You Know What Really Grinds My Gears? Now with 3x more gears...

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

... well, it's photo radar, a thinly-veiled cash grab is what it is.

Photo enforcement programs and equipment are designed and marketed to municipalities as revenue-generating tools, an opportunity to shore up the budget. They're sold to the public under the guise of safety, despite the fact that they routinely do nothing of the sort and especially when used in such a manner to accomplish their primary goal of revenue generation; see jayswin's report of the photo radar vehicle being placed on a freeway near a merge lane with the barrier hiding the high-vis vinyl despite being contrary to the provincial regulations as a recent example. There's another spot on south Deerfoot by the north Barlow / Ogden merge ramp that is similar.

It's not for safety. Not now and never was ever about safety.

Agreed. I mainly meant if you're tagging tourists 5 minutes after they leave the rental car lot, it's especially ridiculous as a cash grab.

[TorqueDog]

"Welcome to Calgary! That'll be $120, thanks."

[Wormius]

It is pretty strange to have an 80 zone sandwiched between a 60 and 70.

https://data.calgary.ca/Health-and-S...-Map/rbfp-3tic

[chemgear]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

"Welcome to Calgary! That'll be $120, thanks."

We need this on Deerfoot for all those parasites in Airdrie coming into the city on their 5 minute commutes into downtown.

[TorqueDog]

There's frankly no reason that the 70 zone shouldn't be an 80 like the other stretch of Airport Trail either.

Originally Posted by chemgear

We need this on Deerfoot for all those parasites in Airdrie coming into the city on their 5 minute commutes into downtown.

Ahem, it's "just fifteen minutes from downtown Calgary".

I'd be fine with a toll for them.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Wormius

It is pretty strange to have an 80 zone sandwiched between a 60 and 70.

https://data.calgary.ca/Health-and-S...-Map/rbfp-3tic

[Locke]

Originally Posted by DoubleF

I wasn't a fan of Sci fi as a kid. I couldn't wrap my mind around it. But now that I'm older, I love the genre.

I'm waiting to find a good deal on a hard cover set of the Foundation series to really start digging into their stuff. Does anyone also know if they ever made good hardcover, tome like compilations of Asimov and PKD's work? Not a soft cover basic compilation. Like display quality, anthology caliber. I wasn't able to find any for a reasonable price.

Similarly, I wish I nabbed the Roald Dahl adult stories ones when I was in my youth.

I know I've got a hardcover of PKD's stories somewhere, but as for Foundation? Used book stores are your friends! Google up what you need and hunt it down!

[Fuzz]

Ebooks FTW. And they are free becuase he is long dead(unfortunately not in reality).



Note the Foundation series is not best read in the published order. There are varying opinions on this, but this is the order Asimov himself recommended, including the leadup to the Foundation series, but if you are only interested in Foundation, you can skip them without missing much. I tihnk, I've only read I,Robot and Caves of Steel years ago.


https://more.bibliocommons.com/list/...139/1735833849

[Monahammer]

The reading order that is best is pretty much publishing order:

- Foundation
- Foundation and empire
- Second Foundation

Now you must stop here and read the robot books, or the next two foundation books will make little sense and be less effective.

-IRobot - Collection of short stories set in the same universe that outlines and details the fuzziness of the laws of robotics.
- Caves of steel- sets up important characters and universe characteristics
- The naked sun- a fantastic book in it's own right (eerie in the context of covid lockdowns imo) but also important character and story elements
- The robots of dawn

here is where choice begins. You can read Robots and Empire here, but I would suggest leaving it until later. Much like the prequels, reading this will modify your opinions on character motivations in the rest of the story pretty significantly.

The Empire books can be read here, but aren't necessary. Fun to insert them here if you are a big fan of the universe created (as I was.)

- Foundation's Edge
- Foundation and Earth

THEN
- Prelude to Foundation
- Forward to Foundation


Seems weird to end with the prequels but if you read them first it ruins so many mysteries and motivations. IMO the best of the lot is Foundation and Empire (not an uncommon opinion) but I also adore Foundation and Earth (very uncommon opinion.)

[DoubleF]

Originally Posted by Locke

I know I've got a hardcover of PKD's stories somewhere, but as for Foundation? Used book stores are your friends! Google up what you need and hunt it down!

Maybe I'm somehow a moron when it comes to researching used books, but when I did just that, I wasn't happy with the prices online. I was often nearly better off buying new.

Maybe I just have to go old school and walk into used book stores and hope for the best.

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Ebooks FTW. And they are free becuase he is long dead(unfortunately not in reality).



Note the Foundation series is not best read in the published order. There are varying opinions on this, but this is the order Asimov himself recommended, including the leadup to the Foundation series, but if you are only interested in Foundation, you can skip them without missing much. I tihnk, I've only read I,Robot and Caves of Steel years ago.


https://more.bibliocommons.com/list/...139/1735833849

I have an e-reader. But I was having a mess of a time figuring out calibre and/or the ability to "borrow" the digital book via a public library account. I should look into this again, but yeah, I remember a year or two ago spending hours in frustration. I think a bunch of stuff got borked after updates.

Thanks for the order. I've seen so many variations out there.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

... well, it's photo radar, a thinly-veiled cash grab is what it is.

Photo enforcement programs and equipment are designed and marketed to municipalities as revenue-generating tools, an opportunity to shore up the budget. They're sold to the public under the guise of safety, despite the fact that they routinely do nothing of the sort and especially when used in such a manner to accomplish their primary goal of revenue generation; see jayswin's report of the photo radar vehicle being placed on a freeway near a merge lane with the barrier hiding the high-vis vinyl despite being contrary to the provincial regulations as a recent example. There's another spot on south Deerfoot by the north Barlow / Ogden merge ramp that is similar.

