2023/2024 Trade Rumors and Speculation Thread

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I think you’re setting yourself up for disappointment if that’s how you think the Flames should chose to run their hockey operations.

We're Flames fans so we are used to disappointment.

The incremental increase in draft position is kind of a throw in.

The star attraction is the two extra first round picks, a solid prospect like Barlow (or choose whoever you like from that part of the 2023 draft), having all the Monahan/Kadri/Lucic money when very few teams had any, and not having any anchor contracts.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by butterfly

We're Flames fans so we are used to disappointment.

The incremental increase in draft position is kind of a throw in.

The star attraction is the two extra first round picks, a solid prospect like Barlow (or choose whoever you like from that part of the 2023 draft), having all the Monahan/Kadri/Lucic money when very few teams had any, and not having any anchor contracts.

Sure but you’re missing the critical component that the Flames want to compete. So these scenarios you’re laying out are an exercise in futility.

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Sure but you’re missing the critical component that the Flames want to compete. So these scenarios you’re laying out are an exercise in futility.

Perhaps, but we've seen what the alternative yielded.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by butterfly

Perhaps, but we've seen what the alternative yielded.

Yes but that’s not a predictor of what it can/will yield.

That said, If the Flames did go the rebuild route, or even take a step or two in that direction, you won’t find me complaining.

Over the past handful of seasons I think the Flames have been a bit unlucky at times and could have had things go another way. Also, I think they’re primed to bounce back this season.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by activeStick

I will use green text next time since it's obviously needed!

Lol it’s legitimately tough to tell these days

[stemit14]

At this point, I’m assuming the only guy that could be traded before the season starts is Hanifin and that is only because he might be more expendable than Lindholm or Backlund if the team still wants to compete this year.

I wonder what a Hanifin trade would look like if it happens before training camp. Basic layout of the return might be:

Top 10 protected 1st round pick
A- or B+ level prospect
Roster player (to make the cap work)

Does that seem right? If it is, I guess you could apply it to a few teams rumoured to be interested in him. The big question on the return would be how good the prospect is… the more I think about it, I think it would likely be a prospect outside of the top 50 ranked (in general) NHL prospects but within the top 100.

Also, if that is the return… is that worth making the trade or do you keep Hanifin till the deadline hoping to get a better return? Will it get better than that? I really don’t know.


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[Flames_F.T.W]

The Athletic has an article about front office confidence rankings based on fans' opinions and the Flames rank 31 out of 32, with only the islanders being ranked lower. Hard to argue with the results.
Longterm vision, lack of clarity with team direction and the situation with upcoming UFAs are cited as the main reasons for the fanbase's lack of confidence. They do however note that Conroy's patience with making a move may be the best course for the franchise

[Royle9]

31 of 32?? Who wrote this piece, I mean the flames have definitely botched a lot of things especially lately but there are far worse franchises.

Seems a bit odd.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Royle9

31 of 32?? Who wrote this piece, I mean the flames have definitely botched a lot of things especially lately but there are far worse franchises.

Seems a bit odd.

Are there? Most of the middling teams don’t seem content with being a middling team. The Flames on the other hand have emphatically stated that they believe in being middling. John Bean going out there and acting the way he did when they announced Maloney was just Lowe’s “I know a thing or two about winning” rant, but a decade+ later.

That Bean rant shouldn’t be forgotten. The fact that there’s been no real changes to the organization since then is sad. Promoting your AGM and Assistant Coach is doing pretty much everything possible to maintain status quo.

[robertsfanatic]

they must have only polled fans on this site to get that ranking...or other teams' fans are more delusional.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Are there? Most of the middling teams don’t seem content with being a middling team. The Flames on the other hand have emphatically stated that they believe in being middling. John Bean going out there and acting the way he did when they announced Maloney was just Lowe’s “I know a thing or two about winning” rant, but a decade+ later.

That Bean rant shouldn’t be forgotten. The fact that there’s been no real changes to the organization since then is sad. Promoting your AGM and Assistant Coach is doing pretty much everything possible to maintain status quo.

The Flames trade years off from being a middling team to looking like a team on the cusp. Last year it was clear that between Sutter and Treliving that this was not a fun place to be and the differing philosophies, and pressure to integrate a new group at the top of the food chain resulted in a massively disappointing season. This was a team and roster who had 3 key cogs have night late seasons. Mangiapane was injured early and struggled to get as many points last year as he had goals the year before. Huberdeau suffered the most having the biggest drop off in a single year of any player. Markstrom went from an elite goalie in one year to a below average starter last year.

This org has been developing and grooming Conroy and Huska to eventually be promoted from within. Huska gets a lot of credit for the PK which had been a constant positive for the Flames over the past several years. Conroy is loved by the players and has found a few gems through his scouting. Promoting those guys is not locking in more mediocrity. Bean and Maloney commented that they felt this was a good team that underachieved and based on how close they got with their best players struggling it is a believable hypothesis. The fact they have 2 massive 8 year deals kicking in, and many other long term deals on the books it makes sense to run it back rather than force a blow up when the pieces are valued at their lowest.

If multiple UFA’s are walked for nothing, if the current signed players can’t bounce back, and if our prospects who will be given a chance fail then I think it is time to talk about how this org blew it with the decisions they made since Tree walked on them.

[kyuss275]

Originally Posted by stemit14

At this point, I’m assuming the only guy that could be traded before the season starts is Hanifin and that is only because he might be more expendable than Lindholm or Backlund if the team still wants to compete this year.

