Canadian Federal Politics Thread v5

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by ThePrince

Not sure if this is rhetorical/mocking, or a serious question...

Serious. Why do we get singled out?

[shotinthebacklund]

Isn’t it ignorant to paint every rural person with the “farmer/rancher” cliché?

Did anyone say every person who lives outside of a city is an uneducated redneck? How is that less of a strawman than what Fuzz posted?

I did not say every rural person was a "farmer /rancher" Further more, Ignorant and cliche? by this post, one could imply your beliefs that being a farmer/rancher is distasteful? Probably not, I would hate to infer anything from this short post. The reality is, rural people are much more likely to be in the production of agriculture, servicing the needs of those in agriculture, or those maintaining the infrastructure of those in agriculture, then to be Corporate lawyers. Yes, there are without a doubt many exceptions to this, but you know that and are trying to play semantics. Fuzz's strawman is in true form of the meaning, you are trying to apply your false perception of my statement to the term.

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

I'll defer to farmers when I need food grown, just as they should defer to medical experts when a pandemic shows up.

Funny.

Farmers / ranchers all pushed back on the doctors advice? I must have missed that. Was there some farmers / ranchers? Certainly.

Farmers and ranchers lives kept going during the pandemic. People still had to eat, even if they weren’t working.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by ThePrince

I think Calgarypuck has more nuanced opinions, like jayswin said, but I think as soon as you go to a more Canada-wide forum (Reddit for example), Albertans are definitely painted as an uneducated, redneck province that just wants to watch Canada burn, like Trumpists in the US. At the same time, there's definitely Albertans that see other provinces as the woke liberal snowflakes, so it definitely goes both ways.

It's too bad that that's how each side views the other because like I stated, it just drives a wedge between the two sides and creates so much animosity that you can't have constructive conversations about what will make Canada better. At the end of the day, I truly believe that both sides want better lives for themselves, their children, and all Canadians in general, but until we put our pitchforks down and try and understand the other side rather than demonizing them, we won't be able to make the progress we need to ensure a prosperous future for Canada. I know I'm guilty of it too sometimes.

Alberta as a whole cares way too much about what everyone thinks about them. We may or may not think you are a bunch of yokels, but 99.999999999% we just aren't thinking of you at all. Just like you aren't thinking about us. No one hates Albertans or wants harm to them.

If you seriously did decide to to have a real referendum about leaving Canada - we'd all parade down to Calgary or Edmonton and have a big rally and hope you'd stay.

[ThePrince]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Serious. Why do we get singled out?

Not to sound like a broken record, but I do believe a lot of it stems from the general attitude of the province towards the oil and gas industry. Support of the industry gets equated with being a climate change denier, which is one of the hallmarks of what is perceived as far right ideology. So if you like oil and gas, you're a far right climate denier, and far right people are racist rednecks, and therefore that must be the average person in Alberta. I don't think Albertans do themselves many favours and a lot of the behaviours you see propagate this belief, but I also think its akin to a dog getting pushed into a corner.

To put it more simply - in terms of straight voting behaviour, Alberta is basically a conservative whitemap (other than Edmonton) mainly because of the strength of the oil and gas industry and how it affects voting. People see a province that votes almost exclusively conservative, and equate that with the common right wing stereotype that they must be racist, redneck climate deniers.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by ThePrince

Not to sound like a broken record, but I do believe a lot of it stems from the general attitude of the province towards the oil and gas industry. Support of the industry gets equated with being a climate change denier, which is one of the hallmarks of what is perceived as far right ideology. So if you like oil and gas, you're a far right climate denier, and far right people are racist rednecks, and therefore that must be the average person in Alberta. I don't think Albertans do themselves many favours and a lot of the behaviours you see propagate this belief, but I also think its akin to a dog getting pushed into a corner.

This is just one part of the equation, I think, but I do think it's quite a large part. But open to other interpretations/suggestions.

You basically built a chain of logic that leads to the reason being that it is other people's interpretation of thoughts and actions, rather than those thoughts and actions being the problem. The reason those items link together is becuase they are often all on the same tailgate of a truck.

Jason Kenney felt the need to "appeal" to Albertans by rolling around in a truck while campaigning. Conspicuous consumption. We tell the rest of the country we don't care about carbon emmisions, so the impression they get is we drive big trucks and don't care for the environment.

And then you have the Freedom Convoy, heavily represented by Alberta and loud Albertans, showing the world "who we are." Even today, all up and down the #2 there are literal signs of these attitudes.

The problem is, the visible part of Alberta to the rest of the country is portrayed exactly how they interpret us. My suggestion is to stop portraying ourselves as this.

