2022/2023 Trade Speculation and Rumours

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Ped

Perhaps I worded badly - I mean there were warning signs with Neal's performance before the Flames signed him. And I'll concede that the signing was widely praised - but even the sportsnet article when he signed mentioned his shot rate was already declining.

And the warning signs were there, for those who chose to look at them. David Staples:



The Neal signing doesn't make Treliving a bad GM. But there's a reason the shift league-wide has been to stop handing out big money to older players and instead give it to younger players - paying for potential, rather than what the player has done.

I admit to never having read a David Staples column. So there's one example.

I do think the Flames didn't do any off ice reviewing of Neal. I certainly didn't know the things I later found out.

The league has moved a bit from high UFA signings though there are some recent ones (and extensions) that seems pretty similar. Including on this team.

[Ashasx]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

Not likely but everyone in the building is operating right now like they are hoping to get in.

This organization has operated under the illusion of "just get in and anything can happen" since 2004 and it has resulted in exactly two playoff series wins since then.

It is truly unbelievable that it is still how this franchise operates.

[bubbsy]

Originally Posted by Ashasx

This organization has operated under the illusion of "just get in and anything can happen" since 2004 and it has resulted in exactly two playoff series wins since then.

It is truly unbelievable that it is still how this franchise operates.

The 04 run was the greatest gift yet the greatest curse for this franchise.

[dirk diggler]

St Louis winning a few years back just reinforces this ridicolous illusion that the Flames operate under.

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

McDavid, he is a decent player who signed a year before his ELC expired. I think he is at least as good as Tkachuk.

Exception, not the norm.

Your premise completely excludes whether Tkachuk would have wanted to sign an 8 year deal. Again, you’re reaching.

[Jason14h]

StL and Calgary’s miracle runs both have one very common factor (as does almost every Cinderella run in NHL history ) - a goalie playing at an elite ++ level

And in these two scenarios the team playing with the new goalie - kipper and Benny - played at an elite level when they were in net well before playoffs started , so it wasn’t really a get in and anything can happen scenario

Playing with these goalies these teams were elite long before the playoffs started and it just carried through

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Exception, not the norm.

Your premise completely excludes whether Tkachuk would have wanted to sign an 8 year deal. Again, you’re reaching.

The Flames did not have the salary room to sign a 8 year extension, in large part because of the contracts handed out to aging UFA’s. So we will never know whether they could have signed him to a longterm contract or signed Mangiapane in 2020 to a longterm contract because they just did not have the room.

Instead of trying to lockdown their young players for as much term as possible and then using whatever space is left to fill in the gaps, they sign little show me deals because they do not have the space for a longterm contract or the GM has a philosophy of only paying once someone has performed and then when they show them (like Mangiapane and Dube) they back up the brinks truck.

Would Dube sign a 8 year 27 million dollar deal in 2021, maybe, who knows. But the Flames never do that. When Dube gets 60 points next year we can maybe sign him for 3 years at 18 million, buy two UFA years and lose him at 28.

The philosophy to not sign young players longterm is probably not a Murray Edwards philosophy. That is a management decision. The few times they have done it (Rasmus) it works out, but the decisions to buy expensive vets means they can only do it sparingly.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

The 04 run was the greatest gift yet the greatest curse for this franchise.

Yep. Since 04 the organization has operated on a get in the playoffs at all costs mandate that has resulted in mediocrity and nothing but a mix of early playoff exits and missing the playoffs outright. You can make a case the organization may be in a better place today if the 04 run never happens.

[Monahammer]

We should have shopped and sold out players a la Nashville. I posted this last night and agree with Sandman, looking at what's moved I think that we totally missed our opportunity. The buyers have bought. The market goes both ways and the demand might be pretty weak with what's left over. I'm still down to try and sell but it seems like this franchise AGAIN waited too long to make decisions on assets, and thus will be left diminished value for them.

Frustrating and sad to be a fan of this organization. We are a bunch of suckers.

