[PGT] Flames 4 Gaudreau 3 (OT Win)

[GioforPM]

The second goal was a "should have had" IMO. It crossed the so called royal road. But the puck took a fair bit to get there - it was a long pass, and Vladar had time to get over. It ended up being not a great angle. And Vladar just allowed it to squeak through.

Now, it was a super heavy shot and the mere velocity causes it to make it past Vladar. But I guarantee you that posters would have faulted Markstrom on that goal. Proof? They are blaming him for imaginary goals in this very thread. More proof? He was blamed for a breakaway goal by the same guy last time they played.

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Mario Kart is not Royal Road, it’s Rainbow Road…. eDuCaTe yOurSelF!!!!

Vladar really should be able to stop a turtle shell across the Rainbow Road 100/100. A high velocity one timer from Laine across the Royal Road placed right between the pad and blocker is a different story.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

The second goal was a "should have had" IMO. It crossed the so called royal road. But the puck took a fair bit to get there - it was a long pass, and Vladar had time to get over. It ended up being not a great angle. And Vladar just allowed it to squeak through.

Now, it was a super heavy shot and the mere velocity causes it to make it past Vladar. But I guarantee you that posters would have faulted Markstrom on that goal. Proof? They are blaming him for imaginary goals in this very thread. More proof? He was blamed for a breakaway goal by the same guy last time they played.

It certainly wasn't "the hardest save of the game"

Pretty sure everyone on the ice thought he had it at first

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by dino7c

It certainly wasn't "the hardest save of the game"

Pretty sure everyone on the ice thought he had it at first

I sure did and I was in a prime viewing location. Didn't know it was in until Laine started celebrating. And then the light came on.

I'm not saying it was soft. I'm saying it wasn't impossible. And that seems to be the standard for Markstrom these days. That said, Vladar should get more for the time being. There's a BTB Thursday and Friday so I expect they will split those. But after that it's Vladar's net for now.

[Joborule]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

This team really has a way of making terrible goalies look good.

Originally Posted by dino7c

That may be true but Korpisalo is a really good goalie....910 playing behind that hot mess

It certainly would be nice to have more games against weaker opponents in the standings where you can say the Flames goalie was the better goalie. Get some more comfortable wins against teams the Flames should be favoured against.

[JohnnyB]

Vladar was fine. His save percentage wasn't good, but all the Columbus goals were good goals.

Also, glad that we're seeing Sutter give young guys a chance. He's not throwing young players into the deep end, or disrupting how the team works with them. He's just integrating them with patience. He's steadfastly working on the team game and not rushing Pelletier. It's a good approach imo.

[SuperMatt18]

Yeah to me that was a game that was really similar to the majority of Markstrom's this year.

Nothing that is "blatantly" soft, but nothing that also seemed impossible.

The first and third were nice shots (although I'd argue on the third that space shouldn't be there if you're out and playing aggressive to cut down the angle.) and the second was savable but still a great pass and one timer by an elite shooter.

The problem isn't really any single goal in isolation - but more that you just hope all three wouldn't go in, which has been Markstrom's issue this year too.

[All In Good Time]

I have a sinking feeling that Tanev is gone for a long time. Interested to see the transactions updates over the next day or two.

[Bonded]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Yeah to me that was a game that was really similar to the majority of Markstrom's this year.

Nothing that is "blatantly" soft, but nothing that also seemed impossible.

The first and third were nice shots (although I'd argue on the third that space shouldn't be there if you're out and playing aggressive to cut down the angle.) and the second was savable but still a great pass and one timer by an elite shooter.

The problem isn't really any single goal in isolation - but more that you just hope all three wouldn't go in, which has been Markstrom's issue this year too.

Markstrom would 100% being raked over the coals. The real difference is that Vladar has gotten run support. I am not really comfortable with either right now. Neither looking like they would be the best goalie in a playoff round.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Yeah to me that was a game that was really similar to the majority of Markstrom's this year.

Nothing that is "blatantly" soft, but nothing that also seemed impossible.

The first and third were nice shots (although I'd argue on the third that space shouldn't be there if you're out and playing aggressive to cut down the angle.) and the second was savable but still a great pass and one timer by an elite shooter.

The problem isn't really any single goal in isolation - but more that you just hope all three wouldn't go in, which has been Markstrom's issue this year too.

I agree they're similar, I just have a different perspective on how that translates to how we view the goalies. I think they are both playing well enough to win and Markstrom has been unlucky in the run support he's received.

BTW, I think the third goal was maybe Vladar guessing that Jenner would pass to Johnny, which IMO is a pretty decent guess, though wrong.

The team did allow near-catastrophic failures despite a dominant performance. The Gaudreau breakaway and a penalty shot on it. The triple icing with mostly the 4th line on. Kadri's over the glass. That two on one.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by All In Good Time

I have a sinking feeling that Tanev is gone for a long time. Interested to see the transactions updates over the next day or two.

Typical Tanev though. He was clearly hurt on the check, but he made a really solid play and cleared the zone before going off and straight to the room.

[Burning Beard]

Tanev is my favorite Flame since Iginla. Hope he isn't out long. He is the leader on this team it feels like.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Bonded

Markstrom would 100% being raked over the coals. The real difference is that Vladar has gotten run support. I am not really comfortable with either right now. Neither looking like they would be the best goalie in a playoff round.

There are three big differences between the two goalies right now:

1) Vladar has 100% been better in close games. Their save percentages when the game is within 1 goal is example of that:

Vladar: 0.915
Markstrom: 0.885

That's why people have more trust in Vladar right now. That feeling that he does a better job of keeping a job in the games when it's close is 100% correct right now.

2) Vladar is making more of the tough saves.

