Sutter is the problem

[All In Good Time]

Originally Posted by dustygoon

Eric Francis on the big show yesterday. Pretty interesting, but juicier bits start around 7:30. He knows more than he is saying.

https://www.sportsnet.ca/960/big-sho...s-locker-room/

As an aside, I wonder why he just doesn't write it? If its true and verified, then, what does he really have to lose? He doesn't play on the team.
If its something that will put someone in an undesirable situation then he should just stay quiet until he writes it.
Saying "ooooooohhhh I have some really good stuff to tell you, at another time" makes him come across (in my opinion anyway) as very "grade 6".

[GFG#1]

Originally Posted by All In Good Time

As an aside, I wonder why he just doesn't write it? If its true and verified, then, what does he really have to lose? He doesn't play on the team.
If its something that will put someone in an undesirable situation then he should just stay quiet until he writes it.
Saying "ooooooohhhh I have some really good stuff to tell you, at another time" makes him come across (in my opinion anyway) as very "grade 6".

As an insider, he probably hears lots of things off the record, and if he starts spewing things that shouldn't be out there, guys will be more guarded around him.

I do not know this for certainty, but I have heard several mentions from guys on the fan hinting that they know more about Kylignton, but they won't say what it is.

[Savvy27]

Originally Posted by All In Good Time

As an aside, I wonder why he just doesn't write it? If its true and verified, then, what does he really have to lose? He doesn't play on the team.
If its something that will put someone in an undesirable situation then he should just stay quiet until he writes it.
Saying "ooooooohhhh I have some really good stuff to tell you, at another time" makes him come across (in my opinion anyway) as very "grade 6".

It could be that his sources are in the last year of a contract and realize that saying anything publicly now would be a bombshell that would cause the rest of the season to become a sideshow. Can't really judge that one until he writes it and we hear what he has to reveal.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Jing

Interesting that he says the franchise will be at a major cross roads in a matter of weeks. Not a hot take, but the way he says it does make it sound like the paths this franchise takes based on the season finish have already materialized.

Francis also inferred that ownership is learning (i.e. wouldn't spend a lot on a coach before, now spending it on Sutter). He mentioned that they wouldn't retool/rebuild, but wondering if they are realizing now that the way to a Stanley Cup is through the draft (tanking).

Should be an interesting off season!

If they actually sell it off and tank, I'll be more excited as a Flames fan than I have been in a long, long time.

...and as angry as I can be on here, I get excited about almost every move they make because it's fun and entertaining.

But switching to a tank/rebuild model? Oh my...oh that would be exciting. I'd happily continue to pay for season tickets to support this direction. Have a fresh, young team developing together and a new hockey arena coming online hopefully around the same time the team turns a corner? Very cool.

[zamler]

Originally Posted by Burning Beard

One stat they never seem to win this year is save percentage...

Go on.....what's a possible solution. And why is goaltending "always" a problem as you used the word never.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by Savvy27

It could be that his sources are in the last year of a contract and realize that saying anything publicly now would be a bombshell that would cause the rest of the season to become a sideshow. Can't really judge that one until he writes it and we hear what he has to reveal.

So then he could just keep his yap shut about it for 21 more days.

[Burning Beard]

Originally Posted by zamler

Go on.....what's a possible solution. And why is goaltending "always" a problem as you used the word never.

Beats me but it's sure odd how Markstrom looked better after his kid was born. They say goalies are Voodoo and I tend to agree.

[dustygoon]

Originally Posted by All In Good Time

As an aside, I wonder why he just doesn't write it? If its true and verified, then, what does he really have to lose? He doesn't play on the team.
If its something that will put someone in an undesirable situation then he should just stay quiet until he writes it.
Saying "ooooooohhhh I have some really good stuff to tell you, at another time" makes him come across (in my opinion anyway) as very "grade 6".

I hear you. He does say that he ran into Murray Edwards recently in that interview (surprising to me since Edwards is so private). That could be part of the source but maybe it is someone like Conroy saying this, but Francis knows he burns him if he says a thing.

