If the Flames fired Sutter now...

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by Northendzone

^ sure, or the flames could easily find the next glen gulutzan or Greg Gilbert…..

Hire a veteran coach and you find your next Brent Sutter.

[Bandwagon Surfer]

Blaming the coach is how fans deal with the cognitive dissonance from believing they have good players but not seeing the results they expect.


Fans look at their team and players, and imagine the best. They look at the players' best season, mentally adjust up for how much untapped potential they think the player has, then mentally lock into that being who the player is. Realistically assessing players, taking into account their situation, anomalous stats, and the massive decline that comes with age, is all written off as people being haters or debbie downers. In the minds of a fan, they expect their fantasy season to happen, no matter what the actual odds are.


Then the season starts, reality sets in, and the results are not what was expected. The fan is so attached to their assessment of the players that their mind cannot comprehend that they could have been wrong, so they "know" that it has to be something else. The coach fits what their mind is looking for perfectly: it has to be the coach holding back the players, because that conclusion means not questioning if the fan's assessment of the players was wrong.


This is not to call it a fault or weakness in the fan, this is just how human brains work. We all do this. Look at all the insanely complex conspiracy theories people come to deny science, it is people protecting themselves from having to admit they were wrong. Challenging your own beliefs is hard work, and admitting when you are wrong and apologizing takes a lot strength and courage.

[Dion]

It's much easier to fire the coach as opposed to holding the players accountable for their poor play. Firing Sutter won't solve the teams problems.

[taxbuster]

I've wondered for a while if Sutter's apparent "gotta play the vets" isn't so much that he loves them but that he dislikes the work ethic he sees from the younger players who've run through the system this year and is using the vets to send a message.

He said as much about Pelts...he had a crappy camp, wasn't good enough, got sent down, played poorly, changed habits, started to improve, got better and got called up, started out waiting and protected and is now playing fairly regular minutes.

Rosie? Not so much. But he's still hanging around.

Sonny Milano? PTO at camp, didn't impress, gone. (Too bad, he's playing well now.)

And yes, maybe guys didn't get a long enough cup of coffee....well, hindsight is what that is for.

Would the team be better under another coach? Doubtful, and I have no doubt that if Edwards (cheap *&%^^%E$ that he is) has to turf Sutter, he'll make sure that the equivalent dollars are removed from the Flames budget so he doesn't lose any money.

And if the stories about him jumping on the phone call with Johnny are true, I can't see players racing to come to Calgary anyway.

[Moneyhands23]

Listing to yesterday's barn burner. Seems like their could be bigger issues than I thought on the team.

Not great when the coach is actively working against the GM.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

It’s always the coach. It’s been the coach every time for the past decade. Has the same person hired most of those coaches? Yes. Is it that person? No.

Have some of these coaches had great seasons? Yes. But, it’s important to remember that whenever coaches here have great seasons it’s because we have such great players that play despite the coach, and whenever coaches here have bad seasons we have such great players that can’t overcome the terribleness of the very same coach.

It’s simple: always blame the coach.

I'm fine with giving coaches credit where credit is due, and this whole season is not on Sutter, but even just getting a coach who'd play Phillips, or in the past, play Bennett as a top two line centre or Kylington as a top four defenseman, are outcomes Inwould welcome.

Treliving continues to hire coaches who lack any flexibility, bravery, or imagination in their player usage.

[chedder]

Originally Posted by Bandwagon Surfer

Blaming the coach is how fans deal with the cognitive dissonance from believing they have good players but not seeing the results they expect.


Fans look at their team and players, and imagine the best. They look at the players' best season, mentally adjust up for how much untapped potential they think the player has, then mentally lock into that being who the player is. Realistically assessing players, taking into account their situation, anomalous stats, and the massive decline that comes with age, is all written off as people being haters or debbie downers. In the minds of a fan, they expect their fantasy season to happen, no matter what the actual odds are.


Then the season starts, reality sets in, and the results are not what was expected. The fan is so attached to their assessment of the players that their mind cannot comprehend that they could have been wrong, so they "know" that it has to be something else. The coach fits what their mind is looking for perfectly: it has to be the coach holding back the players, because that conclusion means not questioning if the fan's assessment of the players was wrong.


