32 Thoughts Podcast update on Calgary

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

.Conroy needs to set internal deadlines when it comes to getting things agreed to in order to protect the team from getting itself into an unfavorable position.

You are assuming that Conroy hasn't set an internal deadline. I suspect that he has, but that it is different from yours.


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[DJones]

8.5M x 8 is an easy yes. If that's all it takes the deal should be done.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

But why jump up and pay the $9.5M just to meet some false deadline that you made up.

If you think it will get done, and you think you can get it done for less than his current $9.5M ask, and discussions are going well, then why make up a fake deadline.

I'd prefer to trade him and get 2023 picks too...but moving past that date doesn't mean you can't trade him still. I actually don't see a lot of teams that are a fit with a 1st round 2023 pick I'd want for Lindholm anyways.

It's not a false deadline. The Flames didn't set a deadline on Johnny, and always believed it would get done. If the terms on the extension are within reach, then don't give up after an hour and sit on the porch like a goon and wait.

Conroy has to think...he's a General Manager, he's got a responsibility - if you have a #1 centre, you don't try and sign an extension for a few days and call it quits (by delaying) - you get your ass back out there and you sign that !@#$ing extension.

...or you trade him at the safer of the two pinch points in the trade market, the NHL draft.

Originally Posted by Textcritic

You are assuming that Conroy hasn't set an internal deadline. I suspect that he has, but that it is different from yours.


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There are largely two trading seasons in the NHL, I think he should make use of the first one available if there's no extension.

[Flames_F.T.W]

Obviously if both sides are close to an extension, setting the draft as a deadline isn't necessary. But by the sounds of it, Lindholm is still non-committal. And considering his decision will affect how they handle the other 2024 UFAs, I think they do need to have a good idea of his intentions prior to the draft.

As others have posted, I'm worried they trade Hanifin for win now pieces to appease Lindholm, instead of a package of futures that will help long term.

[Pickle Juice]

What does volatile mean with regards to Vladar? I don’t know how to interpret that?

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Flames_F.T.W

Obviously if both sides are close to an extension, setting the draft as a deadline isn't necessary. But by the sounds of it, Lindholm is still non-committal. And considering his decision will affect how they handle the other 2024 UFAs, I think they do need to have a good idea of his intentions prior to the draft.

As others have posted, I'm worried they trade Hanifin for win now pieces to appease Lindholm, instead of a package of futures that will help long term.

appease Lindholm or appease Edwards

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by Reign of Fire

This is very concerning; it seems Conroy is willing to run it back with an ageing core with a few of our own prospects sprinkled in and whatever comes back for Hanifin. I was really hoping they consider moving on from Toffoli and Tanev, but if those two are also handed out extensions along with Lindholm, good luck managing the cap in a few years.

Everything Maloney, Conroy and Huska have said this should not be surprising. What we were told was they wouldn’t lose these assets for nothing but they also said they believed in this team and that they underachieved.

I think their top priority is Lindholm staying because he fills the most critical spot on the roster. I don’t like having these big money deals for older players so if Lindholm stays I think Backlund could be moved unless it is truly a hometown discount for Backs.

[TheIronMaiden]

There is never a right time for a rebuild. But having a handful of UFAs to trade, a new coach, and new GM feels like the right time to me.

[Icon]

The note about not forcing him to have a decision before the draft doesn't necessarily mean they don't make the decision for him by trading him before/during the draft. The other GMs are going to be aware there's some uncertainty here, if they put up an attractive offer it may trump whether Lindholm wants to stay or not; he doesn't have a no-trade to block it.

[Icon]

Originally Posted by Pickle Juice

What does volatile mean with regards to Vladar? I don’t know how to interpret that?

I read it as there's lots of goalies around the league that are/could be available, so with multiple options to pick from it could mean anything from multiple offers to pick from, to the Flames being without a chair in the goalie musical chairs game (and be stuck with him)

[Roof-Daddy]

I'd love to see a scenario where after Hanifin is moved the Flames are able to use the assets to bring in Konecny.

Really bolster the top 6 that way, and with any kind of bounce back from Huberdeau, Kadri and Markstrom, this team will contend for the division IMO

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Vinny01

Everything Maloney, Conroy and Huska have said this should not be surprising. What we were told was they wouldn’t lose these assets for nothing but they also said they believed in this team and that they underachieved.

I think their top priority is Lindholm staying because he fills the most critical spot on the roster. I don’t like having these big money deals for older players so if Lindholm stays I think Backlund could be moved unless it is truly a hometown discount for Backs.

Conroy also dropped this in his announcement presser:

"I never want to say that "this team can't win"...because probably that 04 team, I didn't think we were going to win...but we were a good hardworking team, but we made it to the finals.

So, I never want to count a team out, but I definitely think there needs to be some changes"

Lindy's definitely a pretty big pivot point for the team, so I just don't think they should delay a decision on that front (if it is in fact that significant of a decision).

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

It's not a false deadline. The Flames didn't set a deadline on Johnny, and always believed it would get done. If the terms on the extension are within reach, then don't give up after an hour and sit on the porch like a goon and wait.

