2023/2024 Trade Rumors and Speculation Thread

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Big Z is a fun player to have on the team, but c'mon. "need to keep big Z"? What team needs to keep a player like that?

The Flames need to draft a Nathan Mackinnon. The Flames need to draft a Victor Hedman. The Flames need to draft a Jack Eichel.

The Flames need a big Z?

Ya, who needs to keep a hard hitting defenseman that can chip in goals, nobody wants those. Every team wants to draft those players you cherry picked there, not many get the chance. The Flames absolutely need that big physical D man, especially with the lack of hard hitting players on this team. Every contender would love to have a D man like Zadorov in their bottom pair.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

A player like that? Every team.

Not sure what Jack Eichel has to do with the type of player you need playing on the bottom half of your defense.

He's been very, very sheltered. Even sheltered I'd love to have him around, but you have to be careful of what he costs vs what he provides. I feel like he's going to be an expensive D-man next season and it's going to be based on "big equals good" and not based on "sheltered starts".

The stats show that he is excellent but in sheltered starts with a physical game, and will likely get get paid very well on the open market. And the Flames will pay market value at this point. So at this point it's not what can the Flames do to sign him to a contract, but what will he get on the open market and are we willing to pay that, AND will he sign a contract in Calgary when he's got many teams in play as a UFA.

I'd put the chances of Zadorov signing here for a contract that works for us at <15%, to be honest. If the Flames see him as a "rental" for the season, that's fine. But we can't do that with every pending UFA that we have.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Ya, who needs to keep a hard hitting defenseman that can chip in goals, nobody wants those. Every team wants to draft those players you cherry picked there, not many get the chance. The Flames absolutely need that big physical D man, especially with the lack of hard hitting players on this team. Every contender would love to have a D man like Zadorov in their bottom pair.

Future Champions get the chance to.

Paying depth players too much money to stick around is a sure fire way to extend the neverending mediocrity that is the longstanding identity of this team.

Over-prioritizing players like Z and defining them as "needs" should be a laughable concept. The guy is a fan favourite because he hits and happened to go off for a hattrick in game 82.

I like Z - he's fun, and in a bull!@#% season he was one of the few bright spots - but those bright spots did not erase the warts in his game. As fun as he was, he was also one of the big reasons we gave up the high quality chances that we did. His utility ends at his current salary/age.

[memphusk]

He cares. He hits. He's rough around the edges. Be foolish not to give him a 4 year deal. Be real foolish to give him 8.

[Redrum]

This team is already going to get destroyed physically with the current makeup, it's hard to imagine losing him. Although without really anyone who can drop them right now it might be better not to provoke other teams with big hits just yet, until somebody is brought in.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by memphusk

He cares. He hits. He's rough around the edges. Be foolish not to give him a 4 year deal. Be real foolish to give him 8.

But that takes no consideration that any contract the Flames sign him to at this point is basically a UFA contract as he's a UFA after this season. Plus he's a sheltered D-man that plays well that way.

That's not how he'll be payed. Expect to pay $4.4-$5.5mil and over 4+ years (and he'll wait until UFA at this point to see what team he wants to go to for that rate). We simply can't do that based on what he is, and there's only a chance he'll choose us at that price, anyways.

[jayswin]

He's literally the best sell high candidate we have on this team right now, as he's a pending UFA that is highly unlikely to be back in Calgary at a palatable contact.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Future Champions get the chance to.

Paying depth players too much money to stick around is a sure fire way to extend the neverending mediocrity that is the longstanding identity of this team.

Over-prioritizing players like Z and defining them as "needs" should be a laughable concept. The guy is a fan favourite because he hits and happened to go off for a hattrick in game 82.

I like Z - he's fun, and in a bull!@#% season he was one of the few bright spots - but those bright spots did not erase the warts in his game. As fun as he was, he was also one of the big reasons we gave up the high quality chances that we did. His utility ends at his current salary/age.

Never miss an opportunity, eh?

You don’t have to call every player valuation or team direction you disagree with “laughable” or “stupid.” And while Zadorov might eventually price himself off the Flames, he is the type of player you need to compliment the Hedmans, and Eichels, and MacKinnons that you want to draft or acquire.

You “need” 18 skaters and 2 goalies, typically. There’s nothing laughable about it, that’s reality. And while it’d be nice to fill those 6 slots on defence with 6 Hedman, you couldn’t afford to. So, you think “what do we need from a guy playing the 4, 5, or 6 role.” And Zadorov, for pretty much every team, bring what you need to that role. That doesn’t mean you suddenly don’t need a Hedman, so relax.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Never miss an opportunity, eh?

You don’t have to call every player valuation or team direction you disagree with “laughable” or “stupid.” And while Zadorov might eventually price himself off the Flames, he is the type of player you need to compliment the Hedmans, and Eichels, and MacKinnons that you want to draft or acquire.