[ThePrince]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

You basically built a chain of logic that leads to the reason being that it is other people's interpretation of thoughts and actions, rather than those thoughts and actions being the problem. The reason those items link together is becuase they are often all on the same tailgate of a truck.

Jason Kenney felt the need to "appeal" to Albertans by rolling around in a truck while campaigning. Conspicuous consumption. We tell the rest of the country we don't care about carbon emmisions, so the impression they get is we drive big trucks and don't care for the environment.

And then you have the Freedom Convoy, heavily represented by Alberta and loud Albertans, showing the world "who we are." Even today, all up and down the #2 there are literal signs of these attitudes.

The problem is, the visible part of Alberta to the rest of the country is portrayed exactly how they interpret us. My suggestion is to stop portraying ourselves as this.

I knew you were just trying to bait me into a response. My intention isn't to get into a back and forth here as we clearly disagree on things fundamentally, and I don't believe either of us would engage in a good faith conversation.

It's unfortunate because this is the exact situation I was lamenting above, but again it's devolved into "but it's just X side's fault". I'm going to end it here.

[Fuzz]

That wasn't bait. LOL. Do you understated how discussions work?

But open to other interpretations/suggestions.

Apparently you are not.

[ThePrince]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

That wasn't bait. LOL. Do you understated how discussions work?

Apparently you are not.

As I stated, I'm happy to have that discussion with someone who wants to discuss in good faith. You don't fit that bill, as it seems you're just determined to put yourself on the higher ground so that you can punch down on others.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by ThePrince

As I stated, I'm happy to have that discussion with someone who wants to discuss in good faith. You don't fit that bill, as it seems you're just determined to put yourself on the higher ground so that you can punch down on others.

"I'll only discuss things with people who agree with my conclusions."

I didn't punch at anyone. I just pointed out that if you dress like a clown, don't be surprised if people call you a clown.

[Fuzz]

Aww jeez, I just can't figure out why the rest of the country thinks we drive pickup trucks and hate carbon taxes!

[Azure]

Originally Posted by Doctorfever

Funny.

Farmers / ranchers all pushed back on the doctors advice? I must have missed that. Was there some farmers / ranchers? Certainly.

Farmers and ranchers lives kept going during the pandemic. People still had to eat, even if they weren’t working.

Interestingly enough, educated suburban rich white moms living in California are generally the demographic that has been most anti-vax, even before COVID.

Fuzz just likes applying labels to people he perceives as being the problem.

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Azure

Interestingly enough, educated suburban rich white moms living in California are generally the demographic that has been most anti-vax, even before COVID.

Fuzz just likes applying labels to people he perceives as being the problem.

This may have been true pre-Covid but I’d be interested to see evidence that this is true post Covid. Is your basis more than just anecdotal.

[CaptainCrunch]

The Arrivecan app build coming under heavy scrutiny.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/tru...ient-1.6723202

Prime Minister Justin Trudeau said Monday it was "illogical and inefficient" for the public service to give millions of dollars in contracts to a two-person firm that subcontracted out its work on the ArriveCAN app.
Trudeau said he has asked Canada's top bureaucrat to probe the matter.
Trudeau made the remarks after a report by the Globe and Mail said that GCstrategies subcontracted out $8.3 million of $9 million in federal contracts related to the app's development to six outside companies.
Trudeau was asked why the public service couldn't hire those subcontractors or perform the work itself. "That's exactly the question that I just asked the public service," he said.
"Obviously, this is a practice that seems highly illogical and inefficient and I have made sure that the clerk of the Privy Council is looking into procurement practices to make sure that we are getting value for money and that we are doing things in a smart and logical way," he added.
"Of course, during the pandemic speed was at an essence, helping people quickly was at an essence, but there are principles that we make sure are sound moving forward."

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Aww jeez, I just can't figure out why the rest of the country thinks we drive pickup trucks and hate carbon taxes!

That’s an Ontarian cosplaying Albertan.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by GGG

That’s an Ontarian cosplaying Albertan.

True, the Laurentian Elites who like to come around here to tell us how to run the province could be done without.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Azure

Interestingly enough, educated suburban rich white moms living in California are generally the demographic that has been most anti-vax, even before COVID.

Fuzz just likes applying labels to people he perceives as being the problem.

I don't think you should be afraid to call a duck a duck. The first task is to identify the problem.

[Weitz]

I think the majority of Albertans don’t care how the rest of Canada views us.

[Matata]

Originally Posted by Weitz

I think the majority of Albertans don’t care how the rest of Canada views us.

Equalization payments force us to care a lot about our relations with the rest of the country.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Aww jeez, I just can't figure out why the rest of the country thinks we drive pickup trucks and hate carbon taxes!

Ugh...and the 'Carbon Tax' lettering should be behind the cross-out not superimposed on it!