Alberta Politics & Government Thread 3.0

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Frequitude

And industrial heat supply from cogeneration is in scope.

Really? What a bunch of idiots.

Industrial heat is pretty much the very last thing that should be electrified - if you can use the waste heat from your baseload power (aka cogen) that's a pretty efficient way to use a pretty clean fossil fuel (nat gas). Trying to use high quality energy (renewable electricity) for situations where low quality energy will do (constant industrial heat loads) is stupid.

[accord1999]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

But is that chart apples to apples? Europe tends to be better at showing 'all-in' pricing. Many of the other line items on our bills are proportional to usage, so our actual cost per unit is certainly higher than just the listed rate. Obviously it's tougher to factor/compare the fixed charges

German and European customers also have significant distribution fees and taxes.






https://www.cleanenergywire.org/fact...ay-electricity

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Frequitude

3. A poster and possibly a tweeter who haven’t actually read the draft regs.

Yes, not all needs to be decarbonized by 2035 so he’s factually correct there. But this tweet is completely misleading bait to snare the passionately uninformed.

A bunch needs to be decarbonized shortly after 2035 and long before 2050. And industrial heat supply from cogeneration is in scope. And CER has absolutely nothing to do with demand side requirements like electrification of heating, so I don’t know what that’s all about (it’s just supply side).

If you really want to speak so passionately and frequently about a topic, you should really read the regs and study our generation fleet in detail. Or at very least read sources who assess and explain them using analysis, reasoning, and facts. Do the work.

This has nothing to do with Alberta politics and everything to do with the feds specifically ******* up Alberta’s grid and, assuming you live here, causing either your power bill or taxes to sky rocket. There’s a lot of things to rightfully trash the UCP and Danielle Smith on. Soooooo many. This isn’t one of them. She and they are right here. Stop trying to make it political. You’re going to get ******* here, regardless if you wear blue or orange.

Are you suggesting Andrew Leach isn't a good source? Sorry, I don't have time to read into every issue in full detail, which is why I defer to experts on topics like this. Which he is. Are you?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Muta

So your strategy then is to populate this thread with the same valueless tripe that you say ruins this thread? A+ stuff.

That’s Mr.Coffee’s game. Adds nothing of value, is entirely part of the problem, and then whines about the state of things (bonus points if he can add something about some “brigade” that follows him around).

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by accord1999

German and European customers also have significant distribution fees and taxes.






https://www.cleanenergywire.org/fact...ay-electricity

Right, but doesn't this show that the kWh line item has been about 5-8.5 cents until last year (ie. very similar to here)?

[Frequitude]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Are you suggesting Andrew Leach isn't a good source? Sorry, I don't have time to read into every issue in full detail, which is why I defer to experts on topics like this. Which he is. Are you?

Hella smart guy. Lot smarter than me, that’s for sure. But that tweet is utter political crap devoid of and substantive matter as it relates to the CER.

See that’s the problem with the political climate today. People preferring frothy tribalism more than not getting ******. You chose that freaking tweet to glob onto. One that’s purpose was to call out Danielle Smith instead of discuss the actual subject matter.

Focus on the subject matter. Not on some politician. You and me both are going to get ****** on this one.

Focus on us winning instead of Danielle Smith and the UCP losing.

Again…signed, an NDP voter.

[iggy_oi]

Originally Posted by Frequitude

Hella smart guy. Lot smarter than me, that’s for sure. But that tweet is utter political crap devoid of and substantive matter as it relates to the CER.

See that’s the problem with the political climate today. People preferring frothy tribalism more than not getting ******. You chose that freaking tweet to glob onto. One that’s purpose was to call out Danielle Smith instead of discuss the actual subject matter.

Focus on the subject matter. Not on some politician. You and me both are going to get ****** on this one.

Focus on us winning instead of Danielle Smith and the UCP losing.

Again…signed, an NDP voter.

Ok let’s take all the politics out of it. What sense does it make to voluntarily create this moratorium on all projects when some business proposals could actually address some of the concerns that they are using to justify the moratorium?

[fotze2]

Power grid is fukcled right now. Curtail if you can!
We are at $999.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by fotze2

Power grid is fukcled right now. Curtail if you can!
We are at $999.

Utilities need an A/C kill switch for all homes. That'll shed some load real quick.

[Fuzz]

Wow, wind is really dropping the ball today. ####in' wind, can't trust it.

[fotze2]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Utilities need an A/C kill switch for all homes. That'll shed some load real quick.

That would be a good idea. Retail customers don't pay by the hour but big users definitely do.

They actually pay big users to curtail in grid emergencies. We are getting paid right meow (hopefully).

[BlackArcher101]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Utilities need an A/C kill switch for all homes. That'll shed some load real quick.

