[Rumour] Francis: All contract talks on hold for Flames

[Matty81]

I'm not all that worried about the bigger longer term deals in the next couple of years because we are going to need money to get to the cap floor with it going up so much, flames have about 40 mil committed next year. Sucks more for the players than it does for the flames.

Acknowledging Francis seems to guess at stuff and claim it is fact in the past...

If this is true my main concern is how atrocious our blueline will be next year and the long term outlook. Andersson, Weegar and a bunch of plugs and B and C prospects right now moving forward. It's almost an Oiler level back end and it takes half a decade or more to build a home grown strong blueline - the club has a big deficit at that position from a prospect perspective IMP.

Letting Valimaki walk we're left hoping one of the mid/late rounders like Poirier, Solovyov or Morin pan out to fill one of the four empty spots long run and will clearly need to bring back a good young blueline prospect in any Hanifin deal

[dino7c]

Flames need to play an all out attack

SJ fooled teams reporters into thinking EK was a good player this way. Lets get those point totals up

[D as in David]

Originally Posted by kukkudo

Woody gets fired and they hire Q to save the season.

Wipe your phones clean, Oilers!

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Matty81

I'm not all that worried about the bigger longer term deals in the next couple of years because we are going to need money to get to the cap floor with it going up so much, flames have about 40 mil committed next year. Sucks more for the players than it does for the flames.

Acknowledging Francis seems to guess at stuff and claim it is fact in the past...

If this is true my main concern is how atrocious our blueline will be next year and the long term outlook. Andersson, Weegar and a bunch of plugs and B and C prospects right now moving forward. It's almost an Oiler level back end and it takes half a decade or more to build a home grown strong blueline and the club has a big deficit at that position from a prospect perspective IMP.

Letting Valimaki walk we're left hoping one of the mid/late rounders like Poirier, Solovyov or Morin pan out to fill one of the four empty spots long run and will clearly need to bring back a good young blueline prospect in any Hanifin deal

You may notice now that his team is not trying to lose he isn't playing nearly as much or having nearly as much impact

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Flames need to play an all out attack

SJ fooled teams reporters into thinking EK was a good player this way. Lets get those point totals up

They have been in all out attack this year, that is what Savard is bringing to the table, offensive strategy.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Flames Fan, Ph.D.

Man people sure see what they want to see.

Things not going the way I want: Conroy doesn't have the vision.

Things going more the way I want: It wasn't Conroy because... because... it just wasn't.

"Things going more the way I want" what does that even mean? Infact, your entire post makes no sense when I have said nothing even close to anything you are suggesting.

Maybe try formulating your own opinion if you're going to jump into the discussion instead of some lame attempt to start an argument about "seeing what I want to see".

It's hardly a hot take to suggest Murray Edwards is sticking his fingers in the GM pie.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

They have been in all out attack this year, that is what Savard is bringing to the table, offensive strategy.

nah they are still holding back and not taking many risks

[Elkyiv]

I would love to see the Flames set the record for most trades in a season. Look at the 98-99 Flyers and try to beat that.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by dino7c

You may notice now that his team is not trying to lose he isn't playing nearly as much or having nearly as much impact

He is averaging 18:32 a game, third on the team for dmen

Last year he averaged 18:11 for 4th on the team (3rd after Chychrun left)

So he is solidifying that number 3 spot and is gaining the trust of his coaches as they try to win, as they play him more than last year.

[Enoch Root]

If losing Valimaki is our biggest problem, I think we're good.

I think the prospect pool on defense has really taken a leap forward recently: Poirier continues to progress, Solovyov has come out of nowhere to show that he is an NHLer, and Morin has the potential to be a top pairing guy. That isn't a lot in the way of prospects, but it is better than where we thought we were 6 months ago. And I expect we are going to be adding significantly to that prospect pool in the near future.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

"Things going more the way I want" what does that even mean? Infact, your entire post makes no sense when I have said nothing even close to anything you are suggesting.

Maybe try formulating your own opinion if you're going to jump into the discussion instead of some lame attempt to start an argument about "seeing what I want to see".

It's hardly a hot take to suggest Murray Edwards is sticking his fingers in the GM pie.

I'll ask again: how do you see this turn of events as indicating that Edwards is 'sticking his fingers in the GM pie'? Please explain

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

He is averaging 18:32 a game, third on the team for dmen

Last year he averaged 18:11 for 4th on the team (3rd after Chychrun left)

So he is solidifying that number 3 spot and is gaining the trust of his coaches as they try to win, as they play him more than last year.

he isn't getting force fed the offensive situations like #1 PP time as far as the games I have watched

guy has 3 points

they should have kept him but really...he isn't anything to still be crying about. Arizona loves him so much they offered him a 1 year 1 million dollar deal.

[Bingo]

I'm not sure what I find more head scratching ...

People that bring up Valimaki as a lost prospect and a mistake when he literally couldn't put a shift together in a training camp after moving down the depth chart on an AHL roster.

Or people that want to defend losing him so badly that they're spinning his stats as negative when he's now playing in the NHL.

Every team has a tough decision on tweeners. 9 times out of 10 they stay tweeners in their next stop, sometimes they pop. Pop index is usually equal (pop in / pop out).

[dino7c]

all I'm saying is that he is a tweener so let it go

[Bubba17]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Nine games should not change the course of the team’s plan. That’s a problem. If it takes only nine games to make you change your mind in your strategic plan, then your plan was crap to begin with.

