2022-2023 Toronto Raptors/NBA season thread - Page 8 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

The Big Chill · 01-31-2023, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bluejays

Really wondering what an OG trade to NY or Phx would look like. I’d have to think traditionally NY picks would tend to be better, which is something the deal would have to revolve around.

OG’s injury might put an end to these talks. I’d like to keep OG, but he would also be the best one to move in terms of getting value back.

bluejays · 01-31-2023, 08:57 PM

No doubt. If he turns healthy, the rumoured asking prices are too good to pass up. The guy can't drive to the rim which is why I think he's totally worth cashing in for.

octothorp · 02-02-2023, 01:27 PM

Yeah, if he could accept his role as a 3 and D guy, he'd be an elite addition for any contender. I think the four teams capable of making serious offers are the Knicks, Suns, Grizzlies or Pelicans.

Knicks offer has to include Quickley (or RJ Barrett, but I don't believe he's seriously on the table). Problem for the Knicks is that Quickley has become a key rotation piece and a Thibodeau favorite. Their picks also aren't great... they've got Detroit and Washington first-rounders that are heavily protected and may never convert, plus Mavs pick this year and their own. A Knicks team with OG is definitely a playoff team, so those are all non-lottery picks.

Suns have all their own picks. Presumably a trade would be based around Ayton, but he's really overpaid for what he does, and grumbles about not getting enough touches... a problem that would likely continue on the Raptors. Again, all picks are likely non-lottery, and even if they were contributing multiples, it would need to be a 2023/25/27 sort of arrangement.

Grizzlies have a couple okay prospects... Ziaire Williams might be a guy the Raptors like, but he's not a rotation player at this point, and I'd expect the Grizzlies need to pay heavily with picks; they could trade their own in 2023/25 plus Warriors in 2024. That last one isn't a bad gamble... Warriors go on a deep run this year, Green leaves in the offseason... it's easy to see next year being bad for them. The reason they might be willing to pay heavily in picks is because they could add OG without removing anyone from their rotation. Green would likely be the matching salary, although Raptors could flip him elsewhere or buy him out so he gets another shot with a contender.

Pelicans definitely have the deepest warchest... a load of picks including all of their own, Lakers this year and next, and Milwaukee futures. Multiple good young player including Murphy, Daniels, and Jones. Easy for them to pay the price without signiicantly impacting their rotation, but it does present some salary challenges for them. I really like Daniels as a future PG for the Raptors, and supposedly he was someone the Raptors had a lot of interest in last year. If we get something like Daniels and two FRPs for OG, I think that's a definite win.

There are some reports this morning that while the Grizzlies and Pelicans both want OG, they are both concerned about the other team possibly acquiring him. This is an ideal situation for a bidding war... both a positive incentive to trade for the player and a negative incentive to let another team outbid you.

The Big Chill · 02-02-2023, 02:34 PM

They need to surround Barnes with shooters. I wouldn’t want to bring back any C who can’t shoot, like Ayton or Poeltl. Both are good at what they do, but I don’t think they are the right fit.

Jason14h · 02-02-2023, 02:50 PM

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/sto...trade-deadline

3 of their 6 are Raptors deals

octothorp · 02-02-2023, 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Big Chill

They need to surround Barnes with shooters. I wouldn’t want to bring back any C who can’t shoot, like Ayton or Poeltl. Both are good at what they do, but I don’t think they are the right fit.

I actually like Poeltl a lot as a fit for the Raptors. Their big problem on offense is inconsistency. They have no ability to generate high-percentage two-point shots, so when they get into a drought they just try and shoot themselves out of it and usually fail to do so. A sure-handed screen-and-roll big would help them a lot more in that regard than a primarily stretch C who will be subject to the same inconsistency as every other 3-point shooter on the team. Siakam and Barnes both do a great job generating open 3s for other players, mostly out of the high-post; Poeltl either setting up in the low-post or acting as the primary screener (2nd in the league in screen-assists last year) doesn't negatively impact that spacing.

Don't get me wrong, if we could get a rim-protecting stretch C who's also a 60% finisher around the hoop, that would be amazing too. But those guys are super-hard to come by and the Raptors can't afford another season without a rim-protector. I don't like Poeltl as a primary trade return here... but as a rotation piece splitting minutes at C with Precious, I think that makes the Raptors a vastly improved team. (Ayton brings a similar skillset except with less rim protection, much higher salary, and an unwillingness to be a roleplayer, so I'm not a fan of targetting him.)

The Big Chill · 02-02-2023, 03:48 PM

I agree that Poeltl would instantly improve the team, but I don’t think he can take us into the upper echelon of teams with this roster. We have too many guys that can’t shoot a high percentage from outside already.

If Poeltl was an inexpensive part of the rotation that would be great, but I think he will cost too much to make it work.

Hockey_Ninja · 02-02-2023, 05:14 PM

I know the Raps aren’t having a great season. But how is Pascal being left out of the All-Star game averaging 25/8/6?

https://twitter.com/user/status/1621299088577667075

octothorp · 02-02-2023, 09:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Big Chill

I agree that Poeltl would instantly improve the team, but I don’t think he can take us into the upper echelon of teams with this roster. We have too many guys that can’t shoot a high percentage from outside already.

