Time To Oust The Tories: Rent Control Not Coming

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Rent control is certainly not a fix all, I guess I am just really frustrated.

There needs to be a fix now as the labour shortage is becoming a big problem.

I believe the government's affordable housing initiative is pretty weak and should be pushed harder if they want to make a difference soon.

I guess I just want more to be done by a very very rich government.

Well as I mentioned earlier one easy solution is to relax rules on basement suites that would open up a plethora of rental units. The key is not to do this at the expense of safety of course, but right now the rules are way too restrictive.

But ultimately you may have to make a choice of whether or not you can afford to live in Calgary. I know I will be having to arrive at that decision point soon and gradually I've been coming to the conclusion that to be a homeowner - I will have to leave Calgary. So be it.

But the market needs to be free to operate. Leave 'er alone.

[FireFly]

I think that you're a bit confused though Nehkara. Rent can only go up so much before no one will rent anymore. Why would I pay $1800/month in rent, when I could own for the same amount? So there is a rent control in that aspect as you can now borrow your downpayment on a mortgage. It cannot go up exponentially for eternity. There is a limit to what people will spend on rent. If you can't afford rent, it might be time to look into shared housing. Get a roommate or something.

[Antithesis]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Companies should NOT be able to profit off the backs of struggling people. We should not be forcing a large portion of our population into poverty, it is not a good idea.

You don't own Nike shoes do you ...? Or anything else that says "Made in the Phillipines" or "Made in Indonesia" on it? Please don't interpret as me being a dink - I'm trying to raise the point that if you express outrage in this area that you must express outrage in every area because in my mind it is the same thing.

Originally Posted by Nehkara

It is the same thing with gas prices honestly... companies continue to make record profits (HUGE profits) with seemingly no control on how much they can charge.

If you want to find someone/some entity to be angry about gas prices, you should look no further than the government, whose taxes contribute a lot more to the price of gas than the profit margin at the pump.

... and be glad you don't live in Europe.

[anyonebutedmonton]

If you don't like it you have two solutions:

1. stop renting and buy a house

or:

2. Move somewhere else

The government should only get involved in these types of things when it is absolutely necessary (homeless shelters etc). The market will correct itself and until then it is within a landlords rights to charge whatever they want. Don't like it? Tough.

[Sylvanfan]

TIA baby,

This is Alberta. If the market can't afford these rent increases, it will soften up. If it can, than the rates will stay up. If you can't afford the rent and money is that tight, maybe you do need to look elsewhere. The government shouldn't step in and change things just because you want to have your cake and eat it too. People have been putting up with high rent in Vancouver and area for years because thats where they wanted to live. Calgary's getting to be the same, if you really want to stay you'll find a way to pay for it. If money is more important you'll look to find a place thats cheaper. Thats the natural balance that will fix the problem moreso than rent control will.

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

You confuse us with US.

I guess it is easy to do, just capital letters.

Companies should NOT be able to profit off the backs of struggling people. We should not be forcing a large portion of our population into poverty, it is not a good idea.

It is the same thing with gas prices honestly... companies continue to make record profits (HUGE profits) with seemingly no control on how much they can charge.

Most of the gas prices comes from taxes no?

Different topic I guess.

I don't view this as people profiting off the backs of struggling people. They are keeping up with the market - which landlords need to have the right to do.

There are plenty of solutions out there. Get a room mate and split a 2 bedroom apartment. Get 3 and split a bigger place. Don't like roommates? Well that's too bad.

Get a 2nd job.

Or move.

Lots of options. The city is still affordable to live in - just not maybe in the manner some people are used to.

[Nehkara]

So everyone agrees something should be done and also agrees that most of the solutions are bad ones.

Are there any really good solutions to this problem?

[Antithesis]

Let the market dictate what price landlords can set for the rental of their property ...

[Nehkara]

Originally Posted by Antithesis

Let the market dictate what price landlords can set for the rental of their property ...

Great.

Now what do we do about bringing in more people so we don't have a huge shortage of workers?