Or maybe they thought the players were good and had a ####ty year because of Sutter, but then they showed up and are doing the same thing so they have proved the issue is with them and it is time to move on from the guys who refuse to work.

[InternationalVillager]

Originally Posted by HighLifeMan

At this point you like to hear it, but the fact that a 5 game sample size can so dramatically change a team's approach or direction moving forward is scary.

If we rattle five wins off in a row - are talks all the sudden back on?

This was the plan all along for this season.

Second question- No talks would still be paused. I think they're giving it until christmas.

[NegativeSpace]

Originally Posted by Matty81

I'm not all that worried about the bigger longer term deals in the next couple of years because we are going to need money to get to the cap floor with it going up so much, flames have about 40 mil committed next year. Sucks more for the players than it does for the flames.

Acknowledging Francis seems to guess at stuff and claim it is fact in the past...

If this is true my main concern is how atrocious our blueline will be next year and the long term outlook. Andersson, Weegar and a bunch of plugs and B and C prospects right now moving forward. It's almost an Oiler level back end and it takes half a decade or more to build a home grown strong blueline - the club has a big deficit at that position from a prospect perspective IMP.

Letting Valimaki walk we're left hoping one of the mid/late rounders like Poirier, Solovyov or Morin pan out to fill one of the four empty spots long run and will clearly need to bring back a good young blueline prospect in any Hanifin deal

You can always find some bottom pairing defencemen in free agency or the waiver wire.



Weegar - Andersson

XXX - XXX
XXX - XXX


They have on defence on the farm: Solovyov, Poirier, Lyle, Kuznetsov. They could also re-sign Oesterle or Gilbert or Zadorov.



So, you get:



Weegar - Andersson
Solovyov - Zadorov
Oesterle - Gilbert



It's a bottom of the league blueline but I'm just trying to show that they could fill out the roster even with trading players.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

I'll ask again: how do you see this turn of events as indicating that Edwards is 'sticking his fingers in the GM pie'? Please explain

I can't see a GM pivoting like this based on 7-8 poor games at the beginning of the season. Just a few weeks ago these signings "were close" but a few games later it is now "on hold". If Conroy was fully committed to re-signing these two players, it would be beyond concerning for that small of a sample size to be swaying his course of action on the team's future. There's no way a guy that has learned from the likes of Burke and Treliving would be that rash.

Where else is the directive coming from? The only place is ownership that is starting to get a hint that fan apathy (dwindling attendance) and the obvious continued issues on ice from last year are not going away with new coaches and positive vibes. Methinks they may finally be seeing the light that fans are not going to support this team if they aren't at least going out there and playing hard and are growing concerned about locking in a fractured room for the rest of the decade.

I'll turn the table: What leads you to believe that this "on hold" rumor is not based on an ownership directive? I'm genuinely interested to hear if I'm just overlooking something blatantly obvious in that regard.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

I can't see a GM pivoting like this based on 7-8 poor games at the beginning of the season. Just a few weeks ago these signings "were close" but a few games later it is now "on hold". If Conroy was fully committed to re-signing these two players, it would be beyond concerning for that small of a sample size to be swaying his course of action on the team's future. There's no way a guy that has learned from the likes of Burke and Treliving would be that rash.

Where else is the directive coming from? The only place is ownership that is starting to get a hint that fan apathy (dwindling attendance) and the obvious continued issues on ice from last year are not going away with new coaches and positive vibes. Methinks they may finally be seeing the light that fans are not going to support this team if they aren't at least going out there and playing hard and are growing concerned about locking in a fractured room for the rest of the decade.

I'll turn the table: What leads you to believe that this "on hold" rumor is not based on an ownership directive? I'm genuinely interested to hear if I'm just overlooking something blatantly obvious in that regard.

Theres definitely more too it than just Conroy.
Truth is he probably isn't even allowed to make such a bold franchise altering stance 9 games into the job.

There will be multiple execs involved in a decision like this. Who wanted to do this sooner? who thought the team was a contender? Who was overruling who?
We'll never know those details, but I think it's more than safe to say it's not just Conroy changing his mind after 9 hockey games.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

I can't see a GM pivoting like this based on 7-8 poor games at the beginning of the season. Just a few weeks ago these signings "were close" but a few games later it is now "on hold". If Conroy was fully committed to re-signing these two players, it would be beyond concerning for that small of a sample size to be swaying his course of action on the team's future. There's no way a guy that has learned from the likes of Burke and Treliving would be that rash.

Where else is the directive coming from? The only place is ownership that is starting to get a hint that fan apathy (dwindling attendance) and the obvious continued issues on ice from last year are not going away with new coaches and positive vibes. Methinks they may finally be seeing the light that fans are not going to support this team if they aren't at least going out there and playing hard and are growing concerned about locking in a fractured room for the rest of the decade.

I'll turn the table: What leads you to believe that this "on hold" rumor is not based on an ownership directive? I'm genuinely interested to hear if I'm just overlooking something blatantly obvious in that regard.

Ownership isn't involved in day to day activity. Edwards doesn't even live in Canada.

Ownership's 'mandate' to always try and be competitive, is not a day to day, or month to month thing, it (assuming it exists) is a permanent thing. If it has been in place for years, and through all of the trials and tribulations of Gaudreau walking and Tkachuk being asked for a trade, then it isn't going to be rescinded, simply because they are on a 5-game losing streak.

It is Conroy's job to sign players, and to decide which players are to be signed, not ownership's