2023/2024 Trade Rumors and Speculation Thread

[Groot]

Last time Buffalo was in the playoffs, Kiprusoff still had 2 seasons left before his retirement.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Royle9

Not singling people out, there are those of you who are critical but also support a rebuild.

But there’s a reason Buffalos roster is more appealing, they’ve gone through a decade of missed playoffs and poor rosters to get where they are.

Everybody knows they rebuilt. The point you’re missing is that the people trading Buffalo’s roster for the Flames is one thing. But that’s not the same as asking if you’d want to go through 12 years of missed playoffs and poor rosters to end up where Buffalo is today and… quite frankly… I don’t know if you’d find a lot of people who would think the juice was worth the squeeze for a rebuild like that. That roster basically has to win the cup for 12 straight years of playoff-less hockey to be justifiable.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Everybody knows they rebuilt. The point you’re missing is that the people trading Buffalo’s roster for the Flames is one thing. But that’s not the same as asking if you’d want to go through 12 years of missed playoffs and poor rosters to end up where Buffalo is today and… quite frankly… I don’t know if you’d find a lot of people who would think the juice was worth the squeeze for a rebuild like that. That roster basically has to win the cup for 12 straight years of playoff-less hockey to be justifiable.

The other thing worth acknowledging, I think, is the amount of luck as it relates to one of their players that got them to where they are now.

Many of the rebuild/blow it up cohort will tell you the only way to get a true elite 1C is to pick one at the top of the draft. Yet, Tage Thompson was selected 26th overall and acquired through trade. He was also on the verge of practically being given away by the Sabres. I think the rumour was at one point the Sabres couldn’t get a 5th round pick for him.

Where are the Sabres now if they did move on from Thompson? I strongly suspect not in as promising position as they are. I like their team and hope they do well but a big part of their success is coming from a guy who wasn’t a top 3 or top 5 pick.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Royle9

Not singling people out, there are those of you who are critical but also support a rebuild.

But there’s a reason Buffalos roster is more appealing, they’ve gone through a decade of missed playoffs and poor rosters to get where they are.

Not singling anyone out or can't actually provide any examples that match your statement?

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by TOfan

The other thing worth acknowledging, I think, is the amount of luck as it relates to one of their players that got them to where they are now.

Many of the rebuild/blow it up cohort will tell you the only way to get a true elite 1C is to pick one at the top of the draft. Yet, Tage Thompson was selected 26th overall and acquired through trade. He was also on the verge of practically being given away by the Sabres. I think the rumour was at one point the Sabres couldn’t get a 5th round pick for him.

Where are the Sabres now if they did move on from Thompson? I strongly suspect not in as promising position as they are. I like their team and hope they do well but a big part of their success is coming from a guy who wasn’t a top 3 or top 5 pick.

Sure. But they traded for Thompson in the first place. They targeted him because people in their organization saw something in him. That’s not fluke. They also turned the huge problem of an unhappy Eichel into Tuch, Krebs, and Ostlund. Their recent picks outside the top 10 have been strong (Peterka @34, Kulich @28). They’ve locked down much of their core at good cap hits and avoided shortcutting the rebuild with anchor veteran signings. They haven’t just fallen into the roster they’ve built. Sabres management has been doing a lot of things right in recent years.

[Calgary4LIfe]

I don't think it is quite right to say: "Buffalo has a good young team because of their 12 year rebuild." That's what I would call a lazy blanket statement.


Buffalo has been a horribly mismanaged team for many of those 12 years. They are finally on good footing now.


People point to them and other teams as 'this is why rebuilds suck'. Those teams needed rebuilds not because they went through their cycle, but because they were terribly mismanaged, had no choice but to rebuild, and then because they were terribly mismanaged, continued to flounder. Teams suck when they are poorly managed whether they are trying to win, or they are trying to rebuild.


I think a well-managed team usually doesn't have to outright rebuild. If it does, I don't think it has to last over 3 seasons. Heck, a team can bottom out for a season or two, and then come up again.



What it needs to constantly do is a combination of drafting and developing well, developing and maintaining a strong culture, and not get attached to depreciating assets, but instead move them at the right time for more futures as the kids underneath show that they should be taking over. It should be a cycle.



I have zero issues with Calgary entering a rebuild because I do believe they are a strong drafting and development team. 9 or 10 years of Buffalo's mismanagement isn't going to change my opinion. Neither is Edmonton's "I think I know a little bit about winning" nonsense. Or Arizona's "what the hell are we doing? Competing? Rebuilding? Moving? Dominating the college ranks?".



How about we look at teams that have successfully rebuilt too, not just the ones that floundered. Boston. Tampa. Colorado. Even in these organizations, they all took missteps, but they won a cup.



I am not even advocating that Calgary absolutely needs to rebuild. I think that Conroy has it going in the right direction with placing higher value on younger players and draft picks, and making sure that the team is built. I do think it is easier to accomplish in a rebuild, but I do think Conroy is doing what he can without rebuilding, and he most certainly can be successful this way too. I am just arguing that people like to point at poorly run organizations and declare them as what you should expect from a rebuild, when the truth is that's what you should expect from any team that is run into the ground.