Maybe I'm missing the point, do you think that would help the shortage of workers?

[Antithesis]

To reset, I do agree with you, wholeheartedly, that the city and province's affordable housing situation leaves a lot to be desired and needs to be re-evaluated. I think it's two different issues, though ...

[JiriHrdina]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Great.

Now what do we do about bringing in more people so we don't have a huge shortage of workers?

Maybe I'm missing the point, do you think that would help the shortage of workers?

Not sure. To be honest its a problem that's only going to get worse due to the retirement of the baby boomer generation.

Simply put - there ain't enough workers to go around. So industry is going to compete for people, and some industries are going to be left behind.

What does this mean?

Be prepared to wait 30-45 minutes for your Big Whopper.

[Thunderball]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

So everyone agrees something should be done and also agrees that most of the solutions are bad ones.

Are there any really good solutions to this problem?

The only legitimate thing to do is to have an EUB of sorts for renting. Like with Natural Gas, Landlords would have to apply to raise rent for whatever reason (land value, inflation, etc.), and show cause. Rent controls are very dangerous as a general rule and tend to crush investment into rental property. If its no longer profitable, no one will do it. Which means even less rental properties.

However, this would not necessarily be a panacea for renters, as this governing body would side with renters as much as it would with landlords. This would protect people who live in holes that the landlord feels like charging top dollar for. This rental board could also legislate yearly increases based on inflation. Can't have it all.

There is a market ceiling however, and thats the price of an average mortgage payment. Fair? Not really, but neither are the alternatives.

Best thing for the city/province to do right now is to make sure developers churn out as many houses, condos and apartments as possible. If supply can catch up, the demand will diminish, as will the prices.

[photon]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Rents doubling overnight is ridiculous. I am not saying Landlords shouldn't be able to capitlize on their investment but gouging should not be allowed.

The actual amount of that happening is very very low, and in cases where it does happen it is often a case of a) a landlord trying to get rid of a tenant, the courts are heavily favoured to the tenants and getting rid of a problem is very tough, so jack up the rent and they'll leave by themselves or b) rents that have been artifically low, place changes ownership, and rents increase.. but going from $500 to $1000 sounds horrible, but in a market where the average is $1200 all of a sudden doesn't sound so bad.

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Lost money? I have a hard time believing that. Maybe they only just broke even, but I doubt they lost money.

Now they are probably mostly making a fortune off of people who now struggle to get by.

I know many people that have been on the loss side of their properties for a while until recently. Rents in Calgary were almost totally flat for quite a long time, it's only been the past few years that rents have finally gone up to match the demand.

And most landlords aren't cackling evilly over their ill got profits, costs for landlords have skyrocketed as well. Utilities, any kind of trades for repairs, that kind of thing is way more expensive.

Not all landlords are gems, but most just honestly want a decent return on their investment. It's not my direct responsibility to provide housing for the people who are struggling (though I do believe it is my indirect responsibility, but that's through taxes, government programs, etc).

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Rent control is certainly not a fix all, I guess I am just really frustrated.

There needs to be a fix now as the labour shortage is becoming a big problem.

I believe the government's affordable housing initiative is pretty weak and should be pushed harder if they want to make a difference soon.

I guess I just want more to be done by a very very rich government.

That I totally agree with. But we already are adding more people than the province can handle (which is why rents are so high). We need more places for people to live, which means capital investment, which means there has to be a good reason for companies and investors to build... If there's no reasonable expectation of a return, then no one will build. And as was pointed out, those that do own will simply convert their units to condos and sell them.

I agree with Jiri, there's lots of options, including moving out of the city. That's just the reality of the changes that are happening.

If the government wants to get involved in it, do it from the other end. Subsidize the rent of low income earners to make up the difference for short term help.

Long term, increase the number of rental units overall. Give people incentive to build rental buildings. Establish the rules for basement suites and above-garage suites so that they are safe for tenants, and explicit so that landlords can comply with them. Because basement suites are such and underground thing right now, horrible dangerous units get rented out all the time but no one complains because they're scared to lose their own safe units. Establish the guidelines, set the code requirements, increase the zoning, etc..