HDSV%: 0.844 VS 0.821
MDSV%: 0.887 VS 0.867
LDSV%: 0.946 VS 0.962

Total: 0.903 VS 0.895

Interestingly enough Vladar has actually let in more low danger goals this season, but across HD and MD he's making more saves. This corresponds to me saying last night's game was similar to Markstrom's play this year IMO - nothing was soft but too many of the good chances went in.

3) Salary & Expectations

When you're making $6M per season, and were a Vezina finalist the year before you're going to have higher expectations when you are struggling.

It's no different than people really harping on Huberdeau and Weegar's struggles at times. When you are big Free Agent signings you tend to get more scrutiny.

People expect little from the back up (especially with the Flames history), so when it feels like he's keeping them in this playoff race he's going to get more benefit of the doubt.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

Yeah to me that was a game that was really similar to the majority of Markstrom's this year.

Nothing that is "blatantly" soft, but nothing that also seemed impossible.

The first and third were nice shots (although I'd argue on the third that space shouldn't be there if you're out and playing aggressive to cut down the angle.) and the second was savable but still a great pass and one timer by an elite shooter.

The problem isn't really any single goal in isolation - but more that you just hope all three wouldn't go in, which has been Markstrom's issue this year too.

Exactly my view.

Flames goalies are near that expected goals against most nights. Not better not worse very often.

Just meh.

But Vladar is winning games, and although that really can't be attributed to him solely (though I see attempts at this) a win is a win and has to be taken into account.

Just looked at the math and if you assign differentials to bands the Flames tandem has 35 of 48 games within one goal of expected. 8 games better and 5 games worse than a goal away.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Wastedyouth

This team really has a way of making terrible goalies look good.

They may get some shots from high danger areas but quite often they are being tightly checked and don't have that 1 second they need to get a quality shot off. They're not creating space for themselves they're just going into tight areas and hoping to get lucky. So they get a lot of shots off but most of them truly aren't high quality.

[taxbuster]

Thought the OT with Raz, Lindy and Backs starting vs JG was a brilliant choice! Even if they hadn't gained possession on the F/O, those guys know how OT works. They played incredible keep-away and removed the surprise quick ending that CBJ was hoping for. Just excellent!

And I have no problem with Darth's tending. Goals are gonna happen. It takes an entire team to lose most of the time...and an entire team to win, again most of the time. The odd lousy performance (Weegar, looking at you!) can be salvaged.

[CroFlames]

A few thoughts from the game.



- That was the most high energy crowd I've seen on a Monday night ever.
- The booing was world class, and rose to a crescendo during the penalty shot. There was no way he was making that; he was shaking like a leaf. Credit to the fans on that one.
- He dove in overtime and cost his team. He was so upset when the Flames scored because he thought he was fouled.
- Huberdeau was playing physical and aggressive. I loved it. He had some boneheaded mistakes/passes, but it was super refreshing to see his drive and I hope he keeps it up.

- Pelletier is an NHL man. He was great all over, and was trusted to be on PP2
- Duehr is reliable and I like what he brings. Surely Sutter trusts them now over some of those plug veterans.

- Anderson played a great game and holy I loved the pass back to Vladar with authority in OT. That play should be used more to keep possession.

- Didn't like the standing ovation for johnny during the video.

- No peanuts at the dome is a travesty.
- This team immediately has a different make up when Tanev is out. If a coach could wave a magic want and create a perfect d-man, it would be Tanev. Beak, missing teeth and flow included.

- The black Blasty is a legitimately awesome jersey.

[taxbuster]

Oh - one more thing: I wish Huby would SHOOT when he's 15' from the net instead of always passing (usually to....nothing and no-one).

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by taxbuster

Thought the OT with Raz, Lindy and Backs starting vs JG was a brilliant choice! Even if they hadn't gained possession on the F/O, those guys know how OT works. They played incredible keep-away and removed the surprise quick ending that CBJ was hoping for. Just excellent!

And I have no problem with Darth's tending. Goals are gonna happen. It takes an entire team to lose most of the time...and an entire team to win, again most of the time. The odd lousy performance (Weegar, looking at you!) can be salvaged.

Sutter basically linematched Backlund and Lindy v. Gaudreau in OT, and Gaudreau was played a lot (which is one reason why Huberdeau didn't emerge, plus Sutter went with faster guys).

[looooob]

Originally Posted by CroFlames

A few thoughts from the game.



- That was the most high energy crowd I've seen on a Monday night ever.
- The booing was world class, and rose to a crescendo during the penalty shot. There was no way he was making that; he was shaking like a leaf. Credit to the fans on that one.
- He dove in overtime and cost his team. He was so upset when the Flames scored because he thought he was fouled.
- Huberdeau was playing physical and aggressive. I loved it. He had some boneheaded mistakes/passes, but it was super refreshing to see his drive and I hope he keeps it up.

- Pelletier is an NHL man. He was great all over, and was trusted to be on PP2
- Duehr is reliable and I like what he brings. Surely Sutter trusts them now over some of those plug veterans.

- Anderson played a great game and holy I loved the pass back to Vladar with authority in OT. That play should be used more to keep possession.

- Didn't like the standing ovation for johnny during the video.

- No peanuts at the dome is a travesty.
- This team immediately has a different make up when Tanev is out. If a coach could wave a magic want and create a perfect d-man, it would be Tanev. Beak, missing teeth and flow included.

- The black Blasty is a legitimately awesome jersey.

agree with the bulk of this post


doubling down on your Huberdeau observations- whether obvious on TV or not, he brought intensity last night, more than I've seen, yes he had some braincramps still



the Johnny thing- I think slight disagree. the boos were well earned and well done, but the standing ovation (which was likely spread equal parts between the booers and the non booers I also get- the guy was a fantastic Flame, worth the price of admission many nights when there wasn't much else). I can get why people didn't cheer him on, but get those who did