This is not to call it a fault or weakness in the fan, this is just how human brains work. We all do this. Look at all the insanely complex conspiracy theories people come to deny science, it is people protecting themselves from having to admit they were wrong. Challenging your own beliefs is hard work, and admitting when you are wrong and apologizing takes a lot strength and courage.

You could switch the words coach and players and this would read the exact same way. Coaches best seasons, best results, he's not too old, etc.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

I'm fine with giving coaches credit where credit is due, and this whole season is not on Sutter, but even just getting a coach who'd play Phillips, or in the past, play Bennett as a top two line centre or Kylington as a top four defenseman, are outcomes Inwould welcome.

Treliving continues to hire coaches who lack any flexibility, bravery, or imagination in their player usage.

Sutter played Bennett as a center and he was excelling under him and played Kylington as a top 4, who also excelled under him.

Seems like Sutter is your guy.

[gamesaver]

Coaching change won't do much, and frankly even if it would save this season, thats not the point. The Flames are in terrible spot, they will have meh draft in this strong year, lots of other teams in our division will get significant boost drafting high in the first round. Sharks, Yotes, even Canucks. All of those team will get some damn good players and they are already rebulding. Teams above us are much stronger than us, and also much younger. We have literally no future we are aware of, because we insist on signing aging UFAs that would extend our imagination of cup window. The window, if there ever was any, has closed when Tkachuk and Gaudreau left. Our unwillingness to accept the fact will hurt is big time in long run.

The coaching change is meant for future. A coach who can develop young players, introduce them to the league and is not gonna kill their confidence instantly after some stupid giveaway. We all know this is not what Sutter can do, or want to do. But we desperately need it, or we will suck big time and for long time.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Sam Bennett is a strange Hill to die on. He was given plenty of opportunity but he never put it together.

I bet Carolina is saying the same thing about Lindholm but Lindholm is a much better player.

[Aarongavey]

The Flames have 11 playoff victories in the last 7 seasons (good for 21st in the league) and that level of mediocrity has no owner. We have an amazing coach, the second best GM we have had in our franchise history. Such is the life of a Flames fan.

[memphusk]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Sam Bennett is a strange Hill to die on. He was given plenty of opportunity but he never put it together.

I bet Carolina is saying the same thing about Lindholm but Lindholm is a much better player.

Darryl Sutter Sam Bennett is what this team never had. They are a match made in heaven. Treliving ruined us some Sam Bennett.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

The Flames have 11 playoff victories in the last 7 seasons (good for 21st in the league) and that level of mediocrity has no owner. We have an amazing coach, the second best GM we have had in our franchise history. Such is the life of a Flames fan.

You’re right, the coach and all the players have been the same for the last 7 years. It’s all connected you see because it’s the exact same team every year.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

You’re right, the coach and all the players have been the same for the last 7 years. It’s all connected you see because it’s the exact same team every year.

Not sure that is what I said. In any event, Darryl has made the season in one of the two seasons he has been HC so far, hopefully he makes them this year.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by memphusk

Darryl Sutter Sam Bennett is what this team never had. They are a match made in heaven. Treliving ruined us some Sam Bennett.

He played well under Darryl but the trade request was made prior to him coming and was a upcoming rfa.

Again he looked good in spurts with other coaches so it was still a huge gamble to sign him to any long term deal with big dollars committed to him.

[GranteedEV]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Sutter played Bennett as a center and he was excelling under him and played Kylington as a top 4, who also excelled under him.

Seems like Sutter is your guy.

Sutter played Bennett as a fourth line LW on a line with Brett Ritchie and Derek Ryan, I'm not sure what you're talking about.

Sutter is also the guy who scratched Kylington for half a season in favour of Nikita Nesterov, and was fortunate that Zadorov and Valimaki looked AHL caliber last year after losing Giordano. Playing Kylington in the top four was probably his plan F

And again, Sutter is the guy who is terrified of Matthew Phillips. And mangling Ruzicka.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by GranteedEV

And again, Sutter is the guy who is terrified of Matthew Phillips. And mangling Ruzicka.

Philips didn’t look anywhere near as good as Pelletier did in his call up and Ruzicka is mangling himself if anything.

[PepsiFree]

“Terrified of Matthew Phillips”

lol

[Toonage]

Maybe Sutter has microphobia?

Holy crap we're through the looking glass people.

[Flamesfan05]

The Wilds are not too interested in the playoffs

All Sutter has to do is to beat them for a playoff spot. If he can’t, he should be a farmer again