[photon]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Great.

Now what do we do about bringing in more people so we don't have a huge shortage of workers?

Maybe I'm missing the point, do you think that would help the shortage of workers?

The rent prices aren't what's causing the shortage of workers.

[Agamemnon]

Maybe the government should just find ways to stimulate inexpensive housing projects in Calgary and Edmonton (and whereever else they're needed... Lloydminster comes to mind...). I still can't quite figure out why the municipal/provincial governments drag their heels on this one, as if new-home developers are going to decide to build low-income housing.

[photon]

Originally Posted by Thunderball

Best thing for the city/province to do right now is to make sure developers churn out as many houses, condos and apartments as possible. If supply can catch up, the demand will diminish, as will the prices.

Agreed.. the government doing a good job of creating an economy where businesses want to come here and create jobs is what helped create this issue in the first place.. apply the same ideas to creating more housing.

[CaramonLS]

Originally Posted by photon

The rent prices aren't what's causing the shortage of workers.

Actually I think it is part of it, particularily in the low income brackets.

Unaffordable housing means that Maritimer isn't going to come here to take a job at the local Earls restaraunt, when that kind of Salary can barely afford to cover your cost of living.

Those low end jobs aren't seeing even close to the returns that would cover the increased cost of living in this city.

Having worked at an Earls for a few years ago in the summer time, probably 30-40% is from out of town.

[photon]

Originally Posted by CaramonLS

Actually I think it is part of it, particularily in the low income brackets.

Unaffordable housing means that Maritimer isn't going to come here to take a job at the local Earls restaraunt, when that kind of Salary can barely afford to cover your cost of living.

Those low end jobs aren't seeing even close to the returns that would cover the increased cost of living in this city.

Having worked at an Earls for a few years ago in the summer time, probably 30-40% is from out of town.

I agree it can cause a shortage of a certain kind of worker, but not an overall shortage of workers.

Everyone that's renting has a job to pay their rent, it just means those renters are working at higher paying jobs.

I'm just saying artifically keeping rents low is not going to help the labour shortage, since it's the actual rental units (and housing in general) that's constrained. 1000 people want to move here, but only 100 can because there's only 100 places to live.

[The Unabomber]

Originally Posted by fotze

Something does need to be fixed. Those who's goals and aspirations are dependant on the good will of strangers really need to either adjust those goals or adjust their life to achieve the goals.

I could have been a landlord a few times but I personally cannot accept that risk. A renter can ruin your house and if they are poor, you can not get that money back. The time to deal with the stuff can be oppressive as well.

Would anyone want the government to enact laws that prevent you from moving to a better job that pays you double because the poor guy you worked for before wasn't given 3 months notice.

Quite the ignorant comment Fotze.

It's not always about goals and aspirations that lead a person to make a decision as to weather they own a home or rent a home. Lots of different cicumstances are involved in where someone might end up, that might be the fact that someone died like the husband and father and he was the only one bringing in money as the wife is at home looking after the kids. This leads to more homeless people, but i'm sure your the type that thinks that everyone who is homeless didn't set his goals correctly.

The way the cost of this city is going right now they are going to have more problems down the road than just rent. The homeless shelter is full right now, the youth emergency shelter is full to capacity and have to turn kids away, people are freezing to death because they have to spend the night outside, these problems are going to keep piling up as time goes by.

But the problems that i listed Fotze is all due to people not having their goals set right hey? The cost of a house doubled over a 2 year period, did wages? Once people start leaving the city in swarms it might shine a light that something is wrong, until then the government is happy to just sit back and get rich.

[guzzy]

Originally Posted by Nehkara

Tories Blasted On Rent


I'm tired of this, the rental situation should never have gotten this bad in the first place and now they outright refuse to fix it. Brutal.

YA because that'll get rid of em.

There is almost no way the province would vote in a liberal govt in Alberta, especially over something like this. I agree something needs to be done but I don't have an answer.