[News] Bobby Hull has died at age 84

[Igottago]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

They would pretty well need to remove everyone before 1960 if they wanted to make it so there were no homophobes, racists, antisemites in the hall of fame.

You really think everyone before 1960 was a terrible person? Do you or have you ever had grandparents? Have you ever heard of World War 2, where people actually had to fight real Nazis? Do you know when that happened? Do you know when slavery ended? Hint, it wasn't in your lifetime, and you weren't a part of ending it.

The sanctimonious garbage that gets spewed about older generations is beyond ridiculous.

I would also add that any types of isms and phobias aren't confined to one generation.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

I don’t know, there’s definitely a line somewhere. Depends where it gets drawn. If Hitler was some incredible hockey player, are you going to admire his accomplishments despite everything else? Well, maybe a bad example, since Bobby absolutely would, but you get the idea.

The line is definitely somewhere between Hitler and Guy With Unpaid Parking Tickets when it comes to who should be celebrated in the hall of fame.

The current agreement when it comes to institutions, cities, municipalities dealing with historical legacies is to determine what the principal legacy is.


Hitler's principle legacy is genocide.

Brian Adams principle legacy is music.

History of course is not dichotomous and it gets complicated with respect to historical actors like OJ Simpson.

I would say Hull's principal legacy is Hockey, although he is closer to the gray area than most. These things are evaluated on an on going basis, so who knows, the likes of Nellie Mcclung and others who fall into this gray area may well have their commemorations removed in the future.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by Igottago

You really think everyone before 1960 was a terrible person? Do you or have you ever had grandparents? Have you ever heard of World War 2, where people actually had to fight real Nazis? Do you know when that happened? Do you know when slavery ended? Hint, it wasn't in your lifetime, and you weren't a part of ending it.

The sanctimonious garbage that gets spewed about older generations is beyond ridiculous.

I would also add that any types of isms and phobias aren't confined to one generation.

I think that you are making a leap from what I said. I agree that it is dangerous to measure historic actors from a presentist mindset. Like I was saying in a previous post. When it comes to historic legacies, the principal legacy needs to be determined. When it comes to player submitted to the hockey hall of fame their principal legacy is hockey, and thus, their commemoration is justified.

[Yeah_Baby]

Actually, I think Bryan Adams principal legacy is his "friendship" with Diana Spencer. That and being such a militant vegan, he backed into racism during the early days of the pandemic.

[Icantwhisper]

Originally Posted by Igottago

You really think everyone before 1960 was a terrible person? Do you or have you ever had grandparents? Have you ever heard of World War 2, where people actually had to fight real Nazis? Do you know when that happened? Do you know when slavery ended? Hint, it wasn't in your lifetime, and you weren't a part of ending it.

The sanctimonious garbage that gets spewed about older generations is beyond ridiculous.

I would also add that any types of isms and phobias aren't confined to one generation.

Slavery ended? more slaves now than anytime in history

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by TheIronMaiden

I think that you are making a leap from what I said. I agree that it is dangerous to measure historic actors from a presentist mindset. Like I was saying in a previous post. When it comes to historic legacies, the principal legacy needs to be determined. When it comes to player submitted to the hockey hall of fame their principal legacy is hockey, and thus, their commemoration is justified.

I mean, it's also about the voices of those who were ignored or stepped on in carving those legacies right. The women Hull beat, or what was essentially genocides that Churchill committed in India. For me, I think it's about an entire reorganization of how we commemorate or think of historical folks. Ie there should probably be no statues of folks.

I think too we need to be cautious about the simplification of a so called 'presentist mindset'. For instance, SONG OF THE SOUTH could be considered a product of it's time. However thinking that it's only extremely racist though a modern lens completely erasing the backlash and criticism of that film when it was released. It was retrograde even then.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

I mean, it's also about the voices of those who were ignored or stepped on in carving those legacies right. The women Hull beat, or what was essentially genocides that Churchill committed in India. For me, I think it's about an entire reorganization of how we commemorate or think of historical folks. Ie there should probably be no statues of folks.

I think too we need to be cautious about the simplification of a so called 'presentist mindset'. For instance, SONG OF THE SOUTH could be considered a product of it's time. However thinking that it's only extremely racist though a modern lens completely erasing the backlash and criticism of that film when it was released. It was retrograde even then.

This is an excellent resource on the subject or historical legacies, and it will offer a much more nuanced opinion than my own, which is informed by this work and other like it.

https://www.rhodeshouse.ox.ac.uk/med...l-legacies.pdf

If you skip everything else, the decision making tree on page 11 is a good simplification of the central arguments.

Another point I agree with is that of art historian James E. Young "The best German memorial to the Fascist era and its victims may not be a single memorial at all, but simply the never to be resolved debate over which kind of memory to preserve, how to do it, in whose name and to what end. Instead of a fixed figure for memory, the debate itself - perpetually unresolved - amid ever changing conditions - might be enshrined".

[Strange Brew]

Originally Posted by Yeah_Baby

Actually, I think Bryan Adams principal legacy is his "friendship" with Diana Spencer. That and being such a militant vegan, he backed into racism during the early days of the pandemic.

I knew none of this. I thought his legacy was summer of 69.

[Yeah_Baby]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

I knew none of this. I thought his legacy was summer of 69.

Glad I could be of service with 30 year old celeb gossip.

[mennoknight]

Actually, Bryan Adams is an extremely celebrated photographer now.

https://www.thephotogallery.se/bryan-adams

[calgaryred]

I believe old Mr Hull came on Sports at 11 drunk one time.

[Ford Prefect]

I believe one of the anchors of Sports At 11 and the pride of Carnduff SK, Mike Lownsbrough, did that a time or three as well.

[Hockey_Ninja]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1620191026584633346

[Ford Prefect]

Tough. If you lived your life as a creep you deserve to be remembered as a creep.

[Paulie Walnuts]

Originally Posted by Hockey_Ninja

https://twitter.com/user/status/1620191026584633346

Not sure what he expected if he is scouring through Social Media looking for sympathy.

[Icantwhisper]

Saw a guy in the +15 wearing a Blackhawks Hull jersey today.
Is he a bad person yes or no? Serious question

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Icantwhisper

Saw a guy in the +15 wearing a Blackhawks Hull jersey today.
Is he a bad person yes or no? Serious question

Impossible to say. Why didn’t you just ask him?

[Cole436]

Originally Posted by Cali Panthers Fan

I was on the fence until this point was brought up. Now I'm convinced. Hitler is bad.


*implied green text*

You know, with Hitler, the more I learn about that guy, the more I don’t care for him.

[PuckSlap]

Originally Posted by Cole436

You know, with Hitler, the more I learn about that guy, the more I don’t care for him.

That had Norm McDonald vibes

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

[Cole436]

Originally Posted by PuckSlap

That had Norm McDonald vibes

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