[News] LeBrun/Dreger - Flames open for Business

[2ArmBands]

Originally Posted by Cycling76er

So where would a rebuild leave us with Zary, Coronato, Pelletier, and Wolf? Don't rebuilds take years? Wouldn't these players just want to bounce as soon as they can if we're just going to be #### ass bad for a large chunk of their careers?

Also, who was the last team to do a crazy, full on firesale and how long did it take to start being competetive again?

The fact that many rebuilds and full on fire sales don’t work seems to really elude some around here. It’s a lot more difficult than shed everybody and “let the kids play”

[calf]

The way the kids are playing, this isn't a rebuild, it's a takeover.

A Youth D'etat

[howard_the_duck]

Originally Posted by 2ArmBands

The fact that many rebuilds and full on fire sales don’t work seems to really elude some around here. It’s a lot more difficult than shed everybody and “let the kids play”

Sure, but we’ve seen the alternative. No more of this, please.

Kids play is just the start. In fact, it’s unlikely the next ‘core’ is in the organization at this point.

We’ve got a lot of asset accumulation to do to get this thing properly jumpstarted. It’s a luxury to have so many pending UFAs while the team is going in this direction.

[kobasew19]

I wouldn’t see it as a rebuild but more of a retool.

[2ArmBands]

Originally Posted by howard_the_duck

Sure, but we’ve seen the alternative. No more of this, please.

Kids play is just the start. In fact, it’s unlikely the next ‘core’ is in the organization at this point.

We’ve got a lot of asset accumulation to do to get this thing properly jumpstarted. It’s a luxury to have so many pending UFAs while the team is going in this direction.

I agree with you. I have no issues moving out anyone that’s a UFA or guys that don’t want to be here. I just think there needs to be a healthy line. The organization still needs to value SOME veterans and culture fits. Maintaining or building a positive environment for the youth movement is really important.

Many on here would liquidate the entire roster if they could.

[NewFan]

I'm sure some veteran players will come as cap dump who will help young guys a couple years.

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by howard_the_duck

Sure, but we’ve seen the alternative. No more of this, please.

We haven't.

The alternative would be deciding to move on from certain players but not completely tear it down. Or a retool where instead of replacing everyone traded with other veterans they let the younger players from the Wranglers who are ready and other young NHL players that they acquire take those spots.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I am sorry I do not know how to imbed tweets. It is a screen grab of the Athletic article.

https://x.com/cofredcentral/status/1...Id-kuUoekIUv4A

As a team in selling mode, it's nice to be the belle of the ball.

Let the bidding begin.

[Spurs]

Originally Posted by 2ArmBands

The fact that many rebuilds and full on fire sales don’t work seems to really elude some around here. It’s a lot more difficult than shed everybody and “let the kids play”

Retools work even less and the ones that people would consider to be successes likely start with a lot more pieces than what we have. I think everyone would love to be kind of bad not terrible for2 years then compete for a Cup rather than 5 years of terrible play before even moving to start to contend, but the likelihood of that is basically zero with insane luck.

There is no sure fire way to success which is why teams do things different and get success in different ways. The one thing that every successful team has is elite players and the best, not only and not sure fire way but clearly the best way, way to get those players is top 3 draft picks.

The reality is a retool might not even be on the table we could easily so far down the road that a retool would just get us to 10th not even to the teams desired 8th.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Dreger mentioned Kadri as a player who wouldn’t want to be part of a rebuild.

Is he going to quit again like he did on Sutter last year?

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Inferno

We haven't.

The alternative would be deciding to move on from certain players but not completely tear it down. Or a retool where instead of replacing everyone traded with other veterans they let the younger players from the Wranglers who are ready and other young NHL players that they acquire take those spots.

The Flames don’t really have a scaffold to re-tool around. They’ll need a second pairing on defense, a top 6 RW or two, and most importantly a #1 centre. They don’t have enough in the pipeline to fill that many holes.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

The amount of time we spend debating a completely subjective topic is actually quite funny. Rebuild vs Re-tool (re-build vs. Retool) is basically us debating a marketing slogan.

In the context we are talking, these concepts are pretty fluid. Where does a re-tool turn into a rebuild? What pushes it from one to another. Im guessing for every fan it’s different. I think we should worry less about what the GM or the press (or our owners) call it, and just see what comes from the moves. Rebuild or retool pretty major changes are coming, and it’s going to be exciting.

[Spurs]

What is this retool going to be based around?

Mediocre vets and ok-ish prospects? How is that getting us to anything other than the first round exits we have had the past 15-20 years.

[Hackey]

The Flames don't have a single elite player. A re-tool would be almost as dumb as their recent strategy of trying to stay competitive.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by Tbull8

A deal around Kadri for Girard and a pick could work well for both sides

I thought of Kadri and Vladar for Girard and Colton

[memphusk]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Is he going to quit again like he did on Sutter last year?

Exactly. He made his bed. Now let him lie. Maybe he should of thought about that before he gave up.

[Inferno]

Originally Posted by Bonded

The Flames don’t really have a scaffold to re-tool around. They’ll need a second pairing on defense, a top 6 RW or two, and most importantly a #1 centre. They don’t have enough in the pipeline to fill that many holes.

That's why I said "and other young NHL players that they acquire".

They might not be able to get everything they need but blowing it up and rebuilding doesn't guarantee that either.

My point is though we haven't seen the alternative yet other than sticking with the same team which obviously isn't going to work.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Need more tools for a rebuild.

[DoubleK]

Originally Posted by Bonded

They’ll need a second pairing on defense

The Flames haven't had a legit top pairing since Gio and Brodie left. And absolutely zilch in the pipeline. OK may have been a candidate for the top pairing, but that's about it.

The six they run with are serviceable, no question, but you can't consider any of the pairs to be a legit top pairing.

[N-E-B]

Call me crazy but I think if the Flames play their cards right they can have this ship turned around in 3-4 years.

They have Zary, Pelletier, Pospisil, Coronato, and hopefully Honzek in the pipeline already. They also have a couple promising young defenseman in Solovoyov and Poirier.

They also have guys that, while they aren’t kids, aren’t old in Dube, Mangiapane, and Andersson who can stick around as mentors for the young kids.

They also have arguably the best goalie prospect in the world in Wolf.

They have a solid base for a solid supporting cast. If the Flames can bottom out and draft in the top 3-5 the next 2-3 years and draft some elite talent I think they’re in good shape. They desperately need elite talent, but otherwise I think they’re tracking okay.

Draft 2 high end centres and an elite defenseman and I think this ship gets turned around quickly.