32 Thoughts Podcast update on Calgary

[jayswin]

The issue is, a whole bunch of teams are going to make moves at the draft to shore up positions of weakness and then if the Flames wait until Lindholm is signed around July 1st we will be out a bunch of trading partners for our remaining UFA's. Because of this and my belief that Conroy is being smart about this, here is what I think is happening.

- Hanafin is getting traded regardless of anything and it will happen before/at the draft

- Lindholm can't be signed but the Flames and Lindholm will agree to a deal in principle before or at the draft, with the Flames laying out a plan to him and his agent of which UFA's will be re-signed (Toffoli and Backlund being big ones) to stay competitive with an eye on playoffs.

- If Lindholm is uncommitted and still wants to wait past the draft, Conroy puts his foot down and some combination of Backlund/Toffoli/Tanev/Zadorov/Lindholm get put to market to get in before teams start shoring up weaknesses.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Well he can't sign before the draft.

Conroy has to make a decision on Lindholm's intent and what he thinks the deal will come in at and go from there.

No other GM could do anything else.

Bad feeling? Then listen to offers. Want Lindholm and think he'll sign for something you're comfortable with you stand pat and move on to other assets.

The specifics though? I doubt anyone has that kind of information on what's going on inside the war room.

Insiders (outsiders) are just piecing together tidbits and making conclusions (and no I'm not mad at them or calling them fat!)

I always appreciate the insider stuff. Not sure why fans get so upset at the people that provide them with the juicy rumours they crave. Sometimes they are wrong, sometimes they are right but all of the time they provide us hockey discussion.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by howard_the_duck

We can't rebuild now because we have too many veterans signed to long-term deals. So the answer is to sign another veteran to a long-term deal, if all goes south in a year, then rebuild? That would then just make it even more difficult, and you've needlessly made another long-term investment to a player who spends >half of the contract post-apex.

Now's precisely the time to rebuild. Actually, it was last offseason, but there won't be a 'better' time than now.

When the Lindholm extension starts, these are the contracts on the books with term remaining.

Forwards:

-Huberdeau (7) $10.5M
-Kadri (5) $7M
-Coleman (3) $4.9M

Defense:

-Weegar (7) $6.25M
-Andersson (2) $4.55M

Goalies:

-Markstrom (2) $6M

$39.2M total cap commitments.

They have the ability to dramatically Re-shape the roster any number of ways.

Someone has to play with Huberdeau. Since it can’t be Kadri, it may as well be Lindholm.

If he’s more Backlund than Bergeron by years 6/7/8, it really doesn’t hurt you that much.

There are too many quality pieces on this roster for them to hit bottom the way we might like, so sell high on Hanifin, and get what you can for Toffoli, Tanev and Zadorov - they’re older, slower players and they are not irreplaceable.

If you want to trade Lindholm, it opens up a gigantic whole In your roster that would likely cost whatever you got for Lindholm + something else.

So just keep the guy you have, who wants to be here (hypothetically).

[jayswin]

This is not only a deeper draft, but it's also important that if we're re-tooling/forced small rebuild or whatever you want to call it, that we get those prospects drafted this year from our UFA trades, as much as possible.

A full year from now to even start making draft picks from our valuable UFA trades would be far less than ideal. And that's what will happen if we let Lindholm drag it out past the draft. I don't think Conroy lets this happen.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

I know the actual optics but I also understand how people felt last year so the “outrage” that the flames haven’t put a deadline on Lindholm at the draft this reaction makes sense even though the scenario is quite a bit different than last year. I also think a lot of fans are enamored with the 2023 draft and want immediate draft capital if they move off from Lindholm.

Okay, I suppose one can say that the "outrage" makes sense, but even then, the Flames absolutely should not be beholden to how fans react in the summer. Conroy needs to do what he can to make the team successful in both the short- and long-term, and sometimes that will mean upsetting some of the fans.

It remains silly to be upset about anything that is happening right now.

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[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by jayswin

This is not only a deeper draft, but it's also important that if we're re-tooling/forced small rebuild or whatever you want to call it, that we get those prospects drafted this year from our UFA trades, as much as possible.

A full year from now to even start making draft picks from our valuable UFA trades would be far less than ideal. And that's what will happen if we let Lindholm drag it out past the draft. I don't think Conroy lets this happen.

Sorry why is it important that we draft those player this year?

[dammage79]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Sorry why is it important that we draft those player this year?

The depth of quality in this draft? Plus these guys likely make impacts on the opening night roster of the new barn.

[Username: Flames]

I would love to see the flames trade Hanifin and Lindholm for more first rounders this year.

[jayswin]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Sorry why is it important that we draft those player this year?

This is if I'm reading into Conroys comments correctly - the suggestion that if Lindholm won't sign then we will "go a different direction". To me Conroy has hinted at the possibility of attempting to re-tool/soft rebuild.

