[News] Calgary, Alberta, & CSEC agree in principle to $1.223bn Event Centre + infrastructure

[FormerPresJamesTaylor]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

But they haven't and they won't.

Great, they can piss off then.

[Derek Sutton]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Would infrastructure and opportunities for business development not also be a wise investment?

Well, the thing is, the government has no clue how to address the issues with our health care…. So they announce funding for a hockey rink which will make headlines for the next few weeks. Real problems, like 30,000 residents of Lethbridge not being able to find a family doctor, go by the wayside for the time being.

[GullFoss]

In what world is no one investing in the city with one of the highest rates of head office jobs per capita in North America? Or in the city with one of the fastest population growths in the OECD with 1m+ population? Or in the city with one of the most affordable house prices relative to household income? Or in the city with one of the highest median income in Canada?

No one is investing in this city apparently. And it's a dump of a downtown apparently. But a new arena will change all that. Apparently.

[Goriders]

Originally Posted by GordonBlue

If Calgary votes in the UCP because of this, your city will be the biggest =NG this province has ever seen.

would you really vote UCP because of a bribe or two for Calgary, despite all the negatives the UCP (especially the D. Smith UCP) will bring us?

What’s the alternative?

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

From what I understand, it's still a volatile industry, so long term investment from private capital seems risky when the market ebbs and flows regularly.

In short, commodities are very different economically compared to tech, finance, and casinos. Those are perpetual cash creating machines. commodities are prone to market fluctuations in a major way.

None of this is the public’s problem to solve for the owners.

And I am honestly not even bothered to be chipping in money to the arena, but I am bothered that the City doesn’t reap any of the rewards besides some non-tangible civic pride and trickle-down benefits, if those even materialize as the proponents claims.

[Vox]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Molson family never sold the Habs, they still own the Habs

The exact same group that paid for 70% of the arena in Winnipeg still owns that arena and the Winnipeg Jets.

It is almost like privately financed arenas do not do what you say they do.

They sold it twice, actually. Geoff Molson bought it back again though.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by FormerPresJamesTaylor

Great, they can piss off then.

Cool.

What's your alternative plan then? Living in a capitalist/mixed market system, what do you propose as a reasonable solution to the problem?

Or is it truthful that you just would rather not have a pro sports team at all. If so, just say that, otherwise you may be intellectually dishonest (to rehash an old term).

[Red_Baron]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Molson family never sold the Habs, they still own the Habs


It is almost like privately financed arenas do not do what you say they do.

George Gilette sold the Canadiens back to the Molson Family-after they recovered from their restructuring after selling in 2001.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Reading that release it look like it will be a need design now? With almost 300 million more to spend that we are kicking in.

[FacePaint]

I'm curious how these infrastructure proponents feel about bike lanes?

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Wormius

None of this is the public’s problem to solve for the owners.

And I am honestly not even bothered to be chipping in money to the arena, but I am bothered that the City doesn’t reap any of the rewards besides some non-tangible civic pride and trickle-down benefits, if those even materialize as the proponents claims.

I think having provincial investment in infrastructure development is a big deal. Using their dollars instead of city dollars to build bridges, roadways, underpasses, transit etc. is a big win.

I think having a potential community/private business space around the arena is also a big deal. Creating opportunities for wise investor to come in and develop spaces is really beneficial overall for Calgarians.

Nothing is ever certain in any investment, so you always have to be aware of the possibility of losses. But the more I look at this I think this is a really smart move to revitalize an entire sector of the city. Time will tell, and maybe I'll be proven wrong, but somehow I doubt it.

[Demzy84]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Molson family never sold the Habs, they still own the Habs

The exact same group that paid for 70% of the arena in Winnipeg still owns that arena and the Winnipeg Jets.

It is almost like privately financed arenas do not do what you say they do.

May want to look into that claim of the Molson family never selling the Habs…..January 2001 they sold 80% of their shares and the Molson Centre (only 5 years old at the time) then bought it back in 2009

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Molson family never sold the Habs, they still own the Habs

It's true that they own the Habs now, but not true that they've never sold.

