[Rumour] Flames to name Conroy GM. Nonis in an executive role; Iginla advisor

[chedder]

Originally Posted by Boreal

Conroy is also & always has been Canadian.



His Dad is from Ontario and he played college hockey in upstate New York then stayed, where Craig grew up.

How so? He was born and raised in New York. Played in the U.S. through college, played on two U.S. National teams, including the Olympics. Yes, his father was born in Ontario, but every listing for Craig says he is American. (Maybe he has dual citizenship?)

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Come on now, BoLevi definitely has a valid point.

Gaudreau, Tkachuk, anybody that gets traded here (Hanifin)... they are not here by choice. They are here because they are restricted FA and have far less control on outcomes or because their contract got traded here.

To flip the script here, outside of Coleman, who Calgary arguably overpaid in free agency, which Americans are UFAs signing long-term contracts to stay in Canada?

Let's not pretend Calgary is a destination city because we have guys that we drafted agree to stay when they were in RFA status. Hell, Tkachuk still had a year to go and was signaling to trade him.

IMO you go with best player available, which, if such player happens to be American you need to fully vet and understand what they're like. Their personality, upbringing, where / how they grew up, their parents / values, etc. You can probably get a good sense through that due diligence to know if a guy will stick in Calgary or not, and if you see any red flags you should monetize the asset. Coronato could be a good example where you trade a great prospect to get good futures in return by doing such an exercise. Beyond BPA, you should be preferentially selecting western Canadians IMO.

Europeans are a different game, they seem to be willing to play anywhere. It's Americans specifically that are an issue and especially with the stupid NCAA rule where you can get burned pretty badly. Russians have a similar "flakiness" factor.

I think Covid and shutdowns were a big factor for Gaudreau and Tkachuk but they will fade into memory.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Come on now, BoLevi definitely has a valid point.

Gaudreau, Tkachuk, anybody that gets traded here (Hanifin)... they are not here by choice. They are here because they are restricted FA and have far less control on outcomes or because their contract got traded here.

To flip the script here, outside of Coleman, who Calgary arguably overpaid in free agency, which Americans are UFAs signing long-term contracts to stay in Canada?

Let's not pretend Calgary is a destination city because we have guys that we drafted agree to stay when they were in RFA status. Hell, Tkachuk still had a year to go and was signaling to trade him.

IMO you go with best player available, which, if such player happens to be American you need to fully vet and understand what they're like. Their personality, upbringing, where / how they grew up, their parents / values, etc. You can probably get a good sense through that due diligence to know if a guy will stick in Calgary or not, and if you see any red flags you should monetize the asset. Coronato could be a good example where you trade a great prospect to get good futures in return by doing such an exercise. Beyond BPA, you should be preferentially selecting western Canadians IMO.

Europeans are a different game, they seem to be willing to play anywhere. It's Americans specifically that are an issue and especially with the stupid NCAA rule where you can get burned pretty badly. Russians have a similar "flakiness" factor.

Off the top of my head

JT Miller
Auston Matthews (signed a 5...see what happens next)
Brady Tkachuk
Drake Batherson


No one said Calgary is a "destination" city for anyone UFA. It very much isnt.

What this is about is drafting...and you ALWAYS take BPA other than Russians for completely different reasons.

Like Fox, if a guy says no, they you deal him.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Boreal

Conroy is also & always has been Canadian.

His Dad is from Ontario and he played college hockey in upstate New York then stayed, where Craig grew up.

He was literally born and raised in Potsdam New York...what are you talking about?


He still summers in NY....well did until today im guessing.

[Boreal]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

Come on now, BoLevi definitely has a valid point.

Gaudreau, Tkachuk, anybody that gets traded here (Hanifin)... they are not here by choice. They are here because they are restricted FA and have far less control on outcomes or because their contract got traded here.

To flip the script here, outside of Coleman, who Calgary arguably overpaid in free agency, which Americans are UFAs signing long-term contracts to stay in Canada?

Let's not pretend Calgary is a destination city because we have guys that we drafted agree to stay when they were in RFA status. Hell, Tkachuk still had a year to go and was signaling to trade him.

