Canadian Federal Politics Thread v5

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by SebC

Swappable batteries definitely seem the way to go for me. And the abuse incentives are easy to get around - just add a fee for overcharging/overdraining. The monitoring gets attached to the battery, so any duds could be identified before a customer gets stranded. You can make the standardized packs modular, so a long-range, large, or specialized vehicle might take multiple.

No offense meant, but this sounds like you don't understand the issues or challenges. Would your fee engage if you charge the battery to 100%? Or only if you do it multiple times in a week? Would you have to worry about incurring a fee if you end up with no way to charge? How do you know which event may have damaged a cell? Was it repeated heavy acceleration on a really hot day? How do you prove damage, since all of these things don't necessarily cause it? When you buy the car do you own the battery, or is the car much cheaper, and you pay more for battery access? If you buy the car with the batter, why would you want to swap it for what might be an old one? Do you end up with a better chemistry, or worse? Tesla currently has 4 different types in use.

As for standard packs, packaging is of the utmost importance. You aren't going to have perfect rectangles that leave wasted space. Every shape of vehicle has it's own unique challenge and design compromises. Do you have a cooling bus each module plugs into, or do you daisy chain them to reduce space waste? Do you go with Tesla style cells, or pouch style? Each have their own drawbacks/benefits. What happens when battery tech changes in 2-5 years, and you have to stockpile different ones, which will inevitably have their own unique setup? In 10 years you may need 5 types of packs in stock.

[The Fisher Account]

Somewhat related though, but I think in Taiwan the swappable battery thing works great for scooters. They're light enough that there are giant charging walls where you can just go and do a swap. If we werent' so car-beholden in North America, something like that could definitely work.

[Fuzz]

Ya, the scooter swap bikes look like a great use case for them.

[Enoch Root]

Scooters I could see - with one, small battery to swap.

Cars? No chance. The better plan is to have charging lanes on the highway, IMO. But it would take many years to build that infrastructure.

[Enoch Root]

But if you want buy-in from consumers, that is a great way to get it. If there were free charging lanes, which could also be treated as exclusive (like HOV lanes), that would be a huge perk for EV adoption.

And how great would that be for EV semi's?

[TorqueDog]

Originally Posted by Maritime Q-Scout

Yes my post was absurd. Almost as absurd as EV drivers being stranded.

Gasoline powered cars do have batteries that lose effectiveness in cold weather. This isn't a new phenomenon.

The article isn't some sort of 'gotcha' but more of a 'no s***' we already live with this.

Is it really that different from knowing you need to fill your gas tank?

I think you're underestimating the absurdity of your own post.

Gasoline-powered (ICE) car:
- 12V unit: Only battery needed, required to start engine and fire spark plugs, run accessories (HVAC, stereo), is recharged by petrol engine via alternator as long as the motor is running. If the 12V battery can at least start the engine (isn't too old, high enough CCA rating), then short of a faulty alternator, the loss of capacity in cold weather isn't an issue.

EV; two batteries:
- 12V unit; 12V unit powers accessories and is recharged as the vehicle is driven, so loss of capacity is not an issue.
- Main vehicle battery: Is responsible for basically the entire operation of the vehicle; propulsion, transmission. Is only recharged through a) regen. braking (so a non-factor on the highway), and b) being plugged in. Loss of capacity in cold weather directly correlates with reduced range.

The only parallel between ICE cars and EVs in this context is that they HAVE batteries. Battery capacity is directly tied to range in an EV where that relationship simply does not exist in an ICE vehicle. Now consider you're driving from Alberta eastward (destination Sask. or MB) where charging infrastructure is not nearly as mature and built-up as it is out west and also where it gets bloody COLD. If you're not careful with planning your trip, or the weather takes an unexpected turn, you could very well come up short of making it to the charger you'd planned on. Provided you aren't putting your foot into it, ICE range is relatively consistent once the engine has reached operating temperature, and the refueling infrastructure to support it is in abundance pretty much anywhere there's a paved road (and some not paved).

Hell, we live in a place where you can get a 30 degree temperature swing over a 24 hour period. If that happens and you suddenly have 50% less range than you had planned on, you better have a charging outlet nearby.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by The Fisher Account

Somewhat related though, but I think in Taiwan the swappable battery thing works great for scooters. They're light enough that there are giant charging walls where you can just go and do a swap. If we werent' so car-beholden in North America, something like that could definitely work.

Yeah and scooters are awesome and all when its warm, I dont know about you but I aint signing up to feel the breeze on my face and the wind in my hair at -30.

[you&me]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

The battery in a model S weighs 1200 pounds. That's going to require quite an effort to swap... probably just easier to charge the thing.

Obviously the concept for interchangeable batteries would require something modular. I can't remember where I read it (I feel like it was Fortune), but the idea was to develop a standard, modular battery system, with each cell about the size of a large briefcase.