I could see Treliving go and Conroy steps up and gets to manage Sutter.

[taxbuster]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Thank you that was the clip.

I tried to play the clip but I was trying forward through it all because of the bro like conversation they have.

Not sure exactly what that shows.

He got mad?
He broke sticks?
Maybe trashed a garbage can?

Whoah ...can't play for this guy!!

/rant

Whoop-de-frickin'-do. You don't like it? Go be an accountant or a lawyer or a ditch-digger.

Do we REALLY have to baby everyone now and mollycoddle them so they "feel good" about making millions playing a child's game?

When it's MY hard-earned money that is playing people to perform (and it HAS been in various businesses) I'm not going to stint on being demanding. There are LOADS of others pining to have a decent job. But the guaranteed contract, once signed, doesn't entitle you to anything other than money.

/rant off

Thanks...I'll go crawl back in my cave now.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

Not sure exactly what that shows.

He got mad?
He broke sticks?
Maybe trashed a garbage can?

Whoah ...can't play for this guy!!

/rant

Whoop-de-frickin'-do. You don't like it? Go be an accountant or a lawyer or a ditch-digger.

Do we REALLY have to baby everyone now and mollycoddle them so they "feel good" about making millions playing a child's game?

When it's MY hard-earned money that is playing people to perform (and it HAS been in various businesses) I'm not going to stint on being demanding. There are LOADS of others pining to have a decent job. But the guaranteed contract, once signed, doesn't entitle you to anything other than money.

/rant off

Thanks...I'll go crawl back in my cave now.

No come out of your cave. I want to hear more how we allow adults to have temper tantrums in Sports but any other industry that wouldn't be tolerated.

Also why don't folks every target ownership when it comes to salaries? Some players make more money in a year than I will see in my lifetime. But they are workers in an industry that makes even more money, exponentially, than they do. They are very litter putting their bodies and long term health on the line. If you look at the history of the NHL for a long, long, time these players were exploited by ownership and any organizing the Players tried to do was union busted by Ownership until the latter half of the last century. Hell, they couldn't even call their union a union because of Red Baiting.


Anyway it's not your hard-earned money you're playing for the players. It's CSEC's money. You're paying CSEC for a product. Do you consider that you pay Keanu Reeves salary because you went to see John Wick 4? Consumer Choice is an option, and by all means vote with your dollars. But let's not pretend that your ticket sale is directly paying for Kadri's salary.


Call me a piss baby socialist or whatever but I just think all worker should have the safest working environment. *shrugs*

If we talk about wanting hockey culture to change and grow, these are the conversations we should be having.

[Mr.Coffee]

35% of NHL revenue is ticket sales, as of about 3 years ago.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...hl-since-2006/

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

No come out of your cave. I want to hear more how we allow adults to have temper tantrums in Sports but any other industry that wouldn't be tolerated.

Impressive rant, but you could have ended your post there. That's all that needs to be said. This is old thinking that needs to die out.

Back when I was working in a corporation, I had a boss that would frequently express his subtle dissatisfaction with my work. There was almost never any praise even though my performance reviews reflected my good work (that he wrote). Occasionally, he would pull me aside and rip into me, yelling in my face. I would respond by showing some additional visible effort or something tangible in front of him for a short while, but it didn't actually improve my performance long-term.

I have had other bosses who expressed trust in me, allowed me to have autonomy over many aspects of my job, had frank conversations when things were not going well, but would never yell. That's where I put in my best work, again and again.

Being grumpy and yelling isn't a managerial tactic anymore than smoking in the office or having afternoon whiskies is. This ain't Mad Men. Time to modernize.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

35% of NHL revenue is ticket sales, as of about 3 years ago.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/...hl-since-2006/

Yeah, I'm not arguing that. But you're not paying the players. You're paying Murray Edwards et al. Personally, and your mileage will of couse vary, I think cutting out the GIANT middle man that is CSEC is an oversimplification.