IMO you go with best player available, which, if such player happens to be American you need to fully vet and understand what they're like. Their personality, upbringing, where / how they grew up, their parents / values, etc. You can probably get a good sense through that due diligence to know if a guy will stick in Calgary or not, and if you see any red flags you should monetize the asset. Coronato could be a good example where you trade a great prospect to get good futures in return by doing such an exercise. Beyond BPA, you should be preferentially selecting western Canadians IMO.

Europeans are a different game, they seem to be willing to play anywhere. It's Americans specifically that are an issue and especially with the stupid NCAA rule where you can get burned pretty badly. Russians have a similar "flakiness" factor.

There is no validity in his point whatsoever.

None of this makes any sense. Prioritizing geography in any almost any sense gives you Sutter's abysmal draft record, or Montreal’s periodic lost ways focusing on French Canadian.

Even the Russian issues of longer convoluted timelines can quickly blow up in a teams face. This was the case in the late 80s & early 90's. Jags dropped in the draft because of his perceived issues of playing sooner than later. Mischov will be interesting this year to see what happens.

This is a profession. They are selecting, and developing athletes that want to be professionals. The notion that there is added value from selecting western Canadians is absurd.

Adam Fox didn’t sign, but should the Flames have selected AHL/ECHLers Josh Anderson from Nainaimo or Hudson Elyniuk from Calgary?

Neither of those would have been anywhere close to considerations in the Lindholm Hanifin acquisition.

Tkachuk didn’t sign because he felt the organization didn’t have loyalty for him to sign him to a long term deal after his entry level contract. Ottawa did & his brother was happy to sign. Tkachuk is also Canadian, as his mother is from Winnipeg, and his uncle is an NHL agent. His family knows how the business is run better than almost anyone.

A draft pick is an asset, you maximize the asset based on how your organization operates. Prioritizing geography in any way is lunacy and ties one hand behind your back.

Unsuccessful teams are unsuccessful because of unsuccessful ideas like this.

[Hockey_Ninja]

Rhett brought up an interesting point on Barn Burner just now about the people comparing bringing Iggy and Conroy in to Lowe and MacTavish: He said Iginla and Conroy never won a cup and he thinks they will have a bigger chip on their shoulders to try to win than the Oilers boys who already won multiple cups

[OutOfTheCube]

Originally Posted by Hockey_Ninja

Rhett brought up an interesting point on Barn Burner just now about the people comparing bringing Iggy and Conroy in to Lowe and MacTavish: He said Iginla and Conroy never won a cup and he thinks they will have a bigger chip on their shoulders to try to win than the Oilers boys who already won multiple cups

I just think Conroy and Iginla are intelligent and likeable while Lowe and MacTavish are dumb dickheads. You can be a decent hockey player and an idiot.

[timun]

Originally Posted by 868904

Huska has won a championship before as a head coach and has a ton of coaching experience. He was an assistant here under some pretty terrible coaches and one great coach who had the game pass him by. Hard to know where his contributions start and end. He has been credited with developing Razzy and Oliver though.

If you look at coaching records alone, he’s probably more qualified than Love.

Love is a two time AHL Coach of the Year but no championship on his resume. I’m kind of disappointed the Wranglers are out, I’ve lost some hope for Love and Wolf due to this. The results haven’t met the hype. Championships matter and both weren’t very good against CV.

I’m not sure there is that much to choose between them.

Ryan Huska won one WHL championship about 15 years ago. Big whoop: this is the show, not juniors. Love has done more than Huska ever did at the AHL level.

If you've lost hope in Love and Wolf because they were knocked out in overtime in Game 5 of a best in five, facing far and away the best team in the Calder Cup playoffs not named 'Calgary Wranglers'... I don't know what to tell you.

[AustinL_NHL]

Originally Posted by Hockey_Ninja

Rhett brought up an interesting point on Barn Burner just now about the people comparing bringing Iggy and Conroy in to Lowe and MacTavish: He said Iginla and Conroy never won a cup and he thinks they will have a bigger chip on their shoulders to try to win than the Oilers boys who already won multiple cups

Self plug, but ya.

This is nothing like what the Oilers did. Completely different generation of players and completely different circumstances.

Originally Posted by AustinL_NHL

Nah. The Oilers were a bunch of I've-already-won-multiple-times-so-obviously-we-know-exactly-what-we're-doing-and-are-going-to-do-things-our-way.

