Alberta Politics & Government Thread 3.0

[puffnstuff]

Have these sick kids and ICU patients seen their primary naturopath yet?

It might just be their chakras out of alignment, or maybe having a tarot card reading will fix em right up

[Whynotnow]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Dude, they are Shamans. They can cure anything. Stupid NDP wasted tax dollars on a new Cancer Centre when we could have saved a lot of money by setting up witch doctor schools instead.

I am no fan of the UCP and their handling of the health care system or them touting naturopaths as a substitute.

However, my wife has a lengthy chronic health issue that traditional medicine has done little to nothing to help her with. So she sees a naturopath and takes supplements. Do I question some of it? Maybe, but some of it does seem to help, so there is a place for natural supplement to western health that can aid in some cases.

Are there absolute quacks out there in this field. Yup, but I can’t fully discount all of it.

[jammies]

Some conditions cannot be fixed or ameliorated by medicine - yet. That doesn't mean that there is a gap to be filled by alternate methods not based in reality, though.

Belief is a drug, these naturopaths, chiropractors and other quacks prescribe it indiscriminately. Like any drug, it's misuse makes life worse, not better. Delusion isn't healing.

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by jammies

Some conditions cannot be fixed or ameliorated by medicine - yet. That doesn't mean that there is a gap to be filled by alternate methods not based in reality, though.

Belief is a drug, these naturopaths, chiropractors and other quacks prescribe it indiscriminately. Like any drug, it's misuse makes life worse, not better. Delusion isn't healing.

I mentioned a while back that we also had a really good experience with a naturopath. My kid was getting prescribed more and more medication and things were getting worse, to the point of 911 calls.

Saw a naturopath and he is completely off all medications. He wasn’t prescribed anything by the naturopath, just some temporary changes in diet.

Today, if someone is sick, a doctor is the person we go see, but I would not discount a naturopath if things aren’t working. I would be cautious when getting medication prescribed though (and you never know if you are getting a good one or a bad one maybe).

Anyways, if has changed one kids life for the better, when getting more and more medication prescribed was not working (actually making it worse).

[Fuzz]

A nutritionist and allergist would be the one to see for that, though. The problem is our medical system is under-resourced, so people don't get referred to the experts they need to see, and seek out alternatives. Sometimes they hit on success. That doesn't mean it's the right way for our system to operate.

[GordonBlue]

Originally Posted by Doctorfever

I mentioned a while back that we also had a really good experience with a naturopath. My kid was getting prescribed more and more medication and things were getting worse, to the point of 911 calls.

Saw a naturopath and he is completely off all medications. He wasn’t prescribed anything by the naturopath, just some temporary changes in diet.

Today, if someone is sick, a doctor is the person we go see, but I would not discount a naturopath if things aren’t working. I would be cautious when getting medication prescribed though (and you never know if you are getting a good one or a bad one maybe).

Anyways, if has changed one kids life for the better, when getting more and more medication prescribed was not working (actually making it worse).

that's good you've had a positive experience with your kid.
It's also good it's a choice you were able to make as a private citizen.

I do have issue with Naturopaths being considered as primary care providers and I would be against their costs being covered by Alberta Health Care.

Also, how many Naturopathic physicians attend an accredited 4 year graduate level school and learn how to combine traditional western medical care with the complementary therapies, and how many are "traditional naturopaths" who are one step above a baby who will put anything in their mouth?

UCP says it would be another tool in the toolbox.
In general a naturopath as a tool would be a butter knife used as a last resort when you can't find a flathead screwdriver.

next step for the UCP is promoting Homeopathy.

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

A nutritionist and allergist would be the one to see for that, though. The problem is our medical system is under-resourced, so people don't get referred to the experts they need to see, and seek out alternatives. Sometimes they hit on success. That doesn't mean it's the right way for our system to operate.

I don’t disagree. Unfortunately, there wasn’t any referrals made at all. Only more medication on top of medication.

I don’t follow along too closely with the whole AHS is broken and needs to be fixed thing. I am sure there are many things that need improvement.

Can you point to another province in this country that we should be trying to copy from? I understand that hate for how things are going here, but I wonder how we are doing compared to other provinces (I haven’t looked or attempted to look).

[Faust]

The Breakdown

“AHS said it was looking to hire influencers for a campaign called Plan Your Health 2024.

It wanted influencers to educate people about how to treat their child at home rather than the emergency room, fitness, quitting smoking and lung cancer screening, as well as Health Link 811.”

https://x.com/thebreakdownab/status/...202295851?s=61

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Doctorfever

I don’t disagree. Unfortunately, there wasn’t any referrals made at all. Only more medication on top of medication.

I don’t follow along too closely with the whole AHS is broken and needs to be fixed thing. I am sure there are many things that need improvement.