In fact, they've sold the Habs twice - once to a Bronfman entity in the 70s. Then they bought it back and eventually built the new rink. A few years after it opened they sold the team to the Gillette's, and then subsequently bought it back more recently.

http://ourhistory.canadiens.com/arti...ough-The-Years

Edited to add: I also don't think its true that the arena bankrupted them, although iirc the debt from its construction was a big factor in their sale of the team.

[FormerPresJamesTaylor]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Or is it truthful that you just would rather not have a pro sports team at all. If so, just say that, otherwise you may be intellectually dishonest (to rehash an old term).

Been openly honest about this, you thinking you're calling me out is foolish. Love the Flames, loved them my whole life, but I'm a Calgarian and an Albertan way before I'm a Flames fan. There is an endlist about of things that are more important to me before giving the CSEC a new arena.

All of those point you listed have been debunked so often or are just too flimsy to take seriously. Honestly "The money is there so spend it", hogwash.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Demzy84

May want to look into that claim of the Molson family never selling the Habs…..January 2001 they sold 80% of their shares and the Molson Centre (only 5 years old at the time) then bought it back in 2009

Ya I was wrong on that. Completely unrelated to the building of the arena they sold the Habs to focus on their primary business. They then bought the Habs and the arena back again. I forgot about that short period where they did not own the team.

[Reggie Dunlop]

I thought there's be palpable excitement regarding the new underpasses the project would create.

[The Yen Man]

Man, let's just get this done. People are gonna whine about it like the Peace Bridge till the area is developed and we see a vibrant area. In 10 years, people aren't gonna care where the money came from.

[FormerPresJamesTaylor]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Nothing is ever certain in any investment, so you always have to be aware of the possibility of losses. But the more I look at this I think this is a really smart move to revitalize an entire sector of the city.

There has been a hockey arena in that area for decades now, it's called the Saddledome. There is almost major development going on, the Corral was town down and the Federal Government, the province and the city chipped in a combined 500 million for the BMO Convention Centre, a worthy project that will do everything you claim and more

The expansion project is expected to provide significant economic benefits nationally, and locally.

During the construction phase, the project is expected to generate an approximate $497 million for Canada’s GDP, and $402 million for Alberta’s.

Currently, there are around 100 workers on site daily. Plans are to ramp up to close to 400 after the conclusion of the Stampede. Overall the project is providing slightly more than 1,850 full-time jobs for the province, with about $155 million for direct wages and salaries.

Kate Thompson, President and CEO of CMLC, said that they have been able to take advantage of good timing and the expansive park space available to avoid supply chain and inflation related construction pressures.

“We’re over 100 per cent tendered on this project, and we still have issues to come no doubt, but the team is really well-positioned to handle that,” she said.

“One of the advantages of this site that you don’t get in a lot of other downtown sites for construction is that we do have space in the park, and the Calgary Stampede has been excellent partners. It’s been providing extra laydown space if we needed to order steel early or get ahead of the supply chain.”

When the project is completed, more than 9,000 tons of steel will have been on site.

When complete, the Stampede said that their modelling, provided by the Conference Board of Canada and MNP, suggested than annually the centre would bring $267 million to the national GDP.

Once completed, the entire BMO Centre would provide for 1,580 full-year jobs in Calgary, and about $79 million in direct wages for staff at the Centre and other associated businesses.

The ScotiaRogersPlace.Com arena isn't doing any of that.

[Demzy84]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Ya I was wrong on that. Completely unrelated to the building of the arena they sold the Habs to focus on their primary business. They then bought the Habs and the arena back again. I forgot about that short period where they did not own the team.

Yes, to focus on “their primary business”….lol

You don’t sell a building you spent $270M on plus an NHL team for a grand total of $275M if you’re not experiencing some cash flow issues. You think at the time the Habs were worth only $6.25M?

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by The Yen Man

Man, let's just get this done. People are gonna whine about it like the Peace Bridge till the area is developed and we see a vibrant area. In 10 years, people aren't gonna care where the money came from.

Try opening night in a new arena.

Nobody will be complaining then. We all like having nice things, and we quickly forget what we paid for those things once we are able to enjoy them.

Right now it's like getting a bill for something you haven't been able to enjoy yet. Nobody likes that, so lots of griping.

Think big picture, folks.