05-11-2023, 12:11 PM
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#2241
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Calgary
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I don't think it was so much the Flames structure that was the issue, it was the ludicrously bad chemistry everywhere. If the Flames were a puzzle last season , the border was done but the rest was in a pile in the middle of it.
Sutters vision of how to deploy his assets on the ice had cataracts. Likely due to old age and being a curmudgeon.
__________________
"Everybody's so desperate to look smart that nobody is having fun anymore" -Jackie Redmond
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05-11-2023, 12:22 PM
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#2242
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Memento Mori
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dustygoon
At employee and management levels that's true. But if you are a senior exec or partner and you leave? Then non-competes hold. There are specific laws allowing enforceability (at least in California).
I only say this because it makes sense...ya there is a right to make a living, but the loss of a key person can effect the viability of the business.
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Sure, but mostly because execs have equity and often-ridiculous severance clauses that pay out when the exec leaves for any reason whatsoever (including if the exec quits), even if said reasons are situations like getting arrested.
I don't think any of those things apply to NHL GMs.
__________________
If you don't pass this sig to ten of your friends, you will become an Oilers fan.
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05-11-2023, 12:33 PM
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#2243
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Franchise Player
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05-11-2023, 12:38 PM
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#2244
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Vancouver
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Toonage
^^ Love that first quote. The complete opposite of how Sutter had the team play.
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I'm impressed with Maloney and his read on things, and his approach so far. Seems like a very smart guy to have steering things right now. I like a lot of what he's been saying.
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A few weeks after crashing head-first into the boards (denting his helmet and being unable to move for a little while) following a hit from behind by Bob Errey, the Calgary Flames player explains:
"I was like Christ, lying on my back, with my arms outstretched, crucified"
-- Frank Musil - Early January 1994
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05-11-2023, 12:43 PM
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#2245
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
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If anyone was wondering what Ted Kyzinski has been doing...
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05-11-2023, 12:46 PM
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#2246
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Bay Area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shazam
Sure, but mostly because execs have equity and often-ridiculous severance clauses that pay out when the exec leaves for any reason whatsoever (including if the exec quits), even if said reasons are situations like getting arrested.
I don't think any of those things apply to NHL GMs.
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Contract terms with payouts upon quitting is not my point.
Someone brought up non-compete laws being unenforceable.
Rules vary, but they are in fact enforceable across a lot of jurisdictions if the person is key enough. Which is my point. Not worth arguing it, as you are right....i don't think this applies formally to GM's.
More that the sentiment of a key person leaving can have outsized negative effects on his/her old workplace and should be handled a little differently.
NHL is its own little sandbox with its own rules/norms. I don't know what exists
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"Fun must be always!" - Tomas Hertl
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05-11-2023, 12:53 PM
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#2247
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Franchise Player
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I see both sides having legit positions here; the timing is unfortunate.
Maybe these contracts between clubs and management should terminate on the day in the particular year that the season has ended for the subject club, as opposed to June 30.
One thing remains certain around these parts - the hate for Murray Edwards.
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05-11-2023, 12:56 PM
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#2248
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Vancouver
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I think it would be a worse look for the GM to quit claiming he his burnt out and needs time off, only to join another organization a few weeks later. I don't see it any different than a player going UFA. You want to leave, then fine, but the team doesn't owe you anything. You don't get the right to start negotiating with other teams, and if the team wants to grant that, then they should get something in return.
If another organization wants him that badly while he is still under contract with the Flames, they will negotiate a way to get him. If it's not worth it for them to do that, he likely wouldn't be getting the job anyway.
__________________
"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
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05-11-2023, 12:56 PM
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#2249
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: Pickle Jar Lake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dammage79
I don't think it was so much the Flames structure that was the issue, it was the ludicrously bad chemistry everywhere. If the Flames were a puzzle last season , the border was done but the rest was in a pile in the middle of it.
Sutters vision of how to deploy his assets on the ice had cataracts. Likely due to old age and being a curmudgeon.
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You just reminded me of that time I tried to do a Mario puzzle.
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05-11-2023, 12:59 PM
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#2250
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FlamesAddiction
I think it would be a worse look for the GM to quit claiming he his burnt out and needs time off, only to join another organization a few weeks later.
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Treliving never said this.
The man did a lot of respectable things for this organization. He was great in the community. He treated fans kindly. By all admissions, his players liked him, and the team wanted him back.
Why the Flames would allow this, knowing the bad PR it would create, and given the bad PR this team has seen for the last four weeks - it is bewildering.
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05-11-2023, 01:03 PM
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#2251
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manhattanboy
I see both sides having legit positions here; the timing is unfortunate.
