Pentagon releases UFO videos

[soreshins]

'To date, AARO has not discovered any verifiable information to substantiate claims that any programs regarding the possession or reverse-engineering of extra-terrestrial materials have existed in the past or exist currently.

'AARO is committed to following the data and its investigation wherever it leads,' Susan Gough, a Department of Defense spokesman, said.


Carefully worded and left the door just a little bit open………

[Lanny_McDonald]

It’s their job to deny, deny, deny. Where do you think the Orange Overlord learned his lessons?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by soreshins

Strictly speaking they did not deny his claims. AARO said that THEY (and only they) did not have any verifiable evidence of his claims. Grusch said that he reported all of his findings to Sean Kirkpatrick (the head of AARO) and that Kirkpatrick did not follow up with him. Grusch’s claims are that these programs are being kept hidden from everyone (including AARO) so that would be obviously why they have no verifiable evidence available to them. It’s not rocket science.

Didn’t Kirkpatrick also say that Grusch never reported anything to them, refused to speak with them, and has never worked for or represented AARO?

Does he work for them or not?
Did he report anything to them or not?

[Jiggy_12]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Didn’t Kirkpatrick also say that Grusch never reported anything to them, refused to speak with them, and has never worked for or represented AARO?

Does he work for them or not?
Did he report anything to them or not?

If its a he said - he said, I'd probably lean towards believing the individual who made their statements under oath.

[PeteMoss]

This is a hard topic debate because the 'yes UFO people' care way more than the other side.

The one side is like - meh I don't really see it and the other side is like did you listen to the 3 hour podcast where at 1:33:23 this guy says this.

Jammies has been giving completely calm reasonable responses and 25% of the responses to him are someone calling him a blithering idiot.

[Jiggy_12]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

This is a hard topic debate because the 'yes UFO people' care way more than the other side.

The one side is like - meh I don't really see it and the other side is like did you listen to the 3 hour podcast where at 1:33:23 this guy says this.

Jammies has been giving completely calm reasonable responses and 25% of the responses to him are someone calling him a blithering idiot.

I've tried to stay out of the back and forth, I respect everyone's opinion here when it comes to this topic. Its such a bizarre discussion to even be having, how one person can grandstand and state "im right, you're wrong" on this otherworldly topic is beyond me.

that being said, and maybe I missed it, but I don't think anybody called him an idiot, or anything close to that.

[soreshins]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Didn’t Kirkpatrick also say that Grusch never reported anything to them, refused to speak with them, and has never worked for or represented AARO?

Does he work for them or not?
Did he report anything to them or not?

Grusch clarified it in an interview on BBC radio - he said he worked WITH AARO in his capacity as an employee of the NRO and not directly as a member of the AARO team. He has always stated this. Also basically stated that Kirkpatrick is using semantics to distract from the issues being raised.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

I've tried to stay out of the back and forth, I respect everyone's opinion here when it comes to this topic. Its such a bizarre discussion to even be having, how one person can grandstand and state "im right, you're wrong" on this otherworldly topic is beyond me.

Yeah, the 'I'm right you're wrong' stuff is weird. This topic is so vast and untouched that no one here has the final answers. The posts that attack others and disparage or mock or make fun of them for their position, while putting themselves on a pedestal and padding themselves on their backs because they 'know' the answers, are the most insufferable.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

I've tried to stay out of the back and forth, I respect everyone's opinion here when it comes to this topic. Its such a bizarre discussion to even be having, how one person can grandstand and state "im right, you're wrong" on this otherworldly topic is beyond me.

that being said, and maybe I missed it, but I don't think anybody called him an idiot, or anything close to that.

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpo...postcount=2208

[Jiggy_12]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpo...postcount=2208

That is a somewhat aggressive post, I missed that.

I would like to see less of that. We can all get our points across in a respectful way.

This topic creates so much anger (on both sides of the coin), and not just here, its everywhere it gets discussed. Its disheartening.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by soreshins

Grusch clarified it in an interview on BBC radio - he said he worked WITH AARO in his capacity as an employee of the NRO and not directly as a member of the AARO team. He has always stated this. Also basically stated that Kirkpatrick is using semantics to distract from the issues being raised.

Did he basically say that about Kirkpatrick or did he actually say that? Because that would be a pretty specific shot at Kirkpatrick. (It is kind of funny that Lanny got indignant about jammies not knowing the facts and then immediately followed it up by saying Grusch was a member of the AARO, which apparently he was not).

What specific reason would Kirkpatrick have to lie, as a physicist whose job and motivations are similar to Grusch’s?

[Fuzz]

Poll results! Enter here, if you haven't yet:
http://www.polljunkie.com/poll/eaeoqc/what-is-it

• 3.6 tricks of perception(reflections, misinterpreted objects, birds, drones, mirages etc)
• 4.0 Natural phenomena
• 4.0 Secret US tech
• 5.3 Secret other country tech
• 6.1 hoaxes(crop rings)
• 7.0 spooky actions at a distance
• 7.6 SPECTRE or other multinational NGO
• 7.9 extraterrestrial probes
• 8.6 time travelers
• 8.6 we exist in a simulation, so anything goes
• 8.9 extraterrestrial beings
• 9.2 Ancient advanced civilization still on earth/oceans
• 10.1 extra-dimensional beings

Lower values are the highest ranked. So the most likely perceived source is that these are things we are misinterpreting, followed by military projects. It's interesting that time travelers ranks higher than actual aliens. Wish we had more than 11 entries, but we can probably say this is accurate within ±5% 19 times out of 20. That's how you are always supposed to end these things, right?