Conroy has to think...he's a General Manager, he's got a responsibility - if you have a #1 centre, you don't try and sign an extension for a few days and call it quits (by delaying) - you get your ass back out there and you sign that !@#$ing extension.

...or you trade him at the safer of the two pinch points in the trade market, the NHL draft.



There are largely two trading seasons in the NHL, I think he should make use of the first one available if there's no extension.

Subtle Billy Madison reference. Well done.

[Vinny01]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

Conroy also dropped this in his announcement presser:



Lindy's definitely a pretty big pivot point for the team, so I just don't think they should delay a decision on that front (if it is in fact that significant of a decision).

The option to make trades on July 1 I think is as good as making a deal at the draft. The big difference is the picks are going to be at least a year out of they make the move after the draft. I always thought they would be chasing a younger more established player in a Lindholm trade anyway.

It is a problem for me if they enter the season with Lindy on the roster unsigned.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by DJones

8.5M x 8 is an easy yes. If that's all it takes the deal should be done.

This is my thoughts too. 8 x $8.5 is a steal right now IMO. If he hits $10 mil then we should move him

I expect we will be seeing 3 or more guys sign for much more than Mackinnon got on the next year or 2 and some will be $15 or more. $8.5 will look some good when this happens

[Kipper_3434]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

This seems shortsighted. I expect they will eventually agree to a deal, as much as I want them to trade him... but if they do end up trading him, I like the odds of us getting a better deal at/before the draft.

Trade deadline is almost always the best time to sell for a big return. Only risks are injury or poor performance. Only benefit of selling now (for a smaller return presumably) is less risk, a bit of cap space and the Flames could get a better draft position due to poor performance.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by DoubleK

Not as a #1C, which is what he would be in Calgary.

If he insists on an 8 year deal, you have to move him. If it's 6 or preferably 5 years, he can have Horvat money with no trade protection.

Lol. If the Flames wouldn’t sign him to an 8 year deal then he’d already be gone. Another team would definitely give him the Horvat contract. Anything less than that and he is signing for a discount. If you want a rebuild you better hope he says he is out.

[really?]

Originally Posted by Icon

The note about not forcing him to have a decision before the draft doesn't necessarily mean they don't make the decision for him by trading him before/during the draft. The other GMs are going to be aware there's some uncertainty here, if they put up an attractive offer it may trump whether Lindholm wants to stay or not; he doesn't have a no-trade to block it.

Totally agree here. Unless Lindholm is absolutely set on re-signing in Calgary, and doesn't care about winning there is little chance he would sign before the draft. Too many moving pieces to anticipate where the club will be next year, let alone 3-4 years down the road. If CConroy adopted such a deadline, that would basically amount to a concession that Lindholm was moving by the draft, and he'd be tying his own hands.

The issue is how much control is management willing to cede to Lindholm in driving the direction of the team. If he only re-signs in the event that he approves of moves that he sees as win-now deals, then management will likely have to cash in the future to get his signature on paper. If that is the scenario the Flames probably will have 3 years, tops, to win, after that there will be some major pain with their seasoned roster and lengthy deals. If they don't win a cup during that period and have pursued this path that fate will lie clearly on the shoulders of CConroy and Elias Lindholm.

I would have to believe management sees it this way, and is leaving themselves room to maneuver. It may be that Elias Lindholm is moved by Sunday, and he may sign an extension in a month, but putting a gun to his head at this point would likely only weaken the team's hand. If they enter the season with him unsigned, that would be a problem, and I would imagine that CConroy's actual deadline is a date between the draft and the opening of the season.

[Cleveland Steam Whistle]

It never ceases to amaze me how much people assume we are getting the full picture from the insiders, even the good ones, like Friedman. Especially when it comes to the the finer details, like if the team has set an internal deadline on Lindholm.

Way to much concern and jumping to conclusion, when Friedman reports "we aren't putting pressure on Lindholm" meaning Conny is going to just repeat the mistakes of the past.

It could mean that. It could also mean he has a different deadline than some people want. Or it could mean, nothing, and he has a hard deadline. Or it might just be what the Flames want out there or have communicated to Lindy. Maybe they want him to feel like he's in control, because that's the best way for the Flames to get what they want, but if he doesn't make a move, they'll shift tune.

I just wish people wouldn't assume we get the full picture from what's reported, it's often wrong, even from the credible sources. And delay their disappointment and judgements until things actually unfold.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Kipper_3434

Trade deadline is almost always the best time to sell for a big return. Only risks are injury or poor performance. Only benefit of selling now (for a smaller return presumably) is less risk, a bit of cap space and the Flames could get a better draft position due to poor performance.

I really don't think that's always true.

1. You could have more bidders. We have little idea what the standings will look like next season, even the bad teams this year may think a trade or two can turn things around.

2. You have more time to find the right bidder.

3. The acquiring team may place more value on adding a player from the start of the year rather than for just 6 weeks of the regular season.

4. The player can have an even worse year and depreciate their trading value.

5. They can get hurt and become untradeable.

All of this tells me the Flames can't take that risk. We are already IMO the most asset poor organization in the league.