What to do with Huberdeau?

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

He is holding everyone else back? Relax a little. Other players can take blame for their own play?

Is he the one causing Lindholm and Backlund to shoot pucks into the corner on breakaways?

Mangiapane to miss the net when set up for a open net, or Lindholm to pass the puck starring down a open net?

Holding people back does not mean he's responsible for 100% of their play. That really shouldn't have to be explained to you.

He does impact the ability of his linemates to play their best and takes up ice time that other guys more in form can have. He also limits the coaches ability to roll multiple effective line combos in succession like they did in the 3rd last night.
So yes, he's holding people back.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

Holding people back does not mean he's responsible for 100% of their play. That really shouldn't have to be explained to you.

He does impact the ability of his linemates to play their best and takes up ice time that other guys more in form can have. He also limits the coaches ability to roll multiple effective line combos in succession like they did in the 3rd last night.
So yes, he's holding people back.

The icetime looks to evenly given out, if they want to give more to the Backlund go ahead.

But he really isn't holding back his linemates. Lindholm has been ass himself, so maybe hes the one holding back the line?

They put him with Kadri and Dube, and he got blamed for the -3 they all add when you go back and watch Dube throw up easy passes to Detroit.

He is part of the problem, but its a bigger issue than just Huberdeau.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

He is also the reason guys like Lindholm and Mangiapane aren't getting more chances and more time in the offensive zone when they are on the ice with Huberdeau. Every player is going to flub occasional scoring chances, but Huberdeau kills plays and momentum with such frequency, it holds them back.

Even if you aren't buying that, it is undeniable that his cap hit is holding the team back and looks like it is going to for the better part of the next decade.

Chemistry matters though. It was only a week or so ago that Kadri was in the same boat. His new line has made him look much closer to what we expected when we got him. He might even play up to the value of his contract. That wasn't what anyone was saying a week ago.

Lindholm and Huberdeau just don't work together. I've been saying for months we need to keep Lindholm but if they don't click, we might need to sell Lindholm and get someone else on Huberdeau's line.

I still doubt Huberdeau is going to be this bad for the rest of his career though.

[manwiches]

He has all the skill in the world, just needs to get out of his own way.

I actually think he needs to sit down with a mental coach. There are people out there who specifically help with what I believe he is going through.

Not quite the same, but I've been day trading for 4-5 years. I was inconsistent and didn't trust my own abilities for a long time, even though I knew deep down I had the ability to be successful. What helped me was investing in a mental game course, and learning to get out of my own way. I still have days where I don't feel it, but I've developed the tools to identify it right away and deal with it. Instead of me worrying about the next play, I just let the play come to me now.

Anyways, just my 2 cents.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by manwiches

He has all the skill in the world, just needs to get out of his own way.

I actually think he needs to sit down with a mental coach. There are people out there who specifically help with what I believe he is going through.

Not quite the same, but I've been day trading for 4-5 years. I was inconsistent and didn't trust my own abilities for a long time, even though I knew deep down I had the ability to be successful. What helped me was investing in a mental game course, and learning to get out of my own way. I still have days where I don't feel it, but I've developed the tools to identify it right away and deal with it. Instead of me worrying about the next play, I just let the play come to me now.

Anyways, just my 2 cents.

Pretty sure he has already been seeing a sports psychologist

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

He is holding everyone else back? Relax a little. Other players can take blame for their own play?

Is he the one causing Lindholm and Backlund to shoot pucks into the corner on breakaways?

Mangiapane to miss the net when set up for a open net, or Lindholm to pass the puck starring down a open net?

From the comments it doesn't appear that people are coming down on Huberdeau; But rather they are just making observations about how his stuggles are affecting the team. I've often wondered if maybe he's just not connecting well within the system and style of play. There may be other reasons too, It might be mental.

I don't think some of these posters are hating.on Huberdeau, even when they discuss potential trades. We all agree Huberdeau is not playing well.

[DazzlinDino]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

The icetime looks to evenly given out, if they want to give more to the Backlund go ahead.

But he really isn't holding back his linemates. Lindholm has been ass himself, so maybe hes the one holding back the line?

They put him with Kadri and Dube, and he got blamed for the -3 they all add when you go back and watch Dube throw up easy passes to Detroit.

