What would you say would be a sudden advancement that doesn't flow from previous developments or implementing past ideas as technology allows for it?
The integrated circuit and fiber optics both made astounding leaps forward in very short periods of time. Fiber optics have a very different development arch and went from an illumination technology to a data transmission technology in a very short period of time. Both innovations a result of contracts with the government.
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Originally Posted by Fuzz
I guess I don't understand your argument. We aren't seeing this tech in use because it doesn't exist, or we aren't seeing it because government sits on tech with near infinite value because it's not their job?
If it were our tech it would have seen the light of day, or at least components of it would have. You would see huge innovations in classified projects result in smaller but significant developments in consumer products. Skunk Works does a lot of development that remains classified, but a lot of their innovation ends up in Lockeed products. If it were solely our invention and innovation we should see some of these massive leaps spilling over into other products. We aren't seeing it because it isn't our tech.
Another issue is the desire to remain the king of the hill and maintain secrets. We aren't seeing indications of the tech because the government has classified it. You want to make an issue disappear overnight? Put a classification label on it and compartmentalize access. If it were up to those who developed the tech beyond the reach of the government you would see the technology popping up everywhere.
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Your second point is just being silly. There are 10's of thousands of flights a day, if we crashed at the rate aliens do, we'd not have an aviation industry, unless they are sending multiple times more craft than that, because surly they can travel light-distance scale distances, but can't quiet work out flight in our atmosphere? Are they incredible, or incompetent? I also love your assumptions about their flight systems as if it is fact.
It's silly is it? I think the only silly thing around here is you. You bring up an issue like crashed UAPs and suggest it shows incompetence. I bring up the fact that the FAA reports 5 crashes of the 3,750 flights they track on a given day to show how stupid, and I mean intergalactically stupid, that comment is, and you suggest it is silly? How many crashed UAPs have there been? You make it sound like they are crashing daily, which they clearly are not, yet being observed and reported daily. Those gosh darn incompetent aliens sure could take some pointers from aviation pilots who fall out of the sky daily!
You'll notice I lead with "an" explanation, not "the" answer to the question.
The assumption on the flight systems is directly from testimony who have witnessed them, those who have leaked information, and those who have proposed how such craft could do what they do.
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I'm still baffled by your first points, but sure, whatever.
As to the crashes, you are saying they are so advanced, yet because humans crash, it makes sense they would to. So are they so far beyond us we couldn't comprehend the tech? Or are they not?
Skunk Works does a lot of development that remains classified, but a lot of their innovation ends up in Lockeed products.
On a related note, History Channel's documentary on Skunk Works called 'Secrets in the Sky: The Untold Story of Skunk Works' from 2019 is an absolute must-watch. The history of the SR-71 and the F-117A and other projects Skunk Works does is fricking awesome. The deployment of the F-117A in the Gulf War was an insane story, especially since they had started secretly developing that aircraft in the late 70's. Right from the show - Skunk Works regularly works on tech that the public won't see for another 30 years.
On a related note, History Channel's documentary on Skunk Works called 'Secrets in the Sky: The Untold Story of Skunk Works' from 2019 is an absolute must-watch. The history of the SR-71 and the F-117A and other projects Skunk Works does is fricking awesome. The deployment of the F-117A in the Gulf War was an insane story, especially since they had started secretly developing that aircraft in the late 70's. Right from the show - Skunk Works regularly works on tech that the public won't see for another 30 years.
This is a great example of the ridiculous aerospace tech development curve we saw in the era right after the first crash retrieval program has been speculated (the first speculated being the fascist italy retrieval in the early 30s).
We went from the kitty hawk in 1903 to the Nighthawk in 1981. 78 years between never flying to flying hyper advanced stealth fighters.
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Could also be theorized that any UAP crash may be intentional in order to 'provide' tech to our species or pose as some other gesture. Not saying that's the case at all, but wouldn't rule out that possibility either in the matter of this discussion.
I'm totally, calmly open to the possibility that we are/have been visited too - wouldn't really surprise me either if that's the case. Our species' presence on Earth is limited to mere thousands of years; a mere, microscopic blip in the cosmic timeline. If there's other civilizations that have been around longer, possibly in the millions of years, they would likely be so far advanced in technology that we wouldn't understand it - including the development of trans-medium or multi-dimensional craft that could address the space-time continuum. Our understanding of physics and travel would be incredibly primitive to theirs. Perhaps there are 'outposts' or 'waypoints' deep in our ocean, which would explain some of the 'disappearing of UAPs into the water' stories.
Maybe 4chan guy was actually on to something.
The depths of the ocean are the one place on the earth's crust where people never are and can seldom get to.
If you're going to establish an outpost from where to conduct observations on a place, it would be there.
Planting tech is an interesting thought. Doesn't seem farfetched. given that we don't yet have any accounts of unprovoked aggression, that would make the NHI peaceful in nature, or at least here for different purposes if they are here
What do we (well, professionals) do with primates? We try to show them our ways and see how much they can learn and imitate.