I wonder what a Hanifin trade would look like if it happens before training camp. Basic layout of the return might be:

Top 10 protected 1st round pick
A- or B+ level prospect
Roster player (to make the cap work)

Does that seem right? If it is, I guess you could apply it to a few teams rumoured to be interested in him. The big question on the return would be how good the prospect is… the more I think about it, I think it would likely be a prospect outside of the top 50 ranked (in general) NHL prospects but within the top 100.

Also, if that is the return… is that worth making the trade or do you keep Hanifin till the deadline hoping to get a better return? Will it get better than that? I really don’t know.


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IMO I don’t think the trade return gets much better at deadline for hanifin. The 1st round pick will be in the latter part of the draft. I don’t see any team upping their prospect to a blue chip prospect. The only difference is they won’t have to take back a meh contract to make it work. That said for players like tanev and backlund , I think their value rises considerably at deadline.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Royle9

31 of 32?? Who wrote this piece, I mean the flames have definitely botched a lot of things especially lately but there are far worse franchises.

Seems a bit odd.

Blame the fans that voted. I'm sure a few may have been Oilers fans chipping in for good measure but a lot of Flames fans don't feel great about the direction of the organization. The front office is simply doing the bidding of the owner that won't accept a rebuild which has put the GM in a difficult situation where they have to make a lot of moves with winning now in mind which isn't always ideal.

[Poe969]

"From middling to being on the cusp..."

Isn't being on the cusp the same as middling? They have blue chip goalie prospect....and some other guys. They don't really have a game breaker on the team or an elite player in any position* or someone to drive a line.

*Huberdeau has to show he can be the elite player he was in Florida. He has talent but it seems like a product of the environment he was in.

This team has to play amazing this year to show they're anything more than average at best.

[Royle9]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Are there? Most of the middling teams don’t seem content with being a middling team. The Flames on the other hand have emphatically stated that they believe in being middling. John Bean going out there and acting the way he did when they announced Maloney was just Lowe’s “I know a thing or two about winning” rant, but a decade+ later.

That Bean rant shouldn’t be forgotten. The fact that there’s been no real changes to the organization since then is sad. Promoting your AGM and Assistant Coach is doing pretty much everything possible to maintain status quo.

Not wrong by any stretch, but franchises like AZ and Bufflo have far botched their teams for YEARS with only Buffalo finally getting out of it a bit last year.

I'm not saying we've done poorly but to be the 2nd worst is a bit of a stretch in my opinion. Voting makes sense though as the Fanbase is tired of it.

[Rollin22x]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Are there? Most of the middling teams don’t seem content with being a middling team. The Flames on the other hand have emphatically stated that they believe in being middling. John Bean going out there and acting the way he did when they announced Maloney was just Lowe’s “I know a thing or two about winning” rant, but a decade+ later.

That Bean rant shouldn’t be forgotten. The fact that there’s been no real changes to the organization since then is sad. Promoting your AGM and Assistant Coach is doing pretty much everything possible to maintain status quo.

You can provide some evidence that they are in fact content with being a middling team.

[CliffFletcher]

Originally Posted by Rollin22x

You can provide some evidence that they are in fact content with being a middling team.

It’s more accurate to say ownership is unwilling to endure short-term pain for long-term gain. No doubt they hope to achieve success in spite of this mandate.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Poe969

"From middling to being on the cusp..."

Isn't being on the cusp the same as middling? They have blue chip goalie prospect....and some other guys. They don't really have a game breaker on the team or an elite player in any position* or someone to drive a line.

*Huberdeau has to show he can be the elite player he was in Florida. He has talent but it seems like a product of the environment he was in.

This team has to play amazing this year to show they're anything more than average at best.

So one season defines a player now?

Over the last 5 NHL seasons, Huberdeau is a top 10 point producer....in the entire league.

No elite talent?

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Poe969

"From middling to being on the cusp..."

Isn't being on the cusp the same as middling? They have blue chip goalie prospect....and some other guys. They don't really have a game breaker on the team or an elite player in any position* or someone to drive a line.

*Huberdeau has to show he can be the elite player he was in Florida. He has talent but it seems like a product of the environment he was in.

This team has to play amazing this year to show they're anything more than average at best.

The Flames won the division in 2 of the last 4 years. Once they were 2nd overall in the league and a top 5 team the other year. Being on the cusp isn’t the same as middling is that a serious question? Middling is fighting for a wildcard spot where on the cusp is a team that appears to be on the verge of being a cup contender.

This team was average last year with top players having horrible seasons. Prior to last year Huberdeau was top 5 in total points league wide over the previous 4 years.

Funny enough we heard people say the Flames had no elite talent after the Canadian bubble year and then Gaudreau and Tkachuk bounced back with 100+ point seasons.

This team has been maddening to watch over the last decade because of the flip flop between being a team that looks like a contender to being a team that is in tough to make the playoffs. Everyone is sleeping on the Flames again so it won’t surprise me if they have a major bounce back this year.

[Robbob]

IMO it is a little early to grade or make a definitive call on the front office. I am glad they are holding their ground on the bigger assets and not making a knee jerk decision. I know it may be bad for fan boards and media that the GMs are playing a game of chicken, but in this market that is what needs to be done to get value for the asset you are trading.

I think once these dog days of summer are over, and the kids play in Penticton, that there will be something more positive to talk about. Or generally just something to talk about that will shift the focus away for a bit.