Largest BioFuel Plant in world to be located in ALBERTA

[SeeGeeWhy]

Originally Posted by GlobeTrotter

I'm also not sold on BioFuels, although I think they are well worth the investment in R&D - could have lots of potential, maybe not the ultimate alternative though. I think they are more of a bridge that could lead from a reliance on fossil fuels to a more permanent alternative energy source.

Interesting to note, the Carlyle Group apparently has deep affiliations with the Bush Family, and has been linked to a great deal of Saudi money. Interesting that they are going to be investing in a high profile Alberta project. I'm sure there are better websites that can outline the history of the company but check the link below out...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carlyle_Group

I'm not really trying to fire up a political discussion but its a pretty interesting story.

That much about the Carlyle group is true.

[RougeUnderoos]

Originally Posted by GlobeTrotter

Interesting to note, the Carlyle Group apparently has deep affiliations with the Bush Family, and has been linked to a great deal of Saudi money. Interesting that they are going to be investing in a high profile Alberta project. I'm sure there are better websites that can outline the history of the company but check the link below out...

They always pop up in "conspiracy theories". I don't know about that, but damn, they have a finger in every pie. Dr.Pepper, car seats, yearbooks, rental cars, car parts, publishing, internet,janitorial services,office towers, security guards,banks, hospitals, aerospace, defense...

I don't know about this biofuels business, but these people are going to make money off of it, I'm pretty sure of that.

[GreenTeaFrapp]

Originally Posted by photon

I think bio fuels are only one part of a solution; what percentage of food crops would have to be replaced with bio fuel crops? One paper I read said a huge percentage in the US just to meet the needs of all the automobiles.

For cellulose ethanol its been estimated that current crop production in the US could produce enough to displace 40% of US gas consumption. Although cellulose ethanol is currently only being produced in a demonstration plant.

[burn_baby_burn]

Originally Posted by Cowperson

Spot on . . . . to the west or the east of the elevator?

Drove a grain truck to that elevator a few times too.

Cowperson

I coudn't say. My guess would be west since that is where the land is flat. East side is Antler Hill. Lots of coffee shop talk about the land owner telling everyone that he sold the land for the plant.

[guzzy]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

How much non-renewable fossil fuel is burned in the construction, production (i.e. fertilization, harvesting, pest control, etc.) and transporting this bio fuel?

Seems like a bunch of feel-good, nothing-accomplished hooey to me.

wah wah

It's a start. PLus the whole point is that the farmers convert to biodiesel for the whole harvesting process. It is a RENEWABLE resource, not like our oil and gas resources in this province. The whole biodiesel thing is great for Alberta and Saskatechewan and gives our farmers a realistic shot at sustained profitability. If you want to go hug trees try doing it with a lot less whine because this is a step in the right direction and if you can't see that then maybe you should jump off a bridge because there is no hope for you.

[mykalberta]

Originally Posted by Bobblehead

I'm in the "I like the idea, but I'll believe it when I see it" camp. I've been reading where the requirements of all the ethanol plants already in production + being built + announced are greater than out ability to supply. Corn futures are already trending up and stockpiles are disappearing.

I applaud the progress, I just hope it turns out like expected.

From what I have heard, Alberta plans to use this to offset carbon credits if it ever gets to that point.

Also I am pretty sure its a go, the company got a 120$ mil grant from the US deparment of Energy for this project (second larges amount given out) so they already have part of the money.

Good for farmers who will finally be able to make some money by driving the price up.

MYK

[SeeGeeWhy]

Guzzy, this is a step in the right direction for what purpose? Surely not environmental benefit.

Myk, please explain how biofuels produce less emissions than conventional fuels. In other words, how does a biofuel plant generate carbon credit?

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by burn_baby_burn

I coudn't say. My guess would be west since that is where the land is flat. East side is Antler Hill. Lots of coffee shop talk about the land owner telling everyone that he sold the land for the plant.

I was on the field on the east side of the highway, described as the southeast kitty corner from Niobe elevator, running about a mile down the highway. Summer fallow. The farmer I was working for was renting it I think.

I can peg the year because of that damned song by Midler . . . 1980.

A long time ago.

My father drove by Niobe for 38 years, to and from the Penhold airbase.

Cowperson

[TurnedTheCorner]

Originally Posted by guzzy

wah wah

It's a start. PLus the whole point is that the farmers convert to biodiesel for the whole harvesting process. It is a RENEWABLE resource, not like our oil and gas resources in this province. The whole biodiesel thing is great for Alberta and Saskatechewan and gives our farmers a realistic shot at sustained profitability. If you want to go hug trees try doing it with a lot less whine because this is a step in the right direction and if you can't see that then maybe you should jump off a bridge because there is no hope for you.

Thanks for proving my point. This is an easy political issue because of the so-called environemental benefits, but it's really about subsidizing farmers. The money could be way better spent on technologies to improve recovery rates on existng reserves, let alone a viable alternative.

I work at an oil company FYI. So I don't hug trees, I burn them and shoot C02 into the atmosphere to kill your grandchildren.

[guzzy]

Originally Posted by TurnedTheCorner

Thanks for proving my point. This is an easy political issue because of the so-called environemental benefits, but it's really about subsidizing farmers. The money could be way better spent on technologies to improve recovery rates on existng reserves, let alone a viable alternative.

I work at an oil company FYI. So I don't hug trees, I burn them and shoot C02 into the atmosphere to kill your grandchildren.

There are large farmers in the states that have built small biodiesel plants and no longer require gas to run their operations. They are saving hundreds of thousands every year on fuel cost alone. It makes farmers profitable again so we can reduce subsidies that the govt currently provides.

[PeterVenkman]

Originally Posted by SeeGeeWhy

Guzzy, this is a step in the right direction for what purpose? Surely not environmental benefit.

Myk, please explain how biofuels produce less emissions than conventional fuels. In other words, how does a biofuel plant generate carbon credit?

Ag and Bio resource Engineering student here, and bio-diesel will in no way reduce emissions. That said, bio-fuel is theoretically emmisions neutral, as it creates a closed carbon cycle. Carbon from grain makes fuel, that carbon is burned for energy and makes C02, and then the C02 is used to make more grain. So we wont reduce emmisions, but we wont add any either, theoretically. The bio-fuel created is no different from regular petroleum diesel, but also has some envirnomental benifits (you can pour bio-diesel on the ground and it will easily break down to nothing). Can bio-fuels replace oil? Of course not, we are using way to much energy for that to be practical. But can we replace oil with hydropower or wind power? of course not, we are using way to much energy for that to be practical. Energy has to created from something, and renewable bio-fuels is a start in weening us off petroleum.

Pete

[Flash Walken]

Originally Posted by PeterVenkman

Ag and Bio resource Engineering student here, and bio-diesel will in no way reduce emissions. That said, bio-fuel is theoretically emmisions neutral, as it creates a closed carbon cycle. Carbon from grain makes fuel, that carbon is burned for energy and makes C02, and then the C02 is used to make more grain. So we wont reduce emmisions, but we wont add any either, theoretically. The bio-fuel created is no different from regular petroleum diesel, but also has some envirnomental benifits (you can pour bio-diesel on the ground and it will easily break down to nothing). Can bio-fuels replace oil? Of course not, we are using way to much energy for that to be practical. But can we replace oil with hydropower or wind power? of course not, we are using way to much energy for that to be practical. Energy has to created from something, and renewable bio-fuels is a start in weening us off petroleum.

Pete

Thanks for the explanation. Also, best username on this forum...unless someone has 'Egon Spangler' registered.