Chances are, an advanced species wouldn't look at this human civilization that is rapidly advancing in technology as just something to watch. If they're anything like us, they would want to help us along at a rate that they see us capable of handling.
Last edited by TrentCrimmIndependent; 07-27-2023 at 12:43 PM.
This is a great example of the ridiculous aerospace tech development curve we saw in the era right after the first crash retrieval program has been speculated (the first speculated being the fascist italy retrieval in the early 30s).
We went from the kitty hawk in 1903 to the Nighthawk in 1981. 78 years between never flying to flying hyper advanced stealth fighters.
Sure, but you can logically follow the tech advances through the decades from test programs to aircraft advancement. Looking at it from that perspective, there is no year where so much changes, or one particularly huge advancement shows up that has no predecessor or anything remotely similar, that you could point at and say "well that's unusual, where did that come from?". Or do you have a specific example? I've had an interest in aircraft, flight, and aerial war history for decades and I can't think of any specific one, can you?
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Chances are, an advanced species wouldn't look at this human civilization that is rapidly advancing in technology as just something to watch. If they're anything like us, they would want to help us along at a rate that they see us capable of handling.
If the aliens were anything like us, they would have nuked us as soon as we nuked ourselves.
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Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent
Looking forward to your Nobel prize for solving the world's food shortages and groundbreaking technology for deep space travel.
Food shortages aren't a technology issue, it's a political and financial issue.
OR.... hear me out... Humans are actually quite smart, resourceful and can create great things themselves.
I'm not disputing that- all my posts in the last page are simply counter points that the notion of lack of massive technological growth is stupid. We have definitely seen a massive, unparalleled in human history pace of technological growth since the rumored beginning of crash retrieval programs.
How about this:
The Germans flew the first ever jet plane in 1939.
The americans didn't rival that until 1942.
Here are the specs:
Performance
Maximum speed: 413 mph (665 km/h, 359 kn) at 30,000 ft (9,144 m)
Cruise speed: 375 mph (604 km/h, 326 kn)
Range: 375 mi (604 km, 326 nmi)
Ferry range: 950 mi (1,530 km, 830 nmi)
Service ceiling: 46,200 ft (14,100 m)
Time to altitude: 30,000 ft (9,144 m) in 15 minutes 30 seconds
22 years later is the first flight of the SR-71 Blackbird.
Maximum speed: 1,910 kn (2,200 mph, 3,540 km/h) at 80,000 ft (24,000 m)
Maximum speed: Mach 3.3[N 6]
Ferry range: 2,824 nmi (3,250 mi, 5,230 km)
Service ceiling: 85,000 ft (26,000 m)
Rate of climb: 11,820 ft/min (60.0 m/s)
Wing loading: 84 lb/sq ft (410 kg/m2)
Thrust/weight: 0.44
Not to mention the ridiculous amount of computerized avionics, material science development enabling stealth and light airframes, and sensor technology the aircraft possessed.
I'm not saying it's DEFINITELY because of reverse engineered tech, but can we not agree that this IS far, far, far beyond the pace of technological development in any other field leading up to this point in human history? To say there were no leaps in technology over the last 80 years is frankly baffling.
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There's been stories from military personnel that UAPs have shut down nuclear silos. If so, they're essentially babysitting us at this point.
You said, assuming they are like us, they are just slowly helping us along. Which is exactly....not like us. No human is trying to usher monkeys to be our equals and if apes had a nuke switch they would be getting taken out before they could do something with it.
Here's a fun link - the 177-page debrief provided to Congress, apparently leaked to News Nation. Some really fun-to-read encounters and stories in there. Many mentions of zero-point energy as well.
March 1974 —A large self-illuminated object hovers above the Romeo-29launch facility at the Malmstrom AFB Romeo Flight missile alert facility near Brady, MT. A missilelaunch officer with the 564th Strategic Missile Squadron reports a nuclear missile countdown is started,and the officer flips the “inhibit” switch to turn the system offline. The system then restartsspontaneously and the missile again goes into launch mode; the officer’s next “inhibit” order doesn’twork. Fortunately, the launch code is false and the missile remains in its pad.
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15 June 2022 — Dr. Amy Eskridge, the 35 year old scientist & co-founder ofthe Institute for Exotic Science in Huntsville, dies in Huntsville, AL. Retired UK intelligence officer Franc Milburn claims she was targeted with directed energy weapons and murdered by a “private aerospace company” in the US because she was involved in the UAP conversation and working on advanced propulsion.
In 2020, Eskridge stated she was planning to present novel foundational work regarding antigravity but needed approval from NASA. In 2018, Eskridge and her father Richard Eskridge gave a talk on behalf of their company, HoloChron Engineering, a gravity modification R&D company, in which they discuss historical and current means of antigravity experiments and modern black projects allegedly developing triangle antigravity craft like the “TR3B.” Eskridge’s colleague Dick Reeves was also involved with the Institute; her brothers Michael Eskridge and Matt Eskridge were not.
