[PGT] Flames lose 4-3 to Blackhawks

[KootenayFlamesFan]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

We are headed straight for a worst case scenario unless this team commits to selling and trying again in 3 season.

They've already traded Toffoli and Zadorov. They will trade at least 2 more UFAs this season. They've already committed to selling off, there's more to come.

This game doesn't change anything.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

They've already traded Toffoli and Zadorov. They will trade at least 2 more UFAs this season. They've already committed to selling off, there's more to come.

This game doesn't change anything.

You're right, I'm being dramatic, but god damn if we aren't cruising for a finish outside the bottom 10.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

I don't know how management can watch the team and think "we have a chance".

They have to be full on delusional if they do. This team isn't even middling. They might be more fun to watch (who doesn't like high event hockey), but when you just look at fundamental hockey plays, quality of play, skill level, this team does not compare to ANY of the legit playoff teams.

This is a middling to bad team, who can play up to the competition but often play to their abilities, which isn't good.

How can anyone look at the UFAs and think they are guys a team NEEDS to have to be competitive. None of them move the needle in a good direction (Tanev moves it the most but he is on his last legs age wise).

Walk away and restart. It's just good business.

I dont get it either.

I saw it during the off-season. Like...'have a chance?'

At what? Making the playoffs? Outside chance maybe.

Anything else? Not a snowball's chance in hell.

And Treliving, like an idiot, saddled us with a crapload of Old players on big, long contracts.

None of our gears line up.

We've got an old goalie (who is occasionally good) but by the time people can be brought in to support him, he's going to be done. We've got too many older players on the roster, they can help the youth movement, but by the time they're ready these guys' careers are going to be done.

Its just a complete mess and the only solution right now is just to not make it worse.

Treliving wasnt a Wizard. He was 'The Wiz' and he should have been fired around 3 years ago before driving this team into the ground.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

I don't know how management can watch the team and think "we have a chance".

They have to be full on delusional if they do. This team isn't even middling. They might be more fun to watch (who doesn't like high event hockey), but when you just look at fundamental hockey plays, quality of play, skill level, this team does not compare to ANY of the legit playoff teams.

This is a middling to bad team, who can play up to the competition but often play to their abilities, which isn't good.

How can anyone look at the UFAs and think they are guys a team NEEDS to have to be competitive. None of them move the needle in a good direction (Tanev moves it the most but he is on his last legs age wise).

Walk away and restart. It's just good business.

No offence to you specifically but it's it pretty clear they don't?

- They moved their top goal scorer instead of resigning him.
- They moved their #5 blueliner and have had AHL players on the third pairing since.
- They talked about retention spots after the Zadorov trade.
- Conroy on 960 mentioned Iginla asking "how many picks is too many picks?"
- They halted contract negotiations with a UFA they were considering to sign.
- They are constantly in the rumour mill about their pending UFAs.

I honestly can't believe how Maloney just spewing rhetoric can make so many fans antsy.

They know the math.
They've been on a path for some time without pause.

I don't see this as all that much to worry about.

Now does the market bare what they're aiming for? That's the last thing left to wreck the average fan's day.

[Wastedyouth]

Originally Posted by Bingo

No offence to you specifically but it's it pretty clear they don't?

- They moved their top goal scorer instead of resigning him.
- They moved their #5 blueliner and have had AHL players on the third pairing since.
- They talked about retention spots after the Zadorov trade.
- Conroy on 960 mentioned Iginla asking "how many picks is too many picks?"
- They halted contract negotiations with a UFA they were considering to sign.
- They are constantly in the rumour mill about their pending UFAs.

I honestly can't believe how Maloney just spewing rhetoric can make so many fans antsy.

They know the math.
They've been on a path for some time without pause.

I don't see this as all that much to worry about.

Now does the market bare what they're aiming for? That's the last thing left to wreck the average fan's day.

I didn't even hear Maloney's interview.

It is more just ongoing PTSD of the ownership groups mentality of Playoffs or Bust.

Where Bust seems to be the continuing outcome.

I want to believe, at some point, that someone will be in charge that can make the hard decisions that I myself feel need to be made.

I have yet to truly see that from this team in last 20 years.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I have been fairly confident since the start of the season that the Flames would rather rebuld/retool/whatever you want to call it, especially when Conroy spoke about the youth movement. He is a GM that spent a considerable amount of time learning his craft with a focus on the scouting and development side of things. That's his forte, and that's why (among other reasons) I was genuinely happy that he was promoted to GM.


I look at this team as a team that is actually playing well for the most part. They have been fun to watch, they have mostly been playing as a unit line-to-line, and they have been entertaining. They just don't have enough talent, and it shows. You can't win by out-working every team every night. Chicago got the bounces tonight (those deflections - Vladar was good tonight, and definitely good enough to win!), but those bounces cost the Flames, the Flames didn't get enough bounces their own way, and they just don't have the talent to score enough goals to compensate.