He is part of the problem, but its a bigger issue than just Huberdeau.

I think the bolted is an interesting observation. I would wager that Huberdeau gets sat because thats the guy the organization wants to support. They are rooting for the guy but they had to do something to try and get him going. Is he holding other player's back? Probably. Lindholm hasn't played well either but some people have pointed that out.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Its not water carrying, when you blame him for everything its a bit ridiculous. Its not like hes stopping those guys from scoring, that is what holding everyong back means.

The blame Huberdeau and Kadri for everything is getting over the top ridiculous.

First you get a group who needs to jump in and blame him and Kadri for Sutter getting fired when thats 100% not sure and been confirmed, yet they trot that out every single game thread.

Now hes holding everyone back?

He sucks right now no doubt about it, but you can clearly see a guy is cares and is trying but his confidence is gone he has none zero.

Its not a snap of the finger and its back type of thing, it is going to take time. Yeah it sucks to watch but what are you going to do? Johnny Gaudreau was equally as frustrating, Matthew Tkachuk was equally as frustrating, people called Iginla Invisginla.

Star players go through ruts like this, doesn't make him a bum like some make him out to be.

I am not in the game threads so I can’t comment on everyone blaming them for everything. We can see how quickly the winds can change with some inspired play and we have seen that from Kadri over the past few games. Huberdeau makes $3.5M more than Kadri who is the second highest paid member of the team. He is paid to be the offensive catalyst of this team and he is anything but that.

I don’t think Gaudreau or Tkachuk ever reached this level of frustration with the fans. Both had substandard seasons but both always were over 0.5ppg where Huberdeau is hovering. A lot of blame went to Sutter for Huby’s play from the fans to the media and he is showing that is not the case. I have no doubt the guy cares and I commend the way he has carried himself despite all the scrutiny but he has quickly become the worst contract in the entire league and no doubt will frustrate the fanbase. As the $84M man he is going to have a much higher standard that fans expect.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

The icetime looks to evenly given out, if they want to give more to the Backlund go ahead.

But he really isn't holding back his linemates. Lindholm has been ass himself, so maybe hes the one holding back the line?

They put him with Kadri and Dube, and he got blamed for the -3 they all add when you go back and watch Dube throw up easy passes to Detroit.

He is part of the problem, but its a bigger issue than just Huberdeau.

This is beyond minor play adjustments on the ice. The Huberdeau situation is literally the biggest issue facing the franchise right now. There is no papering over the cracks.
You mentioned guys like Gaudreau, Tkachuck and Iginla struggling at times. Yes, that's called a slump, all players go through slumps -- but that's not what's happening with Huberdeau, it's not comparable at all. At no point did those guys look like they should literally be demoted to the AHL, which Huberdeau has looked like this season, which was supposed to be a bounce back season. We aren't talking about a guy whose playing mediocre -- we're talking about the highest paid guy in franchise history who doesn't look like he's fit to play in the league right now. You've got a nearly 100 game sample size with him as a Flame, and he hasn't done anything of note. He is holding the team back on the ice, and he is holding the franchise back with that massive contract. You don't pay a guy $10.5 x 8 years to be a net negative.

If you're thinking this is just some normal and temporary blip in performance, you're basically reading the entire situation wrong.

[united]

From Corey Sznajder's game tracking data. Caution on low 2023-24 sample but not trending good early:

2021-22 FLA 411 minutes tracked
2022-23 CGY 286 minutes tracked
2023-24 CGY 43 minutes tracked

Scoring chance contributions/60 (shots and passes leading to shots)
2021-22: 11.4
2022-23: 6.7
2023-24: 4.2

Rush chance contributions/60
2021-22: 13.3
2022-23: 10.7
2023-24: 4.2

Cycle and forecheck chance contributions/60
2021-22: 14.6
2022-23: 11.5
2023-24: 5.6

One-timer assists/60
2021-22: 2.3
2022-23: 1.7
2023-24: 0.0

Zone entries with control/60
2021-22: 11.7
2022-23: 9.4
2023-24: 7.0

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Igottago

This is beyond minor play adjustments on the ice. The Huberdeau situation is literally the biggest issue facing the franchise right now. There is no papering over the cracks.
You mentioned guys like Gaudreau, Tkachuck and Iginla struggling at times. Yes, that's called a slump, all players go through slumps -- but that's not what's happening with Huberdeau, it's not comparable at all. At no point did those guys look like they should literally be demoted to the AHL, which Huberdeau has looked like this season, which was supposed to be a bounce back season. We aren't talking about a guy whose playing mediocre -- we're talking about the highest paid guy in franchise history who doesn't look like he's fit to play in the league right now. You've got a nearly 100 game sample size with him as a Flame, and he hasn't done anything of note. He is holding the team back on the ice, and he is holding the franchise back with that massive contract. You don't pay a guy $10.5 x 8 years to be a net negative.