I'm not disputing that- all my posts in the last page are simply counter points that the notion of lack of massive technological growth is stupid. We have definitely seen a massive, unparalleled in human history pace of technological growth since the rumored beginning of crash retrieval programs.
How about this:
The Germans flew the first ever jet plane in 1939.
The americans didn't rival that until 1942.
Here are the specs:
Performance
Maximum speed: 413 mph (665 km/h, 359 kn) at 30,000 ft (9,144 m)
Cruise speed: 375 mph (604 km/h, 326 kn)
Range: 375 mi (604 km, 326 nmi)
Ferry range: 950 mi (1,530 km, 830 nmi)
Service ceiling: 46,200 ft (14,100 m)
Time to altitude: 30,000 ft (9,144 m) in 15 minutes 30 seconds
22 years later is the first flight of the SR-71 Blackbird.
Maximum speed: 1,910 kn (2,200 mph, 3,540 km/h) at 80,000 ft (24,000 m)
Maximum speed: Mach 3.3[N 6]
Ferry range: 2,824 nmi (3,250 mi, 5,230 km)
Service ceiling: 85,000 ft (26,000 m)
Rate of climb: 11,820 ft/min (60.0 m/s)
Wing loading: 84 lb/sq ft (410 kg/m2)
Thrust/weight: 0.44
Not to mention the ridiculous amount of computerized avionics, material science development enabling stealth and light airframes, and sensor technology the aircraft possessed.
I'm not saying it's DEFINITELY because of reverse engineered tech, but can we not agree that this IS far, far, far beyond the pace of technological development in any other field leading up to this point in human history? To say there were no leaps in technology over the last 80 years is frankly baffling.
is there anything that hasn't advanced like that though?
Just look at the world's population - https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/ We hit 1 billion people in 1800 and it took 130 years to get to 2 billion. We went from 6 to 7 billion in like 12 years. That's pure technological advances to be able to support that many people.
What is so unique about Earth's atmosphere? If they have come to Earth, they have visited many other worlds. To argue otherwise is not really scientific.
Don't be a goober. How many planets are there in our solar system? How many of them have the same atmosphere? None. They are each unique and very different. The closest to ours is Mars, but beyond that they are all very different and alien. Suggesting they are the same or that worlds don't differ is, how did you put it, not really scientific.
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As to the rest of it, with our non-interstellar technology we've managed to send a lander to another planet and launch and fly a helicopter from it, where the atmosphere is much more challenging to deal with. And we haven't even crashed it.
You have no idea what we have or haven't done with our drone on Mars. They showed a short clip of it taking off and that's it. Good god man, there have been more failures going to Mars than there have been successes. You make it sound like we've mastered traveling in space, which is clearly NOT the case. Of 48 missions to Mars by all nations, 27 have resulted in failure. Only 8 vehicles have managed to make it to the Martian surface. We've left more space junk on the surface that there have been reported UFO crashes here on earth. But we're masters of the domain.
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So ya, I think the "aliens happen to have crashes too" argument is bafflingly silly.
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Originally Posted by Fuzz
I'm still baffled by your first points, but sure, whatever.
It seems pretty much everything baffles you.
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As to the crashes, you are saying they are so advanced, yet because humans crash, it makes sense they would to. So are they so far beyond us we couldn't comprehend the tech? Or are they not?
Beyond us does not mean perfect. I mean, you have to be pretty ####ing baffled to not understand that everything makes mistakes, regardless of how advanced they are.
is there anything that hasn't advanced like that though?
Just look at the world's population - https://www.worldometers.info/world-population/ We hit 1 billion people in 1800 and it took 130 years to get to 2 billion. We went from 6 to 7 billion in like 12 years. That's pure technological advances to be able to support that many people.
Sure, we have not advanced at all in political systems and governance, for example.
The population increase increasing the rate of development is a great argument, but I would need to do some extra work charting various tech development tracks and tying them directly to preceding generation population growth to believe it fully. And as you identified, part of that massive population growth is due to technological growth (though I will easily here say that I sincerely doubt Faber was influenced by NHI tech when he figured out how the process that allows us to enhance food production capacity globally through nitrogen use.)
My point remains, and you have helped it, one cannot state that there hasn't been unprecedented technological growth over the last 80 years. There has been, in basically all fields of science, at a pace that is inconceivable compared to the preceding 2,000 years of tech development.
You have no idea what we have or haven't done with our drone on Mars. They showed a short clip of it taking off and that's it. Good god man, there have been more failures going to Mars than there have been successes. You make it sound like we've mastered traveling in space, which is clearly NOT the case. Of 48 missions to Mars by all nations, 27 have resulted in failure. Only 8 vehicles have managed to make it to the Martian surface. We've left more space junk on the surface that there have been reported UFO crashes here on earth. But we're masters of the domain.
Stop talking out of your ass, Ingenuity has just reached it's 53rd flight, if you search hard enough you can find video of just about every one of them.
Here's it's 52nd flight after going AWOL due to a martian ridge obstructing the line of sight between it and the Perseverance rover.
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