[mikephoen]

Fun game, rank each of these in the order that you think it could be. My list goes from most likely (1) to least likely (13)


1. tricks of perception(reflections, misinterpreted objects, birds, drones, mirages etc)
2. Natural phenomena
3. Secret US tech
4. hoaxes(crop rings)
5. Secret other country tech
6. SPECTRE or other multinational NGO
7. we exist in a simulation, so anything goes
8. spooky actions at a distance
9. extra-dimensional beings
10. extraterrestrial probes
11. extraterrestrial beings
12. time travelers
13. Ancient advanced civilization still on earth/oceans

[Agamemnon]

I just read 5 pages of the American politics thread and 5 pages of this one. Interesting similarities.

There is a group of people wishing to believe things with no evidence, and another who are evidence-focused. I wonder what the overlap is between people who believe in the GOP and people who believe in aliens? They sound the same to me....... crazy rejecters of the scientific method.

I ran into an issue when doing powerline consultation and EMF concerns - you can't prove the absence of something, its incredibly difficult to do that. Proving the presence of something is easier, but absence? Hard. 'Prove to me aliens haven't visited earth' - impossible, you can't prove the absence of something like that.

If no one can 'prove they have visited earth', then they haven't. Proving and the scientific method is straight forward, all the explanations as to why it can't apply here are noise/nonsense.

This would all be a lot of fun if it weren't for the similarities between alien-belief irrationality and GOP-belief irrationality, QAnon, etc. Its all in the same boat of strangeness.

[Muta]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

I just read 5 pages of the American politics thread and 5 pages of this one. Interesting similarities.

There is a group of people wishing to believe things with no evidence, and another who are evidence-focused. I wonder what the overlap is between people who believe in the GOP and people who believe in aliens? They sound the same to me....... crazy rejecters of the scientific method.

I ran into an issue when doing powerline consultation and EMF concerns - you can't prove the absence of something, its incredibly difficult to do that. Proving the presence of something is easier, but absence? Hard. 'Prove to me aliens haven't visited earth' - impossible, you can't prove the absence of something like that.

If no one can 'prove they have visited earth', then they haven't. Proving and the scientific method is straight forward, all the explanations as to why it can't apply here are noise/nonsense.

This would all be a lot of fun if it weren't for the similarities between alien-belief irrationality and GOP-belief irrationality, QAnon, etc. Its all in the same boat of strangeness.

What's your opinion on the Tic Tac / Gimbal videos released by the DoD, the creation of AARO, and the Congressional Hearings of Ryan Graves, David Fravor and David Grusch? There's been quite a bit of activity in this subject since 2017.

[Jiggy_12]

Originally Posted by Agamemnon

I just read 5 pages of the American politics thread and 5 pages of this one. Interesting similarities.

There is a group of people wishing to believe things with no evidence, and another who are evidence-focused. I wonder what the overlap is between people who believe in the GOP and people who believe in aliens? They sound the same to me....... crazy rejecters of the scientific method.

I ran into an issue when doing powerline consultation and EMF concerns - you can't prove the absence of something, its incredibly difficult to do that. Proving the presence of something is easier, but absence? Hard. 'Prove to me aliens haven't visited earth' - impossible, you can't prove the absence of something like that.

If no one can 'prove they have visited earth', then they haven't. Proving and the scientific method is straight forward, all the explanations as to why it can't apply here are noise/nonsense.

This would all be a lot of fun if it weren't for the similarities between alien-belief irrationality and GOP-belief irrationality, QAnon, etc. Its all in the same boat of strangeness.

It’s disappointing to hear you say that last part. I mean sure, that happens…you get some crossover, definitely.

But it feels like this is a very bipartisan issue with some very astute minds on both sides of the equation. I wouldn’t draw those same parallels and I’ve been heavily researching this since 2017.

It’s a deep mystery that involves so many layers. It’s not just about “UFO’s are aliens!” There is just so much more to this.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

https://forum.calgarypuck.com/showpo...postcount=2208

Try reading the lead up to that comment so you have full context. The whistleblower law is clear and the poster in question was completely ignorant to the law but feeling free to twist representations and facts of it.

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

That is a somewhat aggressive post, I missed that.

I would like to see less of that. We can all get our points across in a respectful way.

You mean like these comments?

"I guess my reductio ad absurdum didn't deter someone who is more willing to believe in the ridiculous rather than contemplate the thought he might be wrong."

"It's a method beloved by academics with no real understanding of the subject they are pontificating upon. “If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bull####.”"

"See, I can make stupid arguments too. You're right, this is fun!"

"This question is absurd on another level, as evidence would be presented to support such a claim, or else it wouldn't be made."

"Ah, the "argument from incredulity" fallacy."

