Israel declares war on Hamas

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by Johnny199r

This thread had gone about how I imagined it would go.

Yeah, other than my one post explaining Sky Daddy dynamics, I Grandpa Simpson'd out of the thread for a reason.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Bagor

That's right.
All them mothers that have lost their children in Gaza.
All them children that have lost their parents.
They're nothing more than spectators.
What a disgusting repulsive take fitting of someone only fit to follow orders with zero critical thinking skills. It's cool?

You minimize death and murder with cool? You need help. Seriously.

hey bud, push away from the keyboard.

Or start a thread to discuss The Troubles.


Nowhere have I minimized "death and murder".

someone only fit to follow orders with zero critical thinking skills.

#### off

stay in your lane, it is clear you don't know as much as you think you know.

[Blaster86]

Originally Posted by Bagor

You need help. Seriously.

Projection is real.

[Fuzzy14]

It's kind of fitting that this thread has turned into a microcosm of the Israel-Palestine conflict itself.

CP truly is at the cutting edge of social experimentation.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

Nowhere have I minimized "death and murder". .

Own it.
Experienced death and murder? Meh. All Just spectators. Cool.
Now run along and follow orders.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Bagor

Own it.
Experienced death and murder? Meh. All Just spectators. Cool.
Now run along and follow orders.

You are clearly a good human.

[Bagor]

Originally Posted by undercoverbrother

You are clearly a good human.

You're the one minimizing death and murder. That's who/what you are.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Bagor

You're the one minimizing death and murder. That's who/what you are.

No, no I am not, more have I.


You have gone off half cocked at me

[Bagor]

Own it. It who and what you are.

[Bill Bumface]

No, your mom!

[Leondros]

This thread is wild

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Bagor

Own it. It who and what you are.

You seem nice

[Nage Waza]

Originally Posted by combustiblefuel

All I've seen is Jewish posters hate on Palestinians and Palestinians hate on jews.

That is hardly true at all and a terrible comment to make. It is a sensitive issue, but I believe in general, most (definitely not all) posters here do not hate Palestinians or Jews.

[WCW Nitro]

41% of Canadians do not think Canada should support Israel in the current conflict while 38% do.

https://lactualite.com/politique/un-...ntre-le-hamas/

"Dans l’ensemble du pays, 41 % des répondants n’étaient pas d’accord avec l’affirmation « Le Canada devrait appuyer Israël dans son conflit armé contre le Hamas », contre 38 % qui étaient d’accord. Ajoutons à cela 15 % des répondants qui se disaient neutres et 5 % qui étaient incertains."

[afc wimbledon]

I won't get into the sandbox with you two but I will add a little about the troubles from an English perspective who lived through it.

The three communities involved did not hate each other with the visceral hatred we see in Palestine, life as a Catholic in N Ireland was fairly poor, the best jobs went to the Protestants but life as a Catholic in Southern Ireland where Catholics were in charge was equally poor or even poorer, and being a Protestant in the North wasn't much better so there was no sense of some 'promised land' independence would bring, it was mostly an emotional pull, like Quebec.

Also as a Catholic in either N or Southern Ireland you could (and hundreds of thousands did) just move to the UK where no one cared either way, in England you were just 'Irish', looked down upon and the butt of jokes and no small amount of racism in some places but no one cared about your faith, in the 70's almost all young Irish guys from North or South spent a few years working in the UK as it was so much richer and had/has a huge Irish population.

The UK 'state', the Conservatives in particular, might have felt obligated to try and retain control of the North but most mainland Brits themselves didnt care either way, in fact for most of the late 70's Brits thought the Province was too much trouble and cost and it would be better if it joined the South, even when bombs were going off in Mainland UK (I was 'bombed' three times as teenager, twice in department stores at Christmas where we were asked to 'calmly and quietly leave the store through the emergency exits', everyone knew there was a bomb in the store and yet we all queued like Englishmen!!, and once by a car bomb that went off a few streets away from a group home I was working in and blew in the windows), even at the height of the campaigns I cannot remember anyone being annoyed at 'the Irish' in general, my roommate was from Derry and had no problems at all, this was probably due to the IRA being very careful to avoid civilian casualties, giving warnings to evacuate the building etc.
If they had killed thousand of women and children I suspect that would have been very different.