There is of course a relationship between consumers and the product. Again if no one goes to see John Wick 4 and it bombs it's going to impact a lot of folks, including Keanu's bottom line. I just don't understand why folks are "I'm paying for these bums" about sports when we don't do it for other entertainment industries. That being said if CSEC offered me my money back for that Wild game (which was my first game in 5 years) would I have taken it.

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

Impressive rant, but you could have ended your post there. That's all that needs to be said. This is old thinking that needs to die out.

Back when I was working in a corporation, I had a boss that would frequently express his subtle dissatisfaction with my work. There was almost never any praise even though my performance reviews reflected my good work (that he wrote). Occasionally, he would pull me aside and rip into me, yelling in my face. I would respond by showing some additional visible effort or something tangible in front of him for a short while, but it didn't actually improve my performance long-term.

I have had other bosses who expressed trust in me, allowed me to have autonomy over many aspects of my job, had frank conversations when things were not going well, but would never yell. That's where I put in my best work, again and again.

Being grumpy and yelling isn't a managerial tactic anymore than smoking in the office or having afternoon whiskies is. This ain't Mad Men. Time to modernize.

Admittedly I've been thinking about this too hard because of the last several years at my job too.

[Mr.Coffee]

Fair. I didn't even really get that Gaudreau was "complaining" about it either. Bisonette asked him to tell a funny Sutter story so it was the first he came up with.

[flames_fan_down_under]

Professional sports is a highly highly competitive world that is fueled by emotion. When players get frustrated they smash their sticks in disgust, like Markstrom did they other day, or sometimes coaches are losing it on the refs, so a coach getting frustrated in a locker room by smashing something doesn't seem that surprising to me because sports is full of those types of moments. It doesn't even really seem that archaic to me.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

If they actually sell it off and tank, I'll be more excited as a Flames fan than I have been in a long, long time.

...and as angry as I can be on here, I get excited about almost every move they make because it's fun and entertaining.

But switching to a tank/rebuild model? Oh my...oh that would be exciting. I'd happily continue to pay for season tickets to support this direction. Have a fresh, young team developing together and a new hockey arena coming online hopefully around the same time the team turns a corner? Very cool.

Even though I thnk we could have avoided it if we sold at the deadline and I still think a re-tool could work. I also would be very excited to actually see this team do a full rebuild.

Take Arizona's roster, picks and prospect situation but remove the financial issues and I would easily trade our current roster/prospect pool/picks for theirs. They are likely to get a top 6 pick, have plenty of picks. They probably have the worst situation other than maybe the Sharks of the bottom teams.

Montreal, Columbus, Anaheim all could be elite teams very soon. Even if they fail, at minimum they will have franchise players to cheer for and watch every night.

[TheScorpion]

I think Arizona's pipeline is in way better shape than Columbus' and Anaheim's

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by flames_fan_down_under

Professional sports is a highly highly competitive world that is fueled by emotion. When players get frustrated they smash their sticks in disgust, like Markstrom did they other day, or sometimes coaches are losing it on the refs, so a coach getting frustrated in a locker room by smashing something doesn't seem that surprising to me because sports is full of those types of moments. It doesn't even really seem that archaic to me.

I can tolerate it in players because they're out there getting roughed up in a physical game. Even the most level headed guy can get his emotions up if things get rough.

But a coach? Nah man, no pass from me. Control your emotions. You're not a child.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I think Arizona's pipeline is in way better shape than Columbus' and Anaheim's

I agree they are ahead but Columbus does have Gaudreau, Laine, Werenski, Johnson and Sillinger on their roster. If they stayed healthy I doubt they are at the bottom of the league.

Arizona has less on the roster IMO but are some loaded with picks and prospects and cap space. If they can spend the cap, they will be very good soon as well.

Chicago is also has an extra first 3 years in a row but their roster is bad right now so they have a way to go. But they are a place UFAs are willing to sign.

[TheScorpion]

I would rather have Keller than Johnny right now — cheaper and way younger. Schmaltz and Maccelli over Laine and Sillinger, too. Hayton and Johnson are close.

AZ certainly doesn't have a Werenski, though. Even when they had Chychrun I don't think he was in the same stratosphere.