[News] Zohorna recalled. Phillips and DeSimone assigned to Wranglers

[Lanny_McDonald]

Matthew Phillips is the new Jason Morgan. So much angst over a player who never really had a chance of being an NHLer.

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Matthew Phillips is the new Jason Morgan. So much angst over a player who never really had a chance of being an NHLer.

Morgan: 6'1" centre, 37 points in 76 AHL games at age 25

Phillips: 5'8" winger, 30 points in 20 AHL games at age 24

Doesn't feel like a very appropriate comparison. When Morgan was Phillips' age, he was in the ECHL.

[ResAlien]

So, Zohorna recalled huh? That’s pretty neat.

[Burning Beard]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

So, Zohorna recalled huh? That’s pretty neat.

Yeah he was looking decent before he got sick. Maybe we see him draw in for Ritchie tonight. Or Ruzicka if he is still sick.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

Morgan: 6'1" centre, 37 points in 76 AHL games at age 25

Phillips: 5'8" winger, 30 points in 20 AHL games at age 24

Doesn't feel like a very appropriate comparison. When Morgan was Phillips' age, he was in the ECHL.

It is irrelevant where Morgan was at any time in his career. He was never going to be an NHL player, just like Phillips. Didn't stop this board from expressing a similar level of angst over him being sent to the minors (epic thread), which was the reason for the comment. Bottom line, don't get worked up over the demotion of players that have no chance.

See Scorp, this is where your "professionalism" gets called into question. You continue to act more as Phillips press manager than you do a journalist objectively looking at the player and the expectations of the team. You continue to beat the drum for falsehoods surrounding Phillips' size when it is obvious for anyone to see when you watch him play and see him next to other players. There is even photographic evidence of that in this thread. If Phillips is 5'8", that makes Pelletier 5'11" or more because he towers over Phillips. You must certainly be able to see this, which means you are intentionally ignoring this reality?

We all get that you're a massive fan of Matthew Phillips, but he's never going to get a shot in the NHL. He's D+7 and every team in the league has better prospects who they would rather invest development time in. If you think that is wrong, there's probably an opportunity here for you to do some investigative work and ask around the league if anyone would take a chance on Phillips. Use that access your supporters are certain you have and put together an article on the future of the player. You could get a scoop and make a name for yourself.

[TheScorpion]

I am a hockey fan spending my time on a discussion board talking about the Flames. Get the hell outta here about professionalism. I'm sharing my opinions. Seeing as you're the one who said Phillips was bound to go to Europe this past summer and would never be recalled into the NHL again, I think you're actually the one who is completely divorced from reality.

Go get a job. I'm not sure if you realize how much professionalism it has taken for me to not tell you over the past two-ish years to ####ing grow up. You're an embarrassment to everyone on here and it's a shame you weren't banned long ago — except you were. So there.

[Reggie Dunlop]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

So, Zohorna recalled huh? That’s pretty neat.

Zohorna = BIG!

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Reggie Dunlop

Zohorna = BIG!

Zohorna = BIG
BIG =/= Phillips

[ResAlien]

Would you say Zohorna is like a taller more European Colborne?

[Freeway]

Originally Posted by ResAlien

Would you say Zohorna is like a taller more European Colborne?

Colborne was big AND local.
Zohorna is big, but not local.
Adam Klapka is also big, but also not local.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

We all get that you're a massive fan of Matthew Phillips, but he's never going to get a shot in the NHL. He's D+7 and every team in the league has better prospects who they would rather invest development time in. If you think that is wrong, there's probably an opportunity here for you to do some investigative work and ask around the league if anyone would take a chance on Phillips. Use that access your supporters are certain you have and put together an article on the future of the player. You could get a scoop and make a name for yourself.

The bolded is likely true, but it's also the issue with the Flames right now.

Why are we not investing development time at the NHL level with our own prospects?

Why was Matthew Phillips not playing for a team eliminated from playoff contention in 20-21?

Why is Jakob Pelletier, who is the leading AHL point scorer under 22 over the last two seasons one of the only first round picks from his draft year yet to play a game?