"One day you're believing in joyriding alien visitors, the next day it's "vaccines are broadcasting 5g signals to reprogram our kids' genders!""

"If your beliefs depend on explaining why there isn't any evidence rather than explaining the evidence, you can be almost certain those beliefs are in error."

"I suppose I just like to caution against the idea that "where's there is smoke, there's fire!". Sometimes it isn't fire, it's just various asshats setting off smoke bombs."

"I just find it amazing that the Pentagon can suppress the evidence from the entire world. Now we know where their trillion dollar budget goes - it costs a lot of money to bribe every politician, civil servant and military officer from every nation."

"There are countless well-grounded ideas and facts to marvel at without the far-fetched vapidity of UFOs or ghosts or healing crystals or whatever other extremely improbable popular garbage people glom onto instead."

"No, this subject is only worth debunking. I do think it's highly likely aliens exist. it's just the idea that they are flying around America (and very infrequently elsewhere, for "reasons") playing peek-a-boo with the military and crashing into cornfields that is ridiculous. All the arguments in favour of UFOs being extraterrestrial and intelligent in origin bear the marks of conspiracy theory thinking and thus are as credible as flat earth, fake moon landings, and jewish space lasers."

"I don't even find it very amusing anymore, it's just exhausting. Why do people insist on giving nonsense credence and reality their contempt? It's like they haven't gotten past the teenage phase where you smoke dope with your buddies and indulge each other's seemingly profound bs."

"Try respecting my viewpoint that belief in UFOs is asinine and misguided."

"Yah, I missed adding "being aliens" to my statement. To clarify, UFOs exist, but believing that some of them must be aliens is what is absurd."

"Belief is harmful in itself, most human problems can be traced back to groups of believers, and the habits of belief carry over from supposedly harmless beliefs to malignant ones, and so these end up not being harmless at all."

"Let it go and stop acting like I just burned your Koran in front of the TrentCrimm embassy."

Asinine. Misguided. Absurd. Ridiulous. Stupid. Profound BS. Stupid arguments. Malignant. Garbage. Nonsense.

Do those terms sound respectful? Do you think those terms foster honest debate? But to call out someone who doesn't understand nor bothers to try to understand how whistleblower laws work is harmful to discourse and prevents getting points across in a respectful way?

It's exactly why Ozy created a private group, so those who actually have fun discussing the possibilities of different theories don't have to put up with the horse#### like that tossed around by the poster associated with the above comments. When someone believes they have to go to the lengths to go underground to not face ridicule, would you not say the "civil discourse" has been limited?

Originally Posted by Jiggy_12

It’s disappointing to hear you say that last part. I mean sure, that happens…you get some crossover, definitely.

But it feels like this is a very bipartisan issue with some very astute minds on both sides of the equation. I wouldn’t draw those same parallels and I’ve been heavily researching this since 2017.

It’s a deep mystery that involves so many layers. It’s not just about “UFO’s are aliens!” There is just so much more to this.

It's been framed by a few to say that. If you bothered listening to the group who are open to the possibility of extraterrestrial intelligence being behind UFOS/UAPS you would also find that they are also open to all of the other possibilities as well. This is not as it is being represented here by a few very vocal (passive aggressive) posters. There are many explanations behind what this phenomena could be and one side is open to all possibilities while the other is not. But those open to all possibilities are the brunt of jokes and insults to their intelligence and passion for the subject.

[PepsiFree]

There’s really no sense in anyone playing victim here, because I don’t know if any of the regular contributors have gone without giving and receiving some disrespectful discourse, but I’m sorry, that post is hilarious.

I would sooner believe in aliens without a shred of evidence that I would believe Lanny trying to play victim. He can’t even manage to go a whole post without being disrespectful to Jiggy, who has literally done nothing but be respectful to everyone, and has insulted just about everyone who disagrees with him lol.

Everyone here is open to all possibilities. Being open doesn’t mean the same thing as heavily entertaining one specific possibility or concluding it as the most likely without evidence (as Lanny has). Pretending there are just a few here enlightened enough to have open minds is a bit silly, why even lie about it?

[#-3]

I went

Natural
Hoax
Perception
US Tech
Other Country
NGO
Spook Action
Time Travel
Simulation
Probes
ET
Extra Dimension
Atlantis

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

This is a hard topic debate because the 'yes UFO people' care way more than the other side.

The one side is like - meh I don't really see it and the other side is like did you listen to the 3 hour podcast where at 1:33:23 this guy says this.

Jammies has been giving completely calm reasonable responses and 25% of the responses to him are someone calling him a blithering idiot.

Jammies has been easily the worst "contributor" to this thread

Did you not see the part where he basically announced that he thought it was his responsibility to discourage people from joining the UFO cults/fanatics?

That's quite a bit more than a detached "meh".

The few key detractors have actually been on top of this thread more than most of the rest of us who are entertaining the possibility, except for Ozy.

Ozy has been very calm in his posts but people are being rather disrespectful here and there for seemingly no reason.

Things have begun to flow a little bit better at least, but every so often someone needs to chime in with #### like this and get people turning on each other again.

It's unnecessary. But wanted to call a spade a spade there