[Vinny01]

There is no return that I am seeing that makes me think I would trade Lindholm, Hanifin, or maybe Toffoli for that right now.

32 thoughts has some talk that teams have approached the flames about some of those players

[Tkachukwagon]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630225096634933248

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630225098123915273

[Just a guy]

Originally Posted by TOfan

Exception, not the norm.

Your premise completely excludes whether Tkachuk would have wanted to sign an 8 year deal. Again, you’re reaching.

I might be wrong, but didn't Brady Tkachuk sign long term?

[memphusk]

Originally Posted by Tkachukwagon

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630225096634933248

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630225098123915273

Nice.

[memphusk]

If they're thinking big picture i hope that means sell sell sell.

[NewFan]

We should keep Backlund, Dube, Tanev, Anderson and Lewis or Lucic for a veteran presence and leadership if the team wants to retool or rebuild.
Trade Toffoli and Hannifin or Weeger this week. Kadri and Huberdeau, Lindholm, Zadorov next year. Please.

[Hockey_Ninja]

Originally Posted by Tkachukwagon

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630225096634933248

https://twitter.com/user/status/1630225098123915273

Sell! Sell! Sell! Sell!

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by NewFan

We should keep Backlund, Dube, Tanev, Anderson and Lewis or Lucic for a veteran presence and leadership if the team wants to retool or rebuild.
Trade Toffoli and Hannifin or Weeger this week. Kadri and Huberdeau, Lindholm, Zadorov next year. Please.

Username checks out.

[Hockey_Ninja]

Originally Posted by NewFan

We should keep Backlund, Dube, Tanev, Anderson and Lewis or Lucic for a veteran presence and leadership if the team wants to retool or rebuild.
Trade Toffoli and Hannifin or Weeger this week. Kadri and Huberdeau, Lindholm, Zadorov next year. Please.

No one is gonna take their contracts. Weegar is the most movable of the three they just committed a lot of money to. I’m fine with keeping Huby and Naz around for a rebuild. You need veterans and to reach the cap floor somehow. Maybe if Huby’s play improves down the line you can possibly move him

[Mitch]

Flames looking big picture? What am I hearing

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

The Flames did not have the salary room to sign a 8 year extension, in large part because of the contracts handed out to aging UFA’s. So we will never know whether they could have signed him to a longterm contract or signed Mangiapane in 2020 to a longterm contract because they just did not have the room.

Instead of trying to lockdown their young players for as much term as possible and then using whatever space is left to fill in the gaps, they sign little show me deals because they do not have the space for a longterm contract or the GM has a philosophy of only paying once someone has performed and then when they show them (like Mangiapane and Dube) they back up the brinks truck.

Would Dube sign a 8 year 27 million dollar deal in 2021, maybe, who knows. But the Flames never do that. When Dube gets 60 points next year we can maybe sign him for 3 years at 18 million, buy two UFA years and lose him at 28.

The philosophy to not sign young players longterm is probably not a Murray Edwards philosophy. That is a management decision. The few times they have done it (Rasmus) it works out, but the decisions to buy expensive vets means they can only do it sparingly.

Do you ever ask yourself ‘what don’t I know here?’ Or is the assumption the Flames are idiots and you know better from your couch/keyboard?

Pretty sure the Flames spoke with Tkachuk about a number of possibilities, long term and short term. Did Tkachuk let on that he might want to play elsewhere down the line? Doubt it. Did Tkachuk know Sutter would eventually be the coach and they might not see eye to eye? Probably not. Did the Flames say ‘we can sign you to 7-8 years but we have to move X to do so’.

You make the best decisions you can at the time with the information you have available. I can’t speak to what discussions were had because I wasn’t there and neither were you. But to think extending Tkachuk to a longer term deal wasn’t discussed is absurd. And if they took you suggested approach with each of their young players surely they would get burned by that as well and guys like yourself would be talking about how stupid the Flames are for signing player X for 7-8 years and now they’re stuck. The sword has two edges.