These are fair questions. The Flames are stalling their own players development, and not investing in their own prospects at the NHL level.

This goes back to 19-20 now and is four seasons of the team not wanting to take a risk and actually play young players in roles lower down the lineup.

Andrew Mangiapane developed perfectly fine on our 4th line with Ryan and Hathaway...why haven't we tried to give Phillips, or Pelletier, or even Gawdin before that the same opportunity.

Ruzicka has 20 points in 26 games this season and still has to scratch and claw for any real opportunity.

This franchise is only hurting themselves with their ancient views of developing prospects.

Somehow the Avalanche were able to find icetime for a guy like Alex Newhook these last two seasons after only playing 18 AHL games (with 20 points), but Pelletier with 90 points in 92 AHL games needs more time to develop.

And what Scorp posts here as a fan has nothing to do with his professionalism, he's allowed to be a writer and still post here as a fan on the side with his own personal opinions.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

The bolded is likely true, but it's also the issue with the Flames right now.

Why are we not investing development time at the NHL level with our own prospects?

Why was Matthew Phillips not playing for a team eliminated from playoff contention in 20-21?

Why is Jakob Pelletier, who is the leading AHL point scorer under 22 over the last two seasons one of the only first round picks from his draft year yet to play a game?

These are fair questions. The Flames are stalling their own players development, and not investing in their own prospects at the NHL level.

This goes back to 19-20 now and is four seasons of the team not wanting to take a risk and actually play young players in roles lower down the lineup.

Andrew Mangiapane developed perfectly fine on our 4th line with Ryan and Hathaway...why haven't we tried to give Phillips, or Pelletier, or even Gawdin before that the same opportunity.

Ruzicka has 20 points in 26 games this season and still has to scratch and claw for any real opportunity.

This franchise is only hurting themselves with their ancient views of developing prospects.

Somehow the Avalanche were able to find icetime for a guy like Alex Newhook these last two seasons after only playing 18 AHL games (with 20 points), but Pelletier with 90 points in 92 AHL games needs more time to develop.

And what Scorp posts here as a fan has nothing to do with his professionalism, he's allowed to be a writer and still post here as a fan on the side with his own personal opinions.

While the Flames may not be the best at playing their prospects, using Phillips as an example is likley not doing anyone any favours.

He's simply not considered a viable NHL prospect.

[TheScorpion]

if that were the case, he wouldn't have been recalled by the team four times

[Flamesfan05]

Phillips is like Austin Czarnik

Basically, he can play and likely be a star anywhere except the NHL

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

I am a hockey fan spending my time on a discussion board talking about the Flames. Get the hell outta here about professionalism. I'm sharing my opinions. Seeing as you're the one who said Phillips was bound to go to Europe this past summer and would never be recalled into the NHL again, I think you're actually the one who is completely divorced from reality.

I actually said when his contract was up, but okay, whatever lets you sleep at night. If he gets an NHL contract this summer I'll let you crow about how wrong I was. Until then, hang your hat on this callup over the Christmas break where he played a whopping 18:04 and played 26 shifts. But also recognize that he probably ate more hot dogs than he had shifts during his "recall." He had opportunity - more than I thought the team would give him - and he didn't perform. I'll let you beat me up when he get's that next one-way contract with an NHL team and scores that first NHL goal. I promise. I will seek you out to rub it in my face.

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

The bolded is likely true, but it's also the issue with the Flames right now.

Why are we not investing development time at the NHL level with our own prospects?

It's the guy behind the bench and the style he wants the team to play. You don't play a heavy cycle rich game with a bunch of midgets. You need beef to play that game and the Flames don't have that much beef in the system.

Why was Matthew Phillips not playing for a team eliminated from playoff contention in 20-21?

Because they don't believe he's an NHL player?

Why is Jakob Pelletier, who is the leading AHL point scorer under 22 over the last two seasons one of the only first round picks from his draft year yet to play a game?