The sense you got living through it was the paramilitaries dint really represent their communities that much, the IRA was avowedly Marxist when the Catholic population was incredibly conservative, the UDA and the Protestant paramilitaries were really little more than thuggish street gangs that used the troubles as cover for drug and prostitution businesses, they were not looked on kindly in the UK and my Protestant Irish friends seemed to despise them even more, the UK Government wasn't 'supported' by the UK voters much either, maintaining control of N Ireland was seen in the way you expected the Government to keep the streets clean or the water running, just something Goverments do, on top of this I suspect most Brits had more sympathy for the Catholics than the Protestants, the Catholic cause made sense to the British where as the Protestants seemed backward

All of that said I wholly concur that the UK security services were ruthless and killed many many innocent catholics using the UDA as cover, there is nothing about the Troubles the UK can really be proud of but neither is it a model for the Middle East as a solution

[blankall]

^^^^

Thank you afc.

Do you think that many of these militant groups, that the locals seemed to not be especially supportive of, were receiving support from nations outside of the UK/Ireland? Were they simply a vocal minority?

[afc wimbledon]

Originally Posted by blankall

^^^^

Thank you afc.

Do you think that many of these militant groups, that the locals seemed to not be especially supportive of, were receiving support from nations outside of the UK/Ireland? Were they simply a vocal minority?

In the beginning both sides were supported by their people, the Catholics had legitimate grievances and were abused by the Protestant majority, that said the Protestants had a legitimate fear the UK would just walk away and leave them to become overnight an minority.
The Protestants got support from the UK in the end, not average Brits but the security services, they would join the RUC or the Territorial regiments and take their guns home
The IRA and INLA got support from the US and towards the mid 70's from the world network of leftist guerilla groups, they had connections with the PLO and the Red Army Faction, these tended to be marriages of convenience, by the 80's they were teaching bomb making to Columbian and Venezuelan narco terrorist groups like the 'Shining Path movement' of course all this meant both sides inexorably devolved into little more than drug smuggling and distribution gangs by the late 80's which undercut their popular support massively, the IRA specialised in robbing banks as well, they all ran protection rackets throughout their communities

[FlamesAddiction]

I've known several English and Irish people, worked with some in different companies I worked for, and they always seemed to get along really well. I don't know if it is a difference of being from the Republic of Ireland versus Northern Ireland, or what, but they didn't seem to have a strong personal hate toward each other. Just my personal experience which might not be completely representative for all I know.

[afc wimbledon]

Nothing about the troubles was existential for any of the sides, the Catholic minority was put upon by the Protestant majority in N Ireland, they were the working class to the Protestant middle class if you will but it wasn't a legal oppression, it was more traditional and they could move either south or to the UK to avoid it, the UK was never threatened particularly, bombs going off at Christmas was annoying but I never felt unsafe frankly, the Protestants were fighting to defend something even they knew was bull#### and they knew if the UK pulled out they still wouldnt be massacred.

The problem for Israel is the founding Jewish population were all scarred by the holocaust, they had no ability to be rational, for them everything was an existential threat even before the invasion in '49 so clearly they would struggle to react rationally as either individuals or as a state.
The same became the case for the Arab population from day one, two sides who think they have to win or they are dead, it makes for a grim war with no ability to really see the others case

[TherapyforGlencross]

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/u-s-str...on-u-s-troops/

The U.S. military conducted strikes against two facilities in eastern Syria used by Iranian-backed groups in retaliation for recent attacks against U.S. forces in Iraq and Syria.

"The United States does not seek conflict and has no intention nor desire to engage in further hostilities, but these Iranian-backed attacks against U.S. forces are unacceptable and must stop," Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin said in a statement Thursday night.

Iranian-backed groups have targeted U.S. forces in Iraq and Syria with a mix of drones and rockets at least 16 times since Oct. 17, according to the Pentagon.