Enough is enough - Bring up Wolf.

[Burning Beard]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

I would love for Treliving to call up Dustin Wolf. And it's what should happen.

But the likelihood of our coach playing him without an injury to Markstrom is 0%

Just like Sutter would never play Pelletier and if he does he would be stuck on the 4th line for a game or two only?

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

I still think that if Treliving was ballsy enough, that Sutter would take the opportunity to send a message to Markstrom and Vladar if they put up more poor performances by his evaluation

A wolf start wouldn't happen right away, but at some point it would happen.

Of course the chances increase immensely if they're out of it.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by madmike

The Flames are going nowhere under the current goaltending scenario, so why not? Markstrom and Vladar are flat out not good enough.

I’d rather give Wolf a shot than have the Flames sit on their hands, do nothing and miss the playoffs because they have incompetent goaltenders.

Personally, I think it would be better if he were thrust into NHL action once the Flames are all but eliminated so he can just play and not worry about carrying a franchise that is in disarray into the post season. He would have to go 17-8 to even give this team a chance, and this is a pretty tall ask for any player let alone your top prospect.

A half dozen NHL starts during the final 10-12 games of the season would go a long way in terms of his development and aid in the decision making process for next year while not placing any unnecessary weight on his shoulders when he's already trying to adjust to the big leauge.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

Personally, I think it would be better if he were thrust into NHL action once the Flames are all but eliminated so he can just play and not worry about carrying a franchise that is in disarray into the post season. He would have to go 17-8 to even give this team a chance, and this is a pretty tall ask for any player let alone your top prospect.

A half dozen NHL starts during the final 10-12 games of the season would go a long way in terms of his development and aid in the decision making process for next year while not placing any unnecessary weight on his shoulders when he's already trying to adjust to the big leauge.

12-13 games above. 500 is typical for an 8th seed

They are 6. So 17-8 wouldn't be the bar.

Probably something like 15-8-2 for 41-28-13 on the season (95 pts)

Still a tall task the way they're going, but not as steep as you're suggesting

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Burning Beard

Just like Sutter would never play Pelletier and if he does he would be stuck on the 4th line for a game or two only?

There was a roster spot that had been more open for Pelletier to be honest, really a top 9 spot had been open since camp and it took until game 50 for a prospect to get a look.

You weren't really "benching" somebody to work Pelletier into the lineup.

Sitting one of Vladar or Markstrom in the press box to call up Wolf is a completely different beast.

And really it's kind of unprecidented to know what Sutter would do because generally he has good goaltending.

If somebody got hurt and Wolf ran with the net that wouldn't be an issue. Bu I have a hard time seeing him just benching Markstrom to call up Wolf.

Honestly even if it did happen I feel like they would do some type of week to week injury for Markstrom to save face a bit.

[tvp2003]

I haven't read this thread let alone posted in it, as barring injury I think we ride Markstrom and/or Vladar this year come hell or high water.

However, if we're fighting with a team like LA for a playoff spot, and LA was willing to send Cal Petersen to the AHL, what's stopping Treliving from doing the same with Markstrom? I'm not sure he'd do it since he may be looking for a new job next year, but at what point does he tell Darryl "**** it, play Wolf or I send Vladar down too"?

EDIT: Just realized Markstrom has a full NMC. Blech.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

12-13 games above. 500 is typical for an 8th seed

They are 6. So 17-8 wouldn't be the bar.

Probably something like 15-8-2 for 41-28-13 on the season (95 pts)

Still a tall task the way they're going, but not as steep as you're suggesting

It's a big swing to suggest the 8th seed will be locked in at 95 points. It could happen, but it is just as likely that it takes 97 or 98 points to lock it up as that was the bar last year.

At any rate, this team hasn't won 4 straight all season so there's really nothing to suggest it is suddenly going to happen with or without better goaltending. You still have a flaccid PP and lackluster 5-5 offence that needs to seriously improve in order to get anywhere close to the playoffs.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

It's a big swing to suggest the 8th seed will be locked in at 95 points. It could happen, but it is just as likely that it takes 97 or 98 points to lock it up as that was the bar last year.

At any rate, this team hasn't won 4 straight all season so there's really nothing to suggest it is suddenly going to happen with or without better goaltending. You still have a flaccid PP and lackluster 5-5 offence that needs to seriously improve in order to get anywhere close to the playoffs.

I think there was more of a gap between the top 8 and bottom 8 teams in both conferences last season, hence the higher cutoff

Neither minny nor Calgary is consistent enough for it to end up being 97-98

I think 95 is right on the money this year

I also think it's like 70-30 they don't make it, so that's not to imply my optimism is high

[GFG#1]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

Personally, I think it would be better if he were thrust into NHL action once the Flames are all but eliminated so he can just play and not worry about carrying a franchise that is in disarray into the post season. He would have to go 17-8 to even give this team a chance, and this is a pretty tall ask for any player let alone your top prospect.

A half dozen NHL starts during the final 10-12 games of the season would go a long way in terms of his development and aid in the decision making process for next year while not placing any unnecessary weight on his shoulders when he's already trying to adjust to the big leauge.

If the Flames had a .910 save percentage, they would likely be First in the division. At .910 that would have him tied at 19th with Goalies who have played at least 20 games this season. so really almost bottom 3rd of the league.

It honestly doesn't appear like the Flames want to blow this roster up, so why would you wait until you are eliminated to give him a try. If he falters you send him back down. How much more can he really develop in the "A" he was top goalie last year, and is on his way of being the top goalie this year.