Need more range? Pull into a battery station and swap a cell or two. The driver pays for the net amount of charge gained between the swapped cells.

Need a little range, just to get home? Swap one cell. "Refilling" on a long road trip? Swap them all.

Base model cars might only have 2-3 cells with limited range, while higher end / performance models might have 10++ cells.

Users could still charge at home and keep the cells in their vehicles for as long as needed between swaps... Kinda like a propane tank for a BBQ.

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

But if you want buy-in from consumers, that is a great way to get it. If there were free charging lanes, which could also be treated as exclusive (like HOV lanes), that would be a huge perk for EV adoption.

And how great would that be for EV semi's?

You had me until it sounds like you want to encourage this by sharing a driving lane with the EV semis... That would be a deal breaker for me.

[The Fisher Account]

Originally Posted by Locke

Yeah and scooters are awesome and all when its warm, I dont know about you but I aint signing up to feel the breeze on my face and the wind in my hair at -30.

You still have hair?

[Yoho]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1608144137651621890

Rosie will get a scolding for this interview question.

[Envitro]

Gun legislation is the "easy button" for the Liberals to score some cheap political points with the urban crowd. That's all it is, that's all it ever will be.

[Locke]

Originally Posted by Envitro

Gun legislation is the "easy button" for the Liberals to score some cheap political points with the urban crowd. That's all it is, that's all it ever will be.

I dont know personally, and I dont even really care. I've never really considered owning a gun, but even then I think this legislation is biased and heavy handed.

But we'll never agree on that though! So we shall settle this with a Duel!!

Pistols at dawn!!

[Locke]

Originally Posted by The Fisher Account

You still have hair?

I do. Its real...and its spectacular.

[calgarygeologist]

Originally Posted by you&me

Obviously the concept for interchangeable batteries would require something modular. I can't remember where I read it (I feel like it was Fortune), but the idea was to develop a standard, modular battery system, with each cell about the size of a large briefcase.

Need more range? Pull into a battery station and swap a cell or two. The driver pays for the net amount of charge gained between the swapped cells.

Need a little range, just to get home? Swap one cell. "Refilling" on a long road trip? Swap them all.

Base model cars might only have 2-3 cells with limited range, while higher end / performance models might have 10++ cells.

Users could still charge at home and keep the cells in their vehicles for as long as needed between swaps... Kinda like a propane tank for a BBQ.



You had me until it sounds like you want to encourage this by sharing a driving lane with the EV semis... That would be a deal breaker for me.

There is a YouTuber who does a lot of EV stuff and I saw one of his videos when he was in Sweden driving a Chinese EV. The brand has two or three battery swap stations around Sweden and the video was showing that process. It was pretty cool and only took about 10 minutes. You order it in an app, the car drives itself into the swapping garage, the floor opens up and drops the current battery and installs a new one. The station was rather small and only stores 12 or 15 batteries that charge in a storage wall.

[Fuzz]

https://www.theautopian.com/china-is...know-about-it/

This is a good summary of battery swapping in China.

[The Fisher Account]

Originally Posted by Envitro

Gun legislation is the "easy button" for the Liberals to score some cheap political points with the urban crowd. That's all it is, that's all it ever will be.

Well, as an urban person not wanting to die in the crossfire of bullets or have some kid shoot up my childs school with an assault rifle... great.

[Doctorfever]

Originally Posted by The Fisher Account

Well, as an urban person not wanting to die in the crossfire of bullets or have some kid shoot up my childs school with an assault rifle... great.

Well, it’s your lucky day. Because this will totally prevent all that. You can sleep easy knowing Justin has solved that problem.

Green text, in case I didn’t lay it on thick enough.

[Derek Sutton]

Originally Posted by The Fisher Account

Well, as an urban person not wanting to die in the crossfire of bullets or have some kid shoot up my childs school with an assault rifle... great.

This is the biggest part of the problem. This poster has no idea of the legislation and regulations currently in place, thinks anyone of us can just head out to Bass Pro Shops, pick up an AR15 or a 9mm and start spraying away.

[Zulu29]

Originally Posted by Derek Sutton

This is the biggest part of the problem. This poster has no idea of the legislation and regulations currently in place, thinks anyone of us can just head out to Bass Pro Shops, pick up an AR15 or a 9mm and start spraying away.

I don’t think anyone needs an AR-15 or similar weapons, I also don’t think the government is doing enough to stem the flow of illegal guns, deter their possession or adequately enforce the laws. Why can’t this country just do all of the above if they are serious about tackling gun crime?

[SebC]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

No offense meant, but this sounds like you don't understand the issues or challenges.

Challenges, schmallenges. Swappable batteries solves the inherent problem EVs have so as a civilized and sentient species let's get together and start making it work. At the very least, figure out a system for range extension via battery trailers.