It's not for safety. Not now and never was ever about safety.

You don’t think fines and the threat of fines change peoples’ behaviour?

[MoneyGuy]

The belief that photo radar is purely for revenue generation is nonsense. I’ve permanently changed my driving practises because of a PR ticket.

[rohara66]

Originally Posted by MoneyGuy

The belief that photo radar is purely for revenue generation is nonsense. I’ve permanently changed my driving practises because of a PR ticket.

They're a joke.



Got a speed on green ticket for a 72 in a 60 the other day.... I struggled to even remember going through that intersection 3 weeks prior. In fact I still dont even know where exactly it is.


I was not being unsafe and I'm still driving exactly the same as I was a month ago.

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

You don’t think fines and the threat of fines change peoples’ behaviour?

But specifically speaking to this short section of road that changes speed multiple times with a radar camera set up by the international airport. Are you teaching tourists a lesson to change their behaviour? They probably won’t get notification of the fine until they’re back home.

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

You don’t think fines and the threat of fines change peoples’ behaviour?

I know you were going for a strawman there, but sorry, I'm not going to defend an imaginary position. Do you think photo radar actually makes a permanent change to people's behavior in a large enough sample (aside from Saint MoneyGuy up there)?

I'll give you a hint as to the correct answer:

Municipalities with photo radar programs demonstrate a reliance on not just steady but increasing revenues year-over-year from photo radar. Look at Edmonton for the perfect example of this.

Originally Posted by Wormius

But specifically speaking to this short section of road that changes speed multiple times with a radar camera set up by the international airport. Are you teaching tourists a lesson to change their behaviour? They probably won’t get notification of the fine until they’re back home.

It's even better than that, they don't get the notification of the fine, it goes to the rental company. Then the rental company pays the ticket and charges it back to the customer. So the ticket doesn't even have a chance of getting contested. It's shooting fish in a barrel.

[bc-chris]

a customer provides an terrible over exposed cell phone pic (from his customer) of a logo on a garment and wants me to 'match' the colours.

i reply with...
hey XXX

see attached. I did my best to get the colours as true as possible (not an overexposed cell pic – ha!)

the only difference in the two samples is in the colour of the sail.
the darker sail is thread colour 61024
the lighter sail is thread colour 61023

let me know if one of these will work

chris

his reply...
Looks good, can you get these going?



**but he doesn't tell me which colour for the sail - "le sigh"

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by bc-chris

a customer provides an terrible over exposed cell phone pic (from his customer) of a logo on a garment and wants me to 'match' the colours.

i reply with...
hey XXX

see attached. I did my best to get the colours as true as possible (not an overexposed cell pic – ha!)

the only difference in the two samples is in the colour of the sail.
the darker sail is thread colour 61024
the lighter sail is thread colour 61023

let me know if one of these will work

chris

his reply...
Looks good, can you get these going?



**but he doesn't tell me which colour for the sail - "le sigh"

Had one similar to that yesterday. Client wants to make some changes on a project. I told them there were several different ways to do it and explained each of them. The reply was 'sounds good, let's go with your suggestion'.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

I know you were going for a strawman there, but sorry, I'm not going to defend an imaginary position. Do you think photo radar actually makes a permanent change to people's behavior in a large enough sample (aside from Saint MoneyGuy up there)?

I'll give you a hint as to the correct answer:

Municipalities with photo radar programs demonstrate a reliance on not just steady but increasing revenues year-over-year from photo radar. Look at Edmonton for the perfect example of this.

It's even better than that, they don't get the notification of the fine, it goes to the rental company. Then the rental company pays the ticket and charges it back to the customer. So the ticket doesn't even have a chance of getting contested. It's shooting fish in a barrel.

On the other hand the increase in rear end collisions and reduction in cross traffic collisions at red light photo radar positions does show that their is a permenant change in behaviour and a reduction in overall risk at an intersection. So the use of photo radar in municipalities does have positive impacts despite a revenue focus in some areas.

Now do municipalities use these as honey pots and put them in areas with bad design? Absolutely. In my opinion there should be requirements around the implementation of photo radar to evaluate pre and post speed and collision reductions so that accident reduction rather than revenue

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by TorqueDog

I know you were going for a strawman there, but sorry, I'm not going to defend an imaginary position. Do you think photo radar actually makes a permanent change to people's behavior in a large enough sample (aside from Saint MoneyGuy up there)?

I'll give you a hint as to the correct answer:

Municipalities with photo radar programs demonstrate a reliance on not just steady but increasing revenues year-over-year from photo radar. Look at Edmonton for the perfect example of this.

It's even better than that, they don't get the notification of the fine, it goes to the rental company. Then the rental company pays the ticket and charges it back to the customer. So the ticket doesn't even have a chance of getting contested. It's shooting fish in a barrel.

Yes, I think photo radar changes driver behaviour. The last time I got a speeding ticket was five years ago, and it stung enough that I’m conscious of it whenever I drive.

And frankly the more police operational expenses come from speeding fines rather than general municipal budgets, the better. People have a choice about paying the former.

[MoneyGuy]

I agree that photo radar (ATE, or automated traffic enforcement as few systems still use radar) does change driving behaviour. When I get a ticket it causes me to slow down. I’m not the only one. I think revenue should go to safety initiatives, not general revenue. I was one of the decision makers when my city adopted PR and safety was a factor in my decision-making process.