I'd start with the War Room.

[timun]

Nah man, start with the Sky Palace.

[accord1999]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

Right, but doesn't this show that the kWh line item has been about 5-8.5 cents until last year (ie. very similar to here)?

But the Germans also had the renewable surcharge, to pay for renewable purchase agreements, before 2022 and that likely distorted wholesale pricing.


And I recall Alberta pool prices were considerably cheaper before 2021-2022 as well, coinciding with the loss of most of the coal capacity and now being NG dependent, especially during hot and cold windless days.

[accord1999]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Wow, wind is really dropping the ball today. ####in' wind, can't trust it.

The Smith Government needs to use this argument as to why it's doing the pause, instead of the weak arguments it's using now.

Originally Posted by fotze2

That would be a good idea. Retail customers don't pay by the hour but big users definitely do.

They actually pay big users to curtail in grid emergencies. We are getting paid right meow (hopefully).

Demand response is a tool to manage peak periods but ultimately, asking big users like factories or industrial plants to curtail or shutdown is a negative. Eventually they might rather go somewhere else where they can run 24/7 without problems.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by accord1999

The Smith Government needs to use this argument as to why it's doing the pause, instead of the weak arguments it's using now.

That's not a great argument, given solar was producing at near max levels. Pretty easy to point out if we had more solar right now it would be handling the peak supply curve, at lower cost than an NG plant.


No, the best argument is still the dead of winter issue.

[Frequitude]

Originally Posted by iggy_oi

Ok let’s take all the politics out of it. What sense does it make to voluntarily create this moratorium on all projects when some business proposals could actually address some of the concerns that they are using to justify the moratorium?

See my previous posts for more elaboration but to summarize, I can get on board with a short term moratorium while the uncertainty around the CER plays out. It has profound impacts on what firm backup capacity and baseload CCGT/cogens will be able to do, which need to be properly integrated with the right level of renewables. Which projects do you have in mind that you’re referring to? I’m sure there’s some babies getting thrown out with the bath water no doubt.

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Wow, wind is really dropping the ball today. ####in' wind, can't trust it.

These are the times I was referring to. When our long hot and cold fronts settle in so we have little wind. See all the gas and coal. More wind/solar don’t necessarily mean less fossil fuel generation.

Originally Posted by Fuzz

That's not a great argument, given solar was producing at near max levels. Pretty easy to point out if we had more solar right now it would be handling the peak supply curve, at lower cost than an NG plant.

No, the best argument is still the dead of winter issue.

You’re 100% correct that it would have been nice to have, but that’s a lot of infrastructure we’d be paying for one way or another to handle the relatively few hours like this. The objective needs to be minimizing overall system cost. And they also wouldn’t help us right now where we’re headed for another $999 hour and zero solar. These summer fronts are also a big issue.

Look I’m not trying to overly denounce wind/solar. They definitely have their role in the right amount. They’re just not the be all and end all (like I used to think) and I’m just trying to highlight for folks that they can really get in the way of a reliable, cost effective, and clean grid of there’s too much of them given their correlation in this province.

[GullFoss]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Are you suggesting Andrew Leach isn't a good source? Sorry, I don't have time to read into every issue in full detail, which is why I defer to experts on topics like this. Which he is. Are you?

Andrew Leach is a smart guy and knowledgeable.

And he's insanely partisan and ideological to the point that you typically don't know when he's trying to pull the wool over your eyes or has drank too much koolade. I'll read his stuff from time to time, but he can't be your only source on a topic. Way too biased and blinded by partisanship. Imo he's lost a lot of credibility. He'll be one of those guys who gets hired to justify an ideological decision rather than to actually find the answer. Which is very sad IMO.

He's also a total ######bag online.

[Julio]

Originally Posted by GullFoss

Andrew Leach is a smart guy and knowledgeable.

And he's insanely partisan and ideological to the point that you typically don't know when he's trying to pull the wool over your eyes or has drank too much koolade. I'll read his stuff from time to time, but he can't be your only source on a topic. Way too biased and blinded by partisanship. Imo he's lost a lot of credibility. He'll be one of those guys who gets hired to justify an ideological decision rather than to actually find the answer. Which is very sad IMO.

He's also a total ######bag online.

'Partisan' usually means supporting one specific political party. I haven't really seen that from Leach's writings.

[fotze2]

Originally Posted by accord1999

The Smith Government needs to use this argument as to why it's doing the pause, instead of the weak arguments it's using now.


Demand response is a tool to manage peak periods but ultimately, asking big users like factories or industrial plants to curtail or shutdown is a negative. Eventually they might rather go somewhere else where they can run 24/7 without problems.

No ####. That’s we are in the market, but I doubt my booster compressors can leave the province unless you invent compression over wifi. Ha ha.