For the Flames, this would be a group of former players that are not only some of the most loved the organization has ever had, but suffered crushing defeats, never won anything, and have a burning desire to not only win, but look at things in whatever unique perspective(s) it takes to win.

Ezpez

[BoLevi]

Originally Posted by Boreal

There is no validity in his point whatsoever.

None of this makes any sense. Prioritizing geography in any almost any sense gives you Sutter's abysmal draft record, or Montreal’s periodic lost ways focusing on French Canadian.

Even the Russian issues of longer convoluted timelines can quickly blow up in a teams face. This was the case in the late 80s & early 90's. Jags dropped in the draft because of his perceived issues of playing sooner than later. Mischov will be interesting this year to see what happens.

This is a profession. They are selecting, and developing athletes that want to be professionals. The notion that there is added value from selecting western Canadians is absurd.

Adam Fox didn’t sign, but should the Flames have selected AHL/ECHLers Josh Anderson from Nainaimo or Hudson Elyniuk from Calgary?

Neither of those would have been anywhere close to considerations in the Lindholm Hanifin acquisition.

Tkachuk didn’t sign because he felt the organization didn’t have loyalty for him to sign him to a long term deal after his entry level contract. Ottawa did & his brother was happy to sign. Tkachuk is also Canadian, as his mother is from Winnipeg, and his uncle is an NHL agent. His family knows how the business is run better than almost anyone.

A draft pick is an asset, you maximize the asset based on how your organization operates. Prioritizing geography in any way is lunacy and ties one hand behind your back.

Unsuccessful teams are unsuccessful because of unsuccessful ideas like this.

This is a naive take.

Adam Fox is an extreme example but a good one. Adam Fox asset value as a player to the Flames was much higher than his trade value to the Flames or really any other team. In much the same way that a player who is about to go UFA has less asset value than a lesser player that has term on a cheap contract.

You are assuming that BPA is equal to the Best Asset Available. That is proving to not be the case with some players, with a strong correlation to American player specifically.

Draw up a list of NHL contracts and cross-reference them with no move clauses and then citizenship, and I am confident you would see a trend.

Even the mighty maple leafs are the victim of this. Nobody will be surprised if Matthews signs an extension with either a NM clause or no-trade list with every Canadian club on it. That will reduce his asset value to the Leafs.

[BoLevi]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Brady Tkachuk

How can you tell if you got a Matthew or a Brady?

You can't, reliably. Drafting is an art not a science. On all but the highest draft positions, it is likely the "best non-American player" available has similar probabilities of success to the "best player available".

[GioforPM]

Fox is a terrible example of a reason not to draft American players. 3rd round pick with zero decent prospects in the vicinity and he was used as a trading chip. No other draftee who they reasonably had in their sights would have been as good a pick.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Can't wait to see Calgary boy Matt Phillips light it up for the youth-focused Conroy Flames while Sutter watches on the tube from the ranch.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Fox is a terrible example of a reason not to draft American players. 3rd round pick with zero decent prospects in the vicinity and he was used as a trading chip. No other draftee who they reasonably had in their sights would have been as good a pick.

No doubt.

Imagine using Johnny Gaudreau (4th rounder that played here 9 years), Adam Fox (3rd rounder that won a Norris, and was worth more than his 3rd rounder status), and Matthew Tkachuk (home run at 6th OV) as reasons not to draft Americans.

Those outcomes are telling me we should draft more Americans.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Please no why

https://twitter.com/user/status/1661143031058407424

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Please no why

https://twitter.com/user/status/1661143031058407424

No. No no F no!

[Hockey_Ninja]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Please no why

https://twitter.com/user/status/1661143031058407424

Ugh.......

[ComixZone]

I’d put chances of Gallant being the Head Coach at near zero. It doesn’t fit, at all.

[mile]

After what Conroy said about the HC and GM being a team and growing together, I can't imagine Gallant would be hired.


Management will probably do their due diligence and interview him but I can't see it happening, especially with the reports about Gallant and Drury butting heads during the Devils-Rangers series

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by OutOfTheCube

I just think Conroy and Iginla are intelligent and likeable while Lowe and MacTavish are dumb dickheads. You can be a decent hockey player and an idiot.

Those two pairs are incomparable.

Most people would have a higher regard for Iggy's pinky finger than either of Lowe or McTavish.