To me the idea would be high draft picks/prospects for our UFA's and then see if one or two players end up being NHL successes in the next 2-3 years. Another year is another year. I would imagine if Murray Edwards was somehow convinced of doing this that you would need to get these players drafted and developing asap to show him some results.

Ultimately it's his wagon and he doesn't like his wagon going off the "make the playoffs" track and he's got a new arena coming that he'll want his franchise toy to be competitive for.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by jayswin

This is if I'm reading into Conroys comments correctly - the suggestion that if Lindholm won't sign then we will "go a different direction". To me Conroy has hinted at the possibility of attempting to re-tool/soft rebuild.

To me the idea would be high draft picks/prospects for our UFA's and then see if one or two players end up being NHL successes in the next 2-3 years. Another year is another year. I would imagine if Murray Edwards was somehow convinced of doing this that you would need to get these players drafted and developing asap to show him some results.

Ultimately it's his wagon and he doesn't like his wagon going off the "make the playoffs" track and he's got a new arena coming that he'll want his franchise toy to be competitive for.

It’s important to have goals.

It’s also important to uphold certain promises and commitments the organization made to Huberdeau and Weegar, or at least make a show of trying.

[GioforPM]

I seriously doubt the average fan is clued into the depth of this draft versus others. This board - sure.

But Lindholm could just as easily be traded for a player who gets drafted in 2023 as a pick (in which case they don't even know if that player will be available at the spot they trade for).

[shotinthebacklund]

My biggest concern is waiting on lindholm and allowing that decision to handcuff you from making important timely decisions on the other guys. A sit on hands approach in relation to Lindholm is a mistake in my opinion. Have to know one way or the other pre draft.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by shotinthebacklund

My biggest concern is waiting on lindholm and allowing that decision to handcuff you from making important timely decisions on the other guys. A sit on hands approach in relation to Lindholm is a mistake in my opinion. Have to know one way or the other pre draft.

I think that if Lindholm is not moved at the Draft, then this is a very strong indication that Conroy knows exactly what is going on and intends to have him extended after 1 July. I don't believe that anyone is taking a "sit on hands approach."

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[Steve Bozek]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

I like Lindholm but another contract taking a player to 37 just feels wrong. This team will have too much money tied up in players over 30.

The problem is that, considering the big 2 signed last summer, Lindholm’s the only one deserving a long term contract like that.

[DJones]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Fans started to stop showing up this year in a season where the team wasn't eliminated from the playoffs until game 81.

The team had 100% attendance from 2013-2016 if we want to call that the last 'rebuild' era.

I don't think fans will be as excited to pay 50% increased ticket/concession prices in a new building with a team that has drafted 16th overall for the last 4 years. And short of getting another Gaudreau with a late round pick, help isn't coming.

Well we made the playoffs twice in that stretch. If they can do that then sure, they'll go for it.

[Username: Flames]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

Fans started to stop showing up this year in a season where the team wasn't eliminated from the playoffs until game 81.

The team had 100% attendance from 2013-2016 if we want to call that the last 'rebuild' era.

I don't think fans will be as excited to pay 50% increased ticket/concession prices in a new building with a team that has drafted 16th overall for the last 4 years. And short of getting another Gaudreau with a late round pick, help isn't coming.

Exactly. If this team doesn't get futures this year, they are going to be old in 4 years, and will have no shiny new prospects to look forward to.

Like I said before, I really hope the owners can see this. Last year, I get it, they just wanted to beat the Oilers...but look what happened. They missed the playoffs, and people were losing interest even though they were still in the race.

I'm not saying scorch the earth. All I want is Lindholm and Hanifin getting the flames some blue chip prospects. Something the Flames haven't had since Matthew Tkachuck.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

I always appreciate the insider stuff. Not sure why fans get so upset at the people that provide them with the juicy rumours they crave. Sometimes they are wrong, sometimes they are right but all of the time they provide us hockey discussion.

Exactly. It's the entertainment business.

[mile]

Conroy spoke with reporters just now:

https://twitter.com/user/status/1671611850751098880

https://twitter.com/user/status/1671612607898464256

https://twitter.com/user/status/1671612813146734592

https://twitter.com/user/status/1671612017424347136

[shotinthebacklund]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I think that if Lindholm is not moved at the Draft, then this is a very strong indication that Conroy knows exactly what is going on and intends to have him extended after 1 July. I don't believe that anyone is taking a "sit on hands approach."

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I agree, I am just saying waiting for that decision would be a mistake, not that they are actively making that mistake.

[atb]

The Flames prospect pool is ranked 20th, 21st, and 25th by the Scott Wheeler, Dobber Prospects and Hockey Prospecting. Trading Lindholm, Hanifin and other UFAs for draft capital could go a long way in improving the pool. Signing these 29+ year old players to new multi year deals is a surefire way to end up like the Sharks.