You “need” 18 skaters and 2 goalies, typically. There’s nothing laughable about it, that’s reality. And while it’d be nice to fill those 6 slots on defence with 6 Hedman, you couldn’t afford to. So, you think “what do we need from a guy playing the 4, 5, or 6 role.” And Zadorov, for pretty much every team, bring what you need to that role. That doesn’t mean you suddenly don’t need a Hedman, so relax.

100% agree with this that you need Zadorov types to fill out roles on the team. But when you combine his sheltered role + results + pending UFA, I just see a perfect storm of a player that you don't sign.

He's been sheltered, hiding his defensive weakness, but is big and hits. He has a reputation based on his physical game. He's a pending UFA and Calgary will have very little advantage once the season starts.

Pragmatically speaking that is likely too many factors against getting a decent contact signed for the player, if you could get one signed at all (no reason at all for him to sign in Calgary when he can test free agency). So at that point you have to consider him a rental. Are we happy with him as a rental vs what we could get for him? Not sure of the answer myself. But in no way do I see him in a Flames uniform next season. Just too many factors leading to a major payday that won't be justiied.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Never miss an opportunity, eh?

You don’t have to call every player valuation or team direction you disagree with “laughable” or “stupid.” And while Zadorov might eventually price himself off the Flames, he is the type of player you need to compliment the Hedmans, and Eichels, and MacKinnons that you want to draft or acquire.

You “need” 18 skaters and 2 goalies, typically. There’s nothing laughable about it, that’s reality. And while it’d be nice to fill those 6 slots on defence with 6 Hedman, you couldn’t afford to. So, you think “what do we need from a guy playing the 4, 5, or 6 role.” And Zadorov, for pretty much every team, bring what you need to that role. That doesn’t mean you suddenly don’t need a Hedman, so relax.

Why are you quoting "stupid", I never said that. I said it should be considered laughable.

I also say that over-priotizing a player like Z, which is absolutely something this team has done historically, is a sure fire way to a lack of success (or, you know...the neverending mediocrity)

Prioritizing the players that you need to compliment players of a quality that you do not have prevents you from getting the opportunity to draft the players of the quality that you do not have. If you want a Hedman, a good first step is to stop paying for players that help keep you in the mushy middle.

[jayswin]

Zadorov is the flawed, physical, intimidating D-man you take advantage of when you have him before a payday (and he was excellent, what a pick up!) and then move on from when he's about to get his UFA lottery contract (or better yet get a return for the asset, which it doesn't seem the Flames will do with him).

[Redrum]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

he is the type of player you need to compliment the Hedmans, and Eichels, and MacKinnons that you want to draft or acquire.

We don't have any of those. You need to get those before you completely fill out your roster, lock it in, and throw away the key.

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

You “need” 18 skaters and 2 goalies, typically. There’s nothing laughable about it, that’s reality.

That's why the Flames need to stop throwing money at low end. See how unfunny it is when they can't dress a full team, despite having no top end skill.

[Snuffleupagus]

Despite some faults, the flames need a player like Zadorov more than ever.

[Sandman]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Despite some faults, the flames need a player like Zadorov more than ever.

Don't get me started....

[Flames1217]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Despite some faults, the flames need a player like Zadorov more than ever.

I agree.

You need to have diversity throughout your roster. Having a roster full of players of similar styles makes the Flames easy to gameplan against.

Without Big Z the flames are as soft as they come.

Losing Hanifin would be easier to adjust to than losing Big Z as naturally Weegar could take on Hanifin's role with little to no trouble but no one can currently take on Zadarov's role.

[Sandman]

Damn straight!

[Poe969]

If you plan on having kids make the team, you want someone on the team to look out for them.

The team needs to draft a star player but until they do, the team needs a guy like Z on the team. If someone overpays for him, fine, otherwise keep him.

[Bonded]

If they can keep Zadarov on the team for another two years at his current cap hit then sure but he’s not a guy I would want to give 5 year contract. I feel like some team will give him a Gudbranson special 5x5 contract through and he’ll be a bottom pairing defender getting paid like a top 4 guy.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Future Champions get the chance to.

Paying depth players too much money to stick around is a sure fire way to extend the neverending mediocrity that is the longstanding identity of this team.

Over-prioritizing players like Z and defining them as "needs" should be a laughable concept. The guy is a fan favourite because he hits and happened to go off for a hattrick in game 82.

I like Z - he's fun, and in a bull!@#% season he was one of the few bright spots - but those bright spots did not erase the warts in his game. As fun as he was, he was also one of the big reasons we gave up the high quality chances that we did. His utility ends at his current salary/age.

Every teams "needs" a full complement of players. If the Flames had a prospect who was ready to play, then Zadorov wouldn't be a need. but like it or not every team needs 1 or 2 physicals D men who can match size when teams are grinding you down in the corners. I know that the game has opened up a lot and speed and skill are very important especially on defence. Still, a lot of hockey is played against the boards and crammed Infront of the net.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Snuffleupagus

Despite some faults, the flames need a player like Zadorov more than ever.

Well we have him this year. I don't see him as a priority signing personally (because he's such a high event player good and bad) but with so many defensemen on the roster becoming UFA in the offseason, the Flames are going to have to try and retain at least two of them.