Because he's too small? They don't believe he's learned to play the game well enough to allow his game to translate to the NHL game? It's pretty obvious the guy behind the bench wants a certain makeup to his lineup card. Nothing is likely to change in that regard until he is removed from the bench or until he is limited to what players he has available to him. Unless Treliving stops giving contracts to these bottom end free agents Sutter will continue to employ them simply because they are big and can lay the body on players.

These are fair questions. The Flames are stalling their own players development, and not investing in their own prospects at the NHL level.

I don't disagree, but that is the method of the team. If you don't like it, then you have acknowledge it be vocal about it. I'm not a Treliving or Sutter fan for that very reason. I would prefer to watch some of our prospects on the bottom six, but it's not in the cards. It's probably also why interest in the team is flagging. It really is a crap product to watch.

This goes back to 19-20 now and is four seasons of the team not wanting to take a risk and actually play young players in roles lower down the lineup.

Andrew Mangiapane developed perfectly fine on our 4th line with Ryan and Hathaway...why haven't we tried to give Phillips, or Pelletier, or even Gawdin before that the same opportunity.

Ruzicka has 20 points in 26 games this season and still has to scratch and claw for any real opportunity.

This franchise is only hurting themselves with their ancient views of developing prospects.

Somehow the Avalanche were able to find icetime for a guy like Alex Newhook these last two seasons after only playing 18 AHL games (with 20 points), but Pelletier with 90 points in 92 AHL games needs more time to develop.

Don't disagree. If this is really how you feel then get on the "fire Treliving and Sutter" trains. Nothing is going to change in this regard until they are either gone, or their hands are forced, which likely means they will be gone because they will step down. You're going to have to accept the reality we face here. The small players in the system are fighting an uphill battle and will have to be supermen to get the attention of the guy behind the bench. So far he hasn't seen anything that tickles his fancy.

[SuperMatt18]

I’ve accepted that that is organization right now doesn’t seem to share the same view on young players right now, but doesn’t mean I have to agree with it and can’t speak out that I don’t think it’s the right decision.

IMO it’s holding back the organization right now and I’m more than free to share that thought on here if I so please.

Also don’t think that somebody like Scorp needs to continually take shots about his professionalism, that he needs to learn to not support or share his own opinions, or that people should mention libel or slander when he’s speaking about how he feels about Sutter and Treliving and his opinion on how the team are being run.

It’s 100% fair to question how Sutter has coached this team and his lineup decisions going back to 20-21, and to be honest he might have been given a bit of a free pass last year since Tkachuk-Lindholm-Gaudreau were so good.

He had weird player usage last year too in the forward group, with Monahan, Mangiapane, Backlund, and Dube all having weird usage at times.

But we outscored the other team 102 - 42 at 5v5 with one of Gaudreau or Tkachuk on the ice, and that masked the problems the rest of the roster had scoring last year that are more similar to this year (out scored 97-94 without 13 or 19 on the ice last year, shooting 6.33% on 53.1% xGF)

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by Mitch

Been reading various flames and hockey forums for some time now and have never seen so much discussion over an AHL tweener. Mind numbing.

You’ve clearly never heard of Mark Jankowski or Dustin Boyd

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

if that were the case, he wouldn't have been recalled by the team four times

Actually, being recalled 4 times supports the assertion - if he were truly a viable prospect, he likely doesn't get sent back down 4 times.

[TrentCrimmIndependent]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

While the Flames may not be the best at playing their prospects, using Phillips as an example is likley not doing anyone any favours.

He's simply not considered a viable NHL prospect.

has this been proven though?

I don't think it has

if every player had 2 meaningful games playing a depth role to determine whether they're "viable" nhl prospects or not, most current nhlers would have been cut loose

stature didnt appear to be an obstacle in his two games either. he was quick and made plays without issue

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Actually, being recalled 4 times supports the assertion - if he were truly a viable prospect, he likely doesn't get sent back down 4 times.

I might be wrong here but from what I can tell Kylington, Mangiapane, and Dube were all recalled and sent down at least four times if not more.