Calgary Openings, Closings, and Developments

[Fuzz]

https://goo.gl/maps/8BkVJSdHUerHFrpe6

So I've been on this one in Nice, France. I think this is similar to what they envision. I'll mention that it is slow. I believe the max speed they travel is 30km/h, and the LRT is probably double that. You will notice all the barriers between transit and traffic, and the width of the ROW, and even then, it's tight to fit lanes. At this location, the width is 19m at the station. Centre is 16m(roadway, not including sidewalks). So you can already see it being tight with straight through lanes, let alone trying to add a turning lane.

Here is another spot on the line:
https://goo.gl/maps/6GphMcyEfByAyfrP7

I'm sure this is what he fantasy is, but the reality is it would be a major mistake to close off centre street like this. We have very few river crossings. Also, it makes for a slow train, which is the opposite of what we want, moving people from far distances quickly and conveniently so they dont' choose a car instead. We have a fantasy battling reality, and it looks like they have come down on the wrong side.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Oh god no. That would be horrible.

Worse than what we currently have? That intersection is a #### show without the C-Train.

Add the Green Line crossing there every few minutes and it will be worse than the garbage intersections on 36th Street, with more traffic volume.

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by getbak

Worse than what we currently have? That intersection is a #### show without the C-Train.

Add the Green Line crossing there every few minutes and it will be worse than the garbage intersections on 36th Street, with more traffic volume.

I'd take all of that versus adding an interchange there. Complete opposite of what should be done in an urban area like that. Might as well build the downtown penetrator while we are at it.

[Fuzz]

Definitely doesn't need and interchange, but also doesn't need an at grade LRT.

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Definitely doesn't need and interchange, but also doesn't need an at grade LRT.

Damn the cost, I would have loved the tunnel under the river and not coming up until past 16th avenue. We would have had some seriously deep stations, could have come in handy as bomb shelters.

[Fuzz]

And that's why the bridge/elevated line is a good compromise on cost, without the drawbacks of subterranean stations that may contain the Balrog. You want to risk that?

[Bigtime]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

And that's why the bridge/elevated line is a good compromise on cost, without the drawbacks of subterranean stations that may contain the Balrog. You want to risk that?

Yes, yes I do. I believe someone like Locke would argue that a Balrog would improve Sunnyside.

[getbak]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

I'd take all of that versus adding an interchange there. Complete opposite of what should be done in an urban area like that. Might as well build the downtown penetrator while we are at it.

Maybe interchange is the wrong word. I'm not thinking of something massive like 16th Ave and 14th St., but there needs to be some sort of separation between 16th and the C-Train and ideally better traffic flow between 16th and Centre St.

[bob-loblaw]

I'm still waiting for one of my favourite restaurants to re-open. Looking at you, Smugglers.

[BlackArcher101]

Originally Posted by bob-loblaw

I'm still waiting for one of my favourite restaurants to re-open. Looking at you, Smugglers.

I have a feeling everything that made it your favorite will be gone when it re-opens.
Also, apparently opening Jan 30, but that was news from a few weeks ago, but have also heard March. So who the F knows. They are floating a lot of expenses there keeping it closed.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Bigtime

I'd take all of that versus adding an interchange there. Complete opposite of what should be done in an urban area like that. Might as well build the downtown penetrator while we are at it.

Uh...was that something that Thor proposed to you?

Originally Posted by Bigtime

Yes, yes I do. I believe someone like Locke would argue that a Balrog would improve Sunnyside.

Of course! Just imagine how many Lattes a Balrog would consume! It would completely revamp the Sunnyside economy!

And thats not even mentioning the exponential increase in quality of local Poetry Slams with the participation of a Balrog!

No more flooding risks for Sunnyside if a Balrog has a vested interest in it!

[Fuzz]

The Penetrator was an official name for a concept of a freeway through downtown.

[Shazam]

I think my wife has a downtown penetrator in her nightstand.

[Lubicon]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

https://goo.gl/maps/8BkVJSdHUerHFrpe6

So I've been on this one in Nice, France. I think this is similar to what they envision. I'll mention that it is slow. I believe the max speed they travel is 30km/h, and the LRT is probably double that. You will notice all the barriers between transit and traffic, and the width of the ROW, and even then, it's tight to fit lanes. At this location, the width is 19m at the station. Centre is 16m(roadway, not including sidewalks). So you can already see it being tight with straight through lanes, let alone trying to add a turning lane.
I'm sure this is what he fantasy is, but the reality is it would be a major mistake to close off centre street like this. We have very few river crossings. Also, it makes for a slow train, which is the opposite of what we want, moving people from far distances quickly and conveniently so they dont' choose a car instead. We have a fantasy battling reality, and it looks like they have come down on the wrong side.

I'm not sure I'm sold on at grade LRT either but keep in mind average traffic speed on Centre Street for vehicles is also probably 30 km/h (or slower). If the train can match that then it is a wash in terms of speed of travel.

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Definitely doesn't need and interchange, but also doesn't need an at grade LRT.

100% agreed here. At grade crossing one of the only E/W routes north of the Bow does not seem wise.

[bizaro86]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

I'm not sure I'm sold on at grade LRT either but keep in mind average traffic speed on Centre Street for vehicles is also probably 30 km/h (or slower). If the train can match that then it is a wash in terms of speed of travel.



100% agreed here. At grade crossing one of the only E/W routes north of the Bow does not seem wise.

The train needs to travel faster than cars when its moving to be a wash because it spends more time stopped at stations.

[Julio]

Originally Posted by bizaro86

The train needs to travel faster than cars when its moving to be a wash because it spends more time stopped at stations.

But much, much less times at stop lights, so I'm not sure about that.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Joborule

As for lack of TOD development. Majority of them are definitely cases of not working at least up to this point. There's many factors in why that's probably the case, but again using Kensington as an example, they can work if the environment is set right for them. Sunnyside has a good amount of density buildings that are going up within the LRT vincity, and shows what TOD can amount to around here. Crescent Heights is similar with regards to its proximity to downtown, and the station being very accessible like Sunnyside. Actually if the station is underground or elevated, it would have a detrimental effect on accessibility due to dealing with stairs or having to use elevators if you have mobility constraints.

On the flip side, at-grade presents mobility challenges of its own (fewer crossings, and pedestrian priority is reduced even further at signalled crossings).

I'm on Team Underground until north of 16th. It can be cut and cover and we can still redesign the Centre St public realm to suck less.

This is another issue entirely, but I think they are missing substantial savings by not running down 1st St SW instead of 2nd. Far less and far simpler tunnelling under the beltline/CP tracks, and the bridge over the Bow would be simpler and less of an eyesore to PIP.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Lubicon

I'm not sure I'm sold on at grade LRT either but keep in mind average traffic speed on Centre Street for vehicles is also probably 30 km/h (or slower). If the train can match that then it is a wash in terms of speed of travel.

That's kind of the point though, if you grade separate it you can run 70km/h. If you run it through a busy street with traffic and pedestrians, it's more liekly to be 30. So what I am saying is by doing this, they are turning a commuter line into a local slow tramline that doesn't really have benefits to any group.

[tvp2003]

Once the green line is built up to 16 Avenue N, just make Centre Street one way into downtown during the morning commute, and then one way out of downtown during the evening commute.

Only partially joking...

[DownInFlames]

Originally Posted by bob-loblaw

I'm still waiting for one of my favourite restaurants to re-open. Looking at you, Smugglers.

They have a sign out front saying they are re-opening on the 30th. I’m not sure if it’ll be as good as the Smugglers of old, but it should be back in business finally.