I also think that Buffalo will quickly be a place that players try to sign in if they take another good step forward this season like they did last season. Not every player will want to be there, but when a team is looking like it might be a team with multiple years' worth of playoffs and competing, there will be a lot more players interested in joining that organization. If Calgary can have a couple of seasons of solid playoff runs, it will suddenly become that as well.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Sure. But they traded for Thompson in the first place. They targeted him because people in their organization saw something in him. That’s not fluke. They also turned the huge problem of an unhappy Eichel into Tuch, Krebs, and Ostlund. Their recent picks outside the top 10 have been strong (Peterka @34, Kulich @28). They’ve locked down much of their core at good cap hits and avoided shortcutting the rebuild with anchor veteran signings. They haven’t just fallen into the roster they’ve built. Sabres management has been doing a lot of things right in recent years.

Agreed on many points, but, wouldn’t Skinner and Okposo be considered anchors veteran signings?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by CliffFletcher

Sure. But they traded for Thompson in the first place. They targeted him because people in their organization saw something in him. That’s not fluke. They also turned the huge problem of an unhappy Eichel into Tuch, Krebs, and Ostlund. Their recent picks outside the top 10 have been strong (Peterka @34, Kulich @28). They’ve locked down much of their core at good cap hits and avoided shortcutting the rebuild with anchor veteran signings. They haven’t just fallen into the roster they’ve built. Sabres management has been doing a lot of things right in recent years.

That doesn’t really change a whole lot. Botterill is the one who wanted Thompson in the deal, he got fired. And whether it was Botterill or Adams, one of them were trying to trade Thompson for a 5th round pick but the other team wouldn’t do it, so that’s the only reason Thompson is still a Sabre today.

That’s pretty lucky, to me. You could argue pretty easily the only reason they have a star like Thompson is because another GM saved them from themselves.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

I don't think it is quite right to say: "Buffalo has a good young team because of their 12 year rebuild." That's what I would call a lazy blanket statement.


Buffalo has been a horribly mismanaged team for many of those 12 years. They are finally on good footing now.


People point to them and other teams as 'this is why rebuilds suck'. Those teams needed rebuilds not because they went through their cycle, but because they were terribly mismanaged, had no choice but to rebuild, and then because they were terribly mismanaged, continued to flounder. Teams suck when they are poorly managed whether they are trying to win, or they are trying to rebuild.


I think a well-managed team usually doesn't have to outright rebuild. If it does, I don't think it has to last over 3 seasons. Heck, a team can bottom out for a season or two, and then come up again.

Provide examples of outright rebuilds that have only taken 2-3 years please

[Hackey]

If a rebuild takes 10 years so be it. I'd much rather go through a 10 year rebuild and come out of it with a legitimate shot of actually winning a cup then hovering around the middle for eternity. And those tough growing pain years would only make the successful years that much sweeter. I'd way rather see them swing and miss then just continue to hover around the middle from a standings perspective and entertainment perspective.

[PepsiFree]

Cool, then let’s do what we’re doing for another 5 years and do a 5 year rebuild after that. Everybody is happy and the successful years will be just as sweet.

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Like Sylvanfan said - it’s not a matter of trading rosters today. Would you trade today for their roster in 12 years. And then only to have an OK but still overall mediocre roster.

Buffalo may make the POs for the first time. Yay. They aren’t winning a cup. Not this year on in a few years. Frankly, with the number of high picks they’ve had, they should have been at this stage a loooong time ago.

Why not? I thought all you have to do is make the playoffs and anything can happen?

[Icon]

I wish there were some rumors

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Agreed on many points, but, wouldn’t Skinner and Okposo be considered anchors veteran signings?

Skinner is 31 with 4 more years left at $9M.
‘He is coming off 33 and 35 goal seasons, and had 82 points last season.

Okposo has one year with a $2.5M cap hit.

That’s not a boat anchor.

[Harry Lime]

Originally Posted by Icon

I wish there were some rumors

Rumor has it Buffalo is looking for Buffalo, but there is a good chance that Buffalo will get in the way of any serious Buffalo, and they may have to run with the Buffalo they have.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Harry Lime

Rumor has it Buffalo is looking for Buffalo, but there is a good chance that Buffalo will get in the way of any serious Buffalo, and they may have to run with the Buffalo they have.

Buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo buffalo buffalo Buffalo buffalo.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Icon

I wish there were some rumors

Rumour has it I’m the one you’re leaving her for.

[Reggie Dunlop]

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Agreed on many points, but, wouldn’t Skinner and Okposo be considered anchors veteran signings?

They were signed 4 and 7 years ago by previous regimes. Since then, Sabres management haven’t fallen into the shortcut trap. And they haven’t been afraid to move on from high pick guys who weren’t part of their long-term plans. Moving Sam Reinhart for Devon Levi and a 1st rounder (that they nabbed Jiri Kulich with) was a shrewd move.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Skinner is 31 with 4 more years left at $9M.
‘He is coming off 33 and 35 goal seasons, and had 82 points last season.

Okposo has one year with a $2.5M cap hit.

That’s not a boat anchor.

Sure, if you look at it through the lens of today.

The point that was being made was the Sabres did not sign any boat anchor contracts during their rebuild, which they certainly did. Or, at the very least, would have been considered boat anchors at one point in time. All you need to do is go back a couple years when it was widely believed Jeff Skinner’s contract was one of the worst, if not the worst, contract in the league. Okposo’s was also widely acknowledged as a terrible/immovable contract.

Things change.