Maybe these contracts between clubs and management should terminate on the day in the particular year that the season has ended for the subject club, as opposed to June 30.
One thing remains certain around these parts - the hate for Murray Edwards.
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I guarantee the date was chosen on purpose and I'd guess a lot of contracts are the same in the NHL. Draft day is important. Teams think they have an edge with their scouting staff and there are also potential trades to be made. The NHL is a zero sum game at the end of the day for staff. Anything besides a cup win doesn't matter.
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05-11-2023, 01:06 PM
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#2252
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
Treliving never said this.
The man did a lot of respectable things for this organization. He was great in the community. He treated fans kindly. By all admissions, his players liked him, and the team wanted him back.
Why the Flames would allow this, knowing the bad PR it would create, and given the bad PR this team has seen for the last four weeks - it is bewildering.
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I don't think there is much bad PR outside of the people who are looking to complain about the Flames.
https://forums.hfboards.com/threads/...vling.2928216/
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05-11-2023, 01:06 PM
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#2253
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bonded
I guarantee the date was chosen on purpose and I'd guess a lot of contracts are the same in the NHL. Draft day is important. Teams think they have an edge with their scouting staff and there are also potential trades to be made. The NHL is a zero sum game at the end of the day for staff. Anything besides a cup win doesn't matter.
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Then what's the issue? Why are the Flames being criticized so badly by Pinder and others?
Given the god awful year the team had I don't blame them for being angry and taking a hard line.
Things around the office have not been worse for years.
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05-11-2023, 01:07 PM
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#2254
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Franchise Player
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We don't even know if a team or BT has asked for permission. Overblown.
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05-11-2023, 01:11 PM
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#2255
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Franchise Player
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Manhattanboy
Then what's the issue? Why are the Flames being criticized so badly by Pinder and others?
Given the god awful year the team had I don't blame them for being angry and taking a hard line.
Things around the office have not been worse for years.
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Answered above. I think the main people who have an issue with it are the people who are looking to complain or work in a job/industry where the day to day isn't that competitive. If I give notice I am getting walked out the door the same day because I can I can potentially go to a competitor and trade against my old employer. Even two weeks later it is much less of an edge.
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05-11-2023, 01:14 PM
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#2256
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Powerplay Quarterback
Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: CGY
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I have zero issues with the Flames choosing to not allow him to speak to teams. He has a contract active, he is being paid for the length of that contract. Why would you ever allow him to walk to another team. Especially if Conroy is your guy at GM. He would know your drafting philosophy and free agent interests. I dont mean to imply Treliving would do it our of malice, but its fair to assume Conroy and his mentor for the last decade think alike.
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05-11-2023, 01:17 PM
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#2257
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Income Tax Central
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
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Yeah...I'm guessing that the Treliving 'mutual' separation thing...wasnt very 'mutual.'
And while we're hearing that Brad left...I'm thinking it was the other way around.
Ownership approved a bunch of big moves and big contracts and Treliving's team didnt deliver.
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The Beatings Shall Continue Until Morale Improves!
This Post Has Been Distilled for the Eradication of Seemingly Incurable Sadness.
The World Ends when you're dead. Until then, you've got more punishment in store. - Flames Fans
If you thought this season would have a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention.
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05-11-2023, 01:23 PM
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#2258
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: still in edmonton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Locke
Yeah...I'm guessing that the Treliving 'mutual' separation thing...wasnt very 'mutual.'
And while we're hearing that Brad left...I'm thinking it was the other way around.
Ownership approved a bunch of big moves and big contracts and Treliving's team didnt deliver.
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So Sutter won, until he didn't?
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05-11-2023, 01:23 PM
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#2259
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Franchise Player
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I would not be upset if Conroy was passed over.
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05-11-2023, 01:24 PM
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#2260
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Franchise Player
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Vancouver
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashasx
Treliving never said this.
The man did a lot of respectable things for this organization. He was great in the community. He treated fans kindly. By all admissions, his players liked him, and the team wanted him back.
Why the Flames would allow this, knowing the bad PR it would create, and given the bad PR this team has seen for the last four weeks - it is bewildering.
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It seems that Treliving did say that, at least to Maloney and the Flames. Maloney, who was almost in tears announcing Treliving's departure showing how close they are, and has had a professional relationship with him for over a decade, said that he doesn't expect him to work next season because he needs to take a break. I doubt that Maloney would put those words in his mouth if that wasn't the discussion they had.
The PR look is in the eye of the beholder. I don't see it as negative at all.
__________________
"A pessimist thinks things can't get any worse. An optimist knows they can."
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