If you're thinking this is just some normal and temporary blip in performance, you're basically reading the entire situation wrong.

Most of what you say is true but he is actually outscoring Gaudreau who has been benched twice this season but in a small US market with little fanfare.

Sometimes the fit just isn't right.

Our "play driving" Gaudreau has ONE EN goal this season

[sss1]

The guy will never find his previous point totals. This has got to be the bottom for him but I have no idea how he's going to work out here and at what capacity he will contribute when he is at his Calgary Flames 'best'. It's been 1.5 off seasons, 90+ games, and 2 coaches and there are no signals that he's going to turn it around. Almost like he is getting worse over time.

He is trending towards 40 points now. $10.5 million.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Most of what you say is true but he is actually outscoring Gaudreau who has been benched twice this season but in a small US market with little fanfare.

Sometimes the fit just isn't right.

Our "play driving" Gaudreau has ONE EN goal this season

Columbus is in the exact same situation. For whatever reason Gaudreau and Laine have not clicked. Gaudreau has good players to play with but seems to play with guys like Jenner alot. Just not the type of guy I see Johnny playing with.

Huberdeau has played well with Backlund, once again not a guy I want to pair Huberdeau with. Different roles.

IMO the Lindholm for Johnson trade idea might be a good one. Lindholm has clicked with Johnny in the past and they may be able to re-sign him.

Johnson has high end speed and has been sent to the AHL after a good rookie year. It could be the chemistry shake up both teams need and it's the re-tool type deal we should make that doesn't just close the door on this season. Cap wise it's a great move for the Flames.#

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by dino7c

...Gaudreau who has been benched twice this season...

Twice? When was the first time he was benched this season? I haven't seen that mentioned anywhere.

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Most of what you say is true but he is actually outscoring Gaudreau who has been benched twice this season but in a small US market with little fanfare.

Sometimes the fit just isn't right.

Our "play driving" Gaudreau has ONE EN goal this season

Huberdeau was benched for a portion part of the St. Louis game as well. He went a long time without getting an even strength shift.

[Teroy]

I have no expertise of how Huberdeau played before coming here. I have no idea how his line mates contributed to his success. All I can say is that after viewing his play since arriving, I don't see the skill and leadership expected from a 10.5 million dollar player. I don't even see spurts of super stardom. Any thoughts that he will turn it around are wishful thinking. If there was any chance of moving him, even if it required retaining significant salary, I'd do it. To waste another season hoping for a miracle is just that, "a waste of time".

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by FanIn80

Twice? When was the first time he was benched this season? I haven't seen that mentioned anywhere.

Kinda my point, it's not front page news there

It was in the first couple games, I only know because I watched it, he played one shift in the entire period

he was also benched and called out by his coach last season for cheating the game

[Burning Beard]

Not once have I seen a play from Huberdeau that made me think he was a star player in 90ish games. That's a big problem. I just don't see how there are any excuses left for him from people. I get liking the guy and he seems nice and all but as soon as he was benched last night the team started looking good and rallied to win the game. He really seems to be dragging down whomever they play him with.

[CroCop]

Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction

Huberdeau was benched for a portion part of the St. Louis game as well. He went a long time without getting an even strength shift.

He was also left out as extra attacker in favour of Zary in dying minutes of Dallas game down a goal.

[FanIn80]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Kinda my point, it's not front page news there

It was in the first couple games, I only know because I watched it, he played one shift in the entire period

he was also benched and called out by his coach last season for cheating the game

So he was benched for half a period on Monday, and it was front-page news all over the hockey world... but you saw him play a game where he was benched for an entire period (minus one shift), and nobody's said a word about it?

Was it a preseason game?