In reality the only reason to wait for him to have a shot, would be if you were going to ride Markstrom out and tank this season, which clearly they are not. Or unless you have a plan to bring in another goalie that is going to be able to get you .910 save percent.

[Snuffleupagus]

I wonder what Pat Steinberg will say about this thread? two months ago it was Markstrom is too good not to get it together, a couple of weeks ago he was all for giving Vladar most of the starts and all the while clamoring to keep Wolf in the AHL to "develop"

Sorry Pat, Wolf has developed enough in that league, now is the time for progression, there's nothing to loose and a small chance of a win.

[devo22]

Wolf is the best goaltender in the AHL this season once again, with ridiculously good stats while also having the biggest workload in the league (276 minutes more than the next guy). I'm all for being patient with prospects, but if you are the best AHL goaltender in both of your first two seasons there, calls for more "development" don't have much merit IMO. He needs to progress to the next level, and it'll have to be Vladar who makes way. Like I said, I just can't see Markstrom having a market after the season he's having.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by devo22

Wolf is the best goaltender in the AHL this season once again, with ridiculously good stats while also having the biggest workload in the league (276 minutes more than the next guy). I'm all for being patient with prospects, but if you are the best AHL goaltender in both of your first two seasons there, calls for more "development" don't have much merit IMO. He needs to progress to the next level, and it'll have to be Vladar who makes way. Like I said, I just can't see Markstrom having a market after the season he's having.

Has there ever been a goalie that has been this dominant over his first two years in the AHL who has not been called up and rather was left in the minors for more seasoning?

[devo22]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

Has there ever been a goalie that has been this dominant over his first two years in the AHL who has not been called up and rather was left in the minors for more seasoning?

Jonathan Bernier might be the closest comparison. Played 112 AHL games in his first two seasons (posting 2.40 and .914% in his first, then 2.03 and .936% in his second season), with only a short NHL stint (3 games) in his second season sprinkled in.

[cowtown75]

Keep him in the AHL and get reps. He's in a good spot so let's not bring him into this tire fire. The Wrangler's are having a hell of a season, let him enjoy that with his team.

[DionTheDman]

Originally Posted by cowtown75

Keep him in the AHL and get reps. He's in a good spot so let's not bring him into this tire fire. The Wrangler's are having a hell of a season, let him enjoy that with his team.

But if there's a tire fire here, no one player is in a better position to be the 100% solution that puts it out.

[cam_wmh]

Quick analysis, of rookie goalies who went on hot playoff runs etc, given the opportunity due to injury, or were their team's other goalies playing awful? It's a small sample, so feel free to poke holes with other examples.

Cam Ward - With Ward earning the backup position to start the 05/06 season, it was an injury to Gerber that gave him the opportunity and he ran with it

Jake Oettinger - Started the season in the AHL, but with injuries to both Stars goalies, gave him the opportunity and he ran with it. Oettinger lead all goaltenders in the first round with a .954 save percentage, almost single headedly carrying the Stars past the Flames.

Jordan Binnington - With the Blues season starting off dire, they waive Chad Johnson, and called up Binnington on Dec 9. Starter Allen continued to start the next 12 games, going 6-6. Binnington's first NHL action was in Jan 2016, under emergency call-up conditions. With an injured Eilliott - he stepped in and was scored on a single time, over 12 minutes, in a 4-1 loss. It was was Jan 7, 2019, nearly 4 years later, he earns a shut-out in his first NHL starts. The Blues proceed to go on a a 30–10–5 run, with a franchise-record 11-game winning streak in the meat of it. Come the playoffs he backstops the Blues to their first Stanley Cup win.


Matt Murray With starter Fleury, concussed on Dec 14, Murray is called up. He starts his first NHL game, Dec 19 a 2-1 loss. He was called up again, on February 21, and started nine games to finish the season. With Fleury faltering, Murray started game three of the first round He allowed just one goal as the Penguins defeated the New York Rangers 3–1. Murray remained the starting goaltender throughout the 2016 playoffs. After being replaced by veteran Marc-André Fleury, who returned from injury in game five of the third round, he started in all remainder games of the 2016 Stanley Cup playoffs.

There seems to be an apprehension by NHL teams towards their young goalies.
IN-SEASON, they only receive an opportunity if; The team is in a disastrous state (Binnington), or due to injury to the teams main two goalies (Murray, Ward, Oettinger)

A bit surprised by the analysis to be honest, as imho it needs to be about merit.

[dustygoon]

Have to think this is the last time this mngt team puts that much money into one goalie.

[madmike]

Originally Posted by dustygoon

Have to think this is the last time this mngt team puts that much money into one goalie.

What’s frustrating is the Leafs got Murray and Samsonov in the offseason and everyone laughed at them. But they’ve both been far better than Markstrom.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by TrentCrimmIndependent

I think there was more of a gap between the top 8 and bottom 8 teams in both conferences last season, hence the higher cutoff

Neither minny nor Calgary is consistent enough for it to end up being 97-98

I think 95 is right on the money this year

I also think it's like 70-30 they don't make it, so that's not to imply my optimism is high

Minnesota is on pace for 96, even with their inconsistent season.
They'll get there without turning up a gear, just staying as they are.
They also play Columbus 2 of their next 3 games. They also win a tie break against the Flames.

Unless they really regress, the Flames need 97 to have a chance.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

Minnesota is on pace for 96, even with their inconsistent season.
They'll get there without turning up a gear, just staying as they are.
They also play Columbus 2 of their next 3 games. They also win a tie break against the Flames.

Unless they really regress, the Flames need 97 to have a chance.

Minnesota loses the tiebreaker to the Flames.