If they're remotely competent, they'd also know he was one of 8 players to not make a personal denial of involvement.

There was plenty of reason to know that landmines existed and to tread carefully. There was never really anything to gain here, but plenty of risk.

We only have to go back to last season and OK's initial absence. Minimal details shared, and it wasn't really an issue for anyone except a few dweebs on here.

It was just a really really really weird time to break the convention of minimal details

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Shazam

Man I swear most of you have never dealt with lawyers and the astounding things they write.

Hot tip: take a look at MBates post history.

[chedder]

Originally Posted by traptor

That's my point though.

Maybe they had no idea of Dubes involvement, maybe they thought he was having mental health issues for who knows whatever reason.


It still shows a massive amount of incompetence that they had no idea of the involvement of one of theirs players in one of the most high profile primal investigations in the history of the sport.

There's no way on earth that they had no idea that he was involved. All they're saying is they had no idea the arrests were imminent.

[Njord]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

I hate reading this thread now. 90% of the posts are lamenting about the exact wording of a PR statement or debating the merits of mental health (of the accused perpetrator I might add). Very little time is spent discussing the actual acts that occurred and what we can do about them. Not sure how a few well placed words can improve sexual assault numbers, but perhaps I underestimate the power of words.

No, sorry, I understand the power of words quite well, but actions matter a lot ####ing more to me. Whatever the Flames did or didn't know at the time of the statement is totally irrelevant. All that matters now is how they proceed in handling Dube now that these charges have been made public. I expect them to handle this like they handled Peters. Swiftly, and hopefully, with a strong sense of morality. I would expect nothing less from Conroy and his team.

I don't think we will ever see Dillon Dube in a Flames uniform ever again. If that happens, then you can rip the organization a new one, but I suspect you'll not have that opportunity.

Agree 100%

Imagine being sexually assaulted by a group of guys and people being upset by a PR statement instead

[fotze2]

Originally Posted by Njord

Agree 100%

Imagine being sexually assaulted by a group of guys and people being upset by a PR statement instead

Exactly, choose your one thing to be mad about. Jeez!

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Njord

Agree 100%

Imagine being sexually assaulted by a group of guys and people being upset by a PR statement instead

I mean, how much else can be said about the sexual assault besides how absolutely disgusting and disappointing it is?

You can be upset about many different things with this incident. Hockey culture, education, a delayed response by the police.

Why are we trying to prevent people from having a discussion on a discussion board?

[traptor]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

That's today's society though, people making a mountain out of a mole hill. Your average Joe Blow wants to make it a big deal and throw the team under the bus that's fine but I expect better from the dedicated fan base here.

I can see your love for the team through your unending defence of them.

I love it too. So much that I want it held to a higher standard then it has been. I'm getting tired of the mismanagement. There is fire after fire to put out lately.

I think its bad culture bled down from Murray and Bean.
Knowing people around CNRL and RCR it's funny how many similar complaints cross over from organization to organization regardless of industry.

Maybe the Oettinger curse is real.
Maybe there is nothing wrong, this is a great organization and I'm off to lunch.

[iggyloob12]

The statement is fresh; it's OK to be mad about how the team went about it and to vent on a fan board.

There will be a new wave of anger and disgust on Feb. 5 as more details come out. There's lots to be angry about!

[traptor]

Originally Posted by Njord

Agree 100%

Imagine being sexually assaulted by a group of guys and people being upset by a PR statement instead

It's okay to think gang rape is wrong and think the Flames made a PR mistake.

The two don't preclude each other...

[81MC]

Originally Posted by traptor

That's my point though.

Maybe they had no idea of Dubes involvement, maybe they thought he was having mental health issues for who knows whatever reason.


It still shows a massive amount of incompetence that they had no idea of the involvement of one of theirs players in one of the most high profile primal investigations in the history of the sport.

Pretty sure things don’t work this way though.

What would the flames have done? Made an incredibly risky assumption that would have opened them up to all sorts of legal and moral trouble were Dube legit just having a MH issue with nothing related to this? You don’t just get told about all parties of an active investigation, so they would have been acting on nothing but circumstances.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by traptor

It's okay to think gang rape is wrong and think the Flames made a PR mistake.

The two don't preclude each other...

Sure, but one is a serious ####ing crime, and the other is optics for a business.

Not sure how you weigh things out, but one of those matters a whole helluva lot more to me than the other. Stop creating false equivalencies.

[keenan87]

Have we determined how a low budget team (Senators) with turmoil in ownership after their owner died was able to determine if their player was involved in this incident?

However, Calgary, Philadelphia, and New Jersey were not?

It just doesn't make sense. How did Ottawa know right away and do the right thing - however, none of these other teams cared to investigate further? The NHL and hockey continues to disappoint.

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Sure, but one is a serious ####ing crime, and the other is optics for a business.

Not sure how you weigh things out, but one of those matters a whole helluva lot more to me than the other. Stop creating false equivalencies.

What Dube and the others did is reprehensible and disgusting and almost no one disagrees with that. So there isn’t much to discuss.

The Flames PR blunder has some shades of grey to it, so it fosters discussion.

They aren’t equally bad, the SA was many standard deviations worse. I also don’t think anyone discussing how the Flames have handled things thus far think they’re equivalent just because it’s the aspect they want to discuss currently.

[traptor]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Sure, but one is a serious ####ing crime, and the other is optics for a business.

Not sure how you weigh things out, but one of those matters a whole helluva lot more to me than the other. Stop creating false equivalencies.

Obviously.
What they are being prosecuted for is some of the most heinous crimes one can commit.

You're misusing false equivalencies. I drew no lines between the two. I actually said they were completely unrelated.

In fact it is you who brought them up together.

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by Shazam

Man I swear most of you have never dealt with lawyers and the astounding things they write.

You clearly have no idea who he is.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Okay, but again, the bulk of the discussion is about the nuance of wording in a PR statement in one of the biggest sexual assault cases in pro sports...maybe ever? 5 players being accused at once in any sport is a big ####ing deal. Why aren't we talking more about the events, pro sports/hockey culture, or solutions moving forward?

It's a waste of digital ink to keep discussing the Flames PR statement. I'm just hoping for a more substantive discussion of the real issues at the heart of all this.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

You clearly have no idea who he is.

That post in regard to who he quoted is pretty funny. He's one of the best posters on the board for how informative and intellectual they are.

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

You clearly have no idea who he is.

Yeah, thanks to Shazam for giving everyone a good chuckle in what otherwise is a very depressing thread.

[MacDaddy77]

Originally Posted by keenan87

Have we determined how a low budget team (Senators) with turmoil in ownership after their owner died was able to determine if their player was involved in this incident?

However, Calgary, Philadelphia, and New Jersey were not?

It just doesn't make sense. How did Ottawa know right away and do the right thing - however, none of these other teams cared to investigate further? The NHL and hockey continues to disappoint.

You’re speculating they didn’t sign him because of this and not just because of salary demands. Ottawa issued him a qualifying offer and were negotiating with him and couldn’t come to terms on a contract.

Seems more about $ than some social justice awareness by Ottawa