Can you point to another province in this country that we should be trying to copy from? I understand that hate for how things are going here, but I wonder how we are doing compared to other provinces (I haven’t looked or attempted to look).

I don't know what other provinces are doing. I'm not sure that matters. We live here, with the Alberta Advantage, where we have vast resource revenues, so much that no government in Alberta has deemed necessary a PST to pay for our needs. This government, and ones before, have seen fit to waste billions on the O&G sector(Keystone XL as one example) while denigrating our healthcare workers and doing nothing in their power to reduce stresses on their employment. So much so that many are leaving(BTimbit's anecdotes can speak to that) because who want to work for the UCP(now that it is the UCP and not AHS)?

Frankly, there is no excuse Alberta can't solve these problems given our access to financial resources and I'm pretty tired of the lame excuse that the money isn't there, that we need to make tough decisions, cuts etc. None of these are new problems, I've dealt with hallway medicine 13 years ago. ####ing fix it already. We should have the best medical system in North America. The excuses are pathetic. But this is what Albertans keep voting for, so naturopaths and chiropractors it is. Yet I'm told they aren't morons.
####ing hell.

[Doctorfever]

You really don’t think it matters what / how other provinces are doing? To me, it seems like the easiest way to compare our system, and maybe look at ways other provinces are doing things better (and model those methods). Also look at ways other provinces are struggling and try not making the same mistakes.

[Ozy_Flame]

Originally Posted by Doctorfever

You really don’t think it matters what / how other provinces are doing? To me, it seems like the easiest way to compare our system, and maybe look at ways other provinces are doing things better (and model those methods). Also look at ways other provinces are struggling and try not making the same mistakes.

Other provinces don't have a multi-billion dollar surplus.

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

Other provinces don't have a multi-billion dollar surplus.

All the more reason to look at how they are spending their limited funds.

[chedder]

Nm. Fixed below

[you&me]

Originally Posted by Doctorfever

All the more reason to look at how they are spending their limited funds.

Why should we - with all that extra money - be looking to emulate what provinces with "limited funds" are doing?

The province with the financial capacity to properly fund health care - us - should be leading by example.

[Ozy_Flame]

Alberta is going through the same struggles as other provinces in terms of wait times, family physician shortages, critical care access, etc. Unless you're the deepest of UCP sycophants, you don't think AHS has been looking at other provinces for decades already? I'm sure these provinces are intimately aware of the other's problems, particularly when it comes to hiring and retention when competing for limited resources.

The difference is, Alberta has the means to make significant improvements to the public healthcare system, but instead of actually listening to front-line staff, physicians and HCWs, they think creating new bureaucracies is going to solve the issue. They also think naturopathy and protection of personal freedoms (and giving time and money to both) are more important than actual services.

This isn't complicated. Funds go a long way to solving issues. And Alberta has funds.

Maybe Smith needs to chat with more people like Dr. Markland, Dr. Gasperowicz and Dr. Mithani than she does with people like Preston Manning, Adrianna Lagrange and Rob Roth.

Look at this, even from yesterday:

Global News: Alberta Medical Association president warns of long waits, very sick kids at hospitals

Parks wants people who are sick to still come to Alberta emergency rooms but warns there will be long wait times.

“When you see those average waits of 12 hours, that can mean people are waiting 20 hours or more because those are just averages,” he said. “Our emergency departments are overflowing with sick patients.

“Our hospitals are overflowing at 150 per cent capacity and our ICU capacity is almost completely full across the province, so it’s a very real struggle and challenge right now.”

But yes, changing managers is the problem.

[chedder]

Originally Posted by Doctorfever

I don’t disagree. Unfortunately, there wasn’t any referrals made at all. Only more medication on top of medication.

Sounds like you had a bad doctor. Was it a family doctor or a specialist? Would you mind disclosing the medical condition for context?

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by you&me

Why should we - with all that extra money - be looking to emulate what provinces with "limited funds" are doing?

The province with the financial capacity to properly fund health care - us - should be leading by example.

Is this satire?

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by chedder

Sounds like you had a bad doctor. Was it a family doctor or a specialist? Would you mind disclosing the medical condition for context?

Being 100 percent honest, my wife handled the entire thing. I know the kid did see a specialist during at least one of his lengthy hospital stays.
It was respiratory issues.

[Doctorfever]

Ok, give me some slack here because this is a very uneducated take, with no research done.

If Alberta simply throws more money at a problem and it doesn’t solve the problem, what have we accomplished? Basically just taken resources from other provinces and made their situations worse?

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

A nutritionist and allergist would be the one to see for that, though. The problem is our medical system is under-resourced, so people don't get referred to the experts they need to see, and seek out alternatives. Sometimes they hit on success. That doesn't mean it's the right way for our system to operate.

Registered Dietician. That is the legally protected term in Canada.

Registered Dietician is to Nutritionist as Dentist is to Toothiologist.