This game changes nothing for me. Disappointed with the effort, but they still did out-work Chicago. Flames are rebuilding. That's what I expect. If they don't, then that's when I will be upset. For now, I am just enjoying the entertaining product (most nights) that this team is offering, and that's it.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

I have been fairly confident since the start of the season that the Flames would rather rebuld/retool/whatever you want to call it, especially when Conroy spoke about the youth movement. He is a GM that spent a considerable amount of time learning his craft with a focus on the scouting and development side of things. That's his forte, and that's why (among other reasons) I was genuinely happy that he was promoted to GM.


I look at this team as a team that is actually playing well for the most part. They have been fun to watch, they have mostly been playing as a unit line-to-line, and they have been entertaining. They just don't have enough talent, and it shows. You can't win by out-working every team every night. Chicago got the bounces tonight (those deflections - Vladar was good tonight, and definitely good enough to win!), but those bounces cost the Flames, the Flames didn't get enough bounces their own way, and they just don't have the talent to score enough goals to compensate.


This game changes nothing for me. Disappointed with the effort, but they still did out-work Chicago. Flames are rebuilding. That's what I expect. If they don't, then that's when I will be upset. For now, I am just enjoying the entertaining product (most nights) that this team is offering, and that's it.

Yes, you can't expect pro hockey players to not try and win, for a number of reasons. At the same time, you can't remove Toffoli and Zadorov, play two rookies in the top 6, plus an AHL level 3rd D pairing and expect not to lose a bunch of games, even to poorer teams sometimes. Especially when you lack elite scoring to make up for those factors.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Yes, you can't expect pro hockey players to not try and win, for a number of reasons. At the same time, you can't remove Toffoli and Zadorov, play two rookies in the top 6, plus an AHL level 3rd D pairing and expect not to lose a bunch of games, even to poorer teams sometimes. Especially when you lack elite scoring to make up for those factors.

well, the record is better since he left

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by nieuwy-89

Oilers media tweeting about the Flames losing to a roster that dressed 11 forwards with a total cap hit of $13.9m.

Sigh.

Always smart to throw stones right before you face said $13.9M team.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by dino7c

well, the record is better since he left

You are so fixated on this.

Did you not like Zadorov when he was here?

You remove a fifth defenseman and replace him with a 7 you're not as good. Markstrom's hot streak hides a lot.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Zadorov is better than Gilbert and much better than Osterle.

That being said, he's also not the difference between the Flames sitting in a playoff spot right now and being on the outside looking in after losing to two poor opponents.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Bingo

You are so fixated on this.

Did you not like Zadorov when he was here?

You remove a fifth defenseman and replace him with a 7 you're not as good. Markstrom's hot streak hides a lot.

why are you so fixated on proving me wrong

as of today the Flames have a better record this season without Zadorov
you can say its Markstom or whoever fine but the record is the record. Vladar is .500 so I don't see how its all Markstom.

Gilbert was playing pretty well TBH, very comparable to Zadorov. Not as flashy but solid and improving, same number of goals


too bad he got hurt

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

Zadorov is better than Gilbert and much better than Osterle.

That being said, he's also not the difference between the Flames sitting in a playoff spot right now and being on the outside looking in after losing to two poor opponents.

Flyers are 20-13

1-1 against them isn't a bad record

[Paulie Walnuts]

I don't think management is going to announce that we are trading everyone.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Flyers are still coming out of their own rebuild.

You talk to their people and they're well aware that they aren't there yet. They had a big streak earlier in the season no one expected that's inflating their current record.

They're far from the worst team out there though, for sure. Plenty of talent up front.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

Zadorov is better than Gilbert and much better than Osterle.

That being said, he's also not the difference between the Flames sitting in a playoff spot right now and being on the outside looking in after losing to two poor opponents.

The Flames are 6-4-0 in their last ten games with the league's 4th best goaltending in that time period.

Flames goaltenders have prevented 8.5 more goals than expected in the ten games.

They have the 13th worst (19th best) xGA in that time period.

Not disagreeing with you, really ... Markstrom has been the difference but the team is pretty leaky defensively, which I'm sure Zadorov's departure has affected.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

I don't think management is going to announce that we are trading everyone.

yeah people always get bent outta shape about these interviews...like we want them to come out and say

"alright we are desperate to move all these guys"

It was also the 1st intermission, the Flames should have won the game and been tied for a playoff spot

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

I don't think management is going to announce that we are trading everyone.

Or that the personnel aren't any good.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by dino7c

why are you so fixated on proving me wrong

as of today the Flames have a better record this season without Zadorov
you can say its Markstom or whoever fine but the record is the record. Vladar is .500 so I don't see how its all Markstom.

Gilbert was playing pretty well TBH, very comparable to Zadorov. Not as flashy but solid and improving, same number of goals


too bad he got hurt

I can't help myself.

Your take is just so strange I feel compelled to respond to it!

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

I don't think management is going to announce that we are trading everyone.

"We wish we could keep every one if there weren't cap constraints"

Is pretty damning, though. When your front office is falling in love with mediocrity (which is what this group has brought over half a season) and admits as much, that should set off alarms.

No wonder this team has been middling for decades. It can't even see the problem.