If Poeltl was an inexpensive part of the rotation that would be great, but I think he will cost too much to make it work.

Yeah, you could be right about that. The approach I have in my mind is a 3-team trade around FVV for Poeltl and a FRP, which would generate a large trade exception, OG for young players and picks (ideally the Lakers first and Dyson from the Pelicans, but more likely the Pelicans pick), draft two lottery picks and three first-rounders overall this year, resign GTJ and Poeltl, use both the full MLE and trade exception to build out the depth of the roster. I think Masai always favours the 'develop while competing' direction, and I think this direction would give them decent competitiveness by 2024/25 while also rebuilding the youth on the team. That's my fantasy deadline/offseason, anyway (beyond the Raptors winning the lottery). Sets up a fairly easy way for the Raptors to stay under the tax at least until Scottie's rookie extension kicks in.

Trojan97 · 02-02-2023, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hockey_Ninja

I know the Raps aren’t having a great season. But how is Pascal being left out of the All-Star game averaging 25/8/6?

https://twitter.com/user/status/1621299088577667075

An embarrassingly ignorant omission

https://twitter.com/user/status/1621300715078524928

Tsawwassen · 02-03-2023, 06:38 AM

Lebron James watch here we go. He had 26 points tonight and the Lakers had an amazing 4th quarter comeback to defeat the Pacers 112-111 in reg time.
The Pacers had a 14 point lead with 3:15 left in the 3rd quarter. Buddy Hield missed a last second jump shot to win it. James is now just 63 points behind Jabbar for the all time career points.
https://scores.nbcsports.com/nba/rec...=13&final=true

The Bucks were down 19 points with 2.5 minutes left in the 3rd quarter and also came back to win to defeat LA's other team, the Clippers, 106-105 in reg time.
Kawahi Leonard missed the last second shot for the win. Giannis Antetokounmpo had 54 points!
https://www.sportsnet.ca/basketball/nba/games/2484773/

bluejays · 02-03-2023, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trojan97

An embarrassingly ignorant omission

https://twitter.com/user/status/1621300715078524928

It’s a snub but all star games are garbage in every sport unless you’re under 12 years old. I’m more annoyed the raptors get snubbed again with something or the other. This time the snub is in the form of the all star game.

bluejays · 02-03-2023, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by octothorp

Yeah, you could be right about that. The approach I have in my mind is a 3-team trade around FVV for Poeltl and a FRP, which would generate a large trade exception, OG for young players and picks (ideally the Lakers first and Dyson from the Pelicans, but more likely the Pelicans pick), draft two lottery picks and three first-rounders overall this year, resign GTJ and Poeltl, use both the full MLE and trade exception to build out the depth of the roster. I think Masai always favours the 'develop while competing' direction, and I think this direction would give them decent competitiveness by 2024/25 while also rebuilding the youth on the team. That's my fantasy deadline/offseason, anyway (beyond the Raptors winning the lottery). Sets up a fairly easy way for the Raptors to stay under the tax at least until Scottie's rookie extension kicks in.

I’d sign up for that for sure. The Raps like you said don’t tank. It’s not Masai’s style, but getting a high pick is super super important this year. Any team getting OG with a high pick trumps all.

devo22 · 02-03-2023, 12:09 PM

https://twitter.com/user/status/1621582468762460161

Paulie Walnuts · 02-03-2023, 12:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devo22

https://twitter.com/user/status/1621582468762460161

https://twitter.com/user/status/1621588925260386304

He has been talking a lot about LeGm lately.

Russ and picks for a signed Irving probably works.

Senator Clay Davis · 02-03-2023, 01:06 PM

Lakers have no meaningful picks and Russ is still horrific. Mavs might be the sleeper here. Expect it ends up being the Heat though.

Hockey_Ninja · 02-03-2023, 02:37 PM

I’m sure wherever Kyrie goes he won’t cause any media controversy. Surely

bluejays · 02-03-2023, 11:41 PM

Surprised any contenders want Kyrie. Why does any GM think they can turn him around? He's a world class talent, but is not motivated and finds excuses to get out of having to work. If he was in the real world he'd surely have opportunities, but bosses would be sick of him and dump him by probation. In the NBA, GMs have an open book on previous employer performance, yet still have the ego to think they can do things differently. The guy is a bum. Maybe it'll work out for one playoff run, but he seems to want to do anything but play for any particular stretch for numerous puzzling reasons. I'd take a hard pass on Westbrook though. In fact, if I were a GM I'd avoid both. Westbrooks' contract is terrible long term though.

Paulie Walnuts · 02-04-2023, 08:29 AM

Westbrook is a free agent after this season.

Kyrie is an idiot for sure but I wouldn't call him a bum. The guy is averaging 28/6/6 this season those are not bum numbers.

bluejays · 02-04-2023, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

Westbrook is a free agent after this season.

Kyrie is an idiot for sure but I wouldn't call him a bum. The guy is averaging 28/6/6 this season those are not bum numbers.

re: Westbrook, I thought he was signed long term? If he's a FA, that changes everything just for that expiring contract.

Kyrie is a bum in the sense he's not reliable. If you piss him off in the playoffs and he decides he's angry, he'll just play like ####. He's a world class talent but the guy is not reliable if he doesn't want to be. That's the reason I'm calling him a bum. Never any question about his ceiling.