Canadian Federal Politics Thread v5

[Azure]

I think Health Canada should be competent enough to know weeks or even months in advance that there is a looming supply shortage of specific drugs and has the mandate to procure whatever is needed to fill the backlog.

This is not about private versus public, funding production, etc. This is about a health emergency, and the public entities we have in place not doing their job.

If there is a worldwide shortage of these drugs, or any drugs that we consider important, then yes the government should be funding production just like they did with COVID vaccines to make sure Canadians who need the drugs are taken care of.

[Firebot]

Originally Posted by Looch City

Lol that reminds me, where is PP hiding these days lately?

https://twitter.com/PierrePoilievre

Seems he's been quite busy including being at the house of commons yesterday and attending multiple events over the weekend?

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Azure

I actually thought it was a great discussion in the light of the federal inquiry and how government officials have testified, but then you and PepsiFree came along and spouted your standard trash, and here we are.

Where are we? Certainly not still discussing a short back and forth from two days ago.

Maybe stick to making posts that show off your ignorance over how things like Health Canada and the government in general work. At least those posts generate discussion and come off a little less “desperate for attention.”

[Roughneck]

Originally Posted by Azure

I think Health Canada should be competent enough to know weeks or even months in advance that there is a looming supply shortage of specific drugs and has the mandate to procure whatever is needed to fill the backlog.

This is not about private versus public, funding production, etc. This is about a health emergency, and the public entities we have in place not doing their job.

But this is exactly what it's about. Is it the public entities job to solve supply issues for private companies? When does it become the federal entities job to do the job of the provincial ones?


If there's a current threshold built in to the mandate, when was it hit. If there isn't when should the triggers for this intervention be legislated in?

[peter12]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Where are we? Certainly not still discussing a short back and forth from two days ago.

Maybe stick to making posts that show off your ignorance over how things like Health Canada and the government in general work. At least those posts generate discussion and come off a little less “desperate for attention.”

There is a growing understanding in most business and political circles that the federal government is not capable of utilizing Canada's full state capacity anymore. Whether that is from burn-out, disillusionment, growing institutional incompetence or a combination of all of them remains to be seen.

People have to stop acting like defending this government is some sort of patriotic endeavour. Our country is growing increasingly incapable of sorting out complex issues, particularly when they overlap with provincial jurisdiction.

There is a fundamental issue of state capacity in this country - from not being able to build any kind of major industrial project on a meaningful timeline to procuring equipment for the armed forces to providing chemotherapy to cancer patients.

This is something that people of all ideological stripes should consider a priority to fix.

[peter12]

On the LPC vs CPC that everyone loves to get stuck over - yes there are larger jurisdictional issues at play, for sure, but this current government has proven very good on cutting cheques and managing the PR around that kind of thing, but not very good on leading on complex policy issues. This lack of political leadership obviously filters down to the bureaucracy.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by peter12

There is a growing understanding in most business and political circles that the federal government is not capable of utilizing Canada's full state capacity anymore. Whether that is from burn-out, disillusionment, growing institutional incompetence or a combination of all of them remains to be seen.

People have to stop acting like defending this government is some sort of patriotic endeavour. Our country is growing increasingly incapable of sorting out complex issues, particularly when they overlap with provincial jurisdiction.

There is a fundamental issue of state capacity in this country - from not being able to build any kind of major industrial project on a meaningful timeline to procuring equipment for the armed forces to providing chemotherapy to cancer patients.

This is something that people of all ideological stripes should consider a priority to fix.

This, this, a hundred times this.

An example, from my recent engagement:

We are talking about the need for port infrastructure for shipping of critical energy products globally. Preferably for our region, this would be handled through Prince Rupert. This is frankly something that our country is promising to global partners, but right now we have absolutely no capacity to provide it outside of shipping it down to captive markets in the US. Everyone at the table knows this is something we need to fix. We have NRCAN, we have industry, we have regulators present. And all NRCAN will say is that Alberta needs to join regional round tables to further discuss the issue.

WTF- we are here to have a round table! The people that are needed, outside of Danielle Smith, who frankly is pointless to this discussion, are around the table. They instead default to political posturing because the truth is THEY HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA OR NO WILL to get any of these projects done. Even if we started the process today for a new LNG terminal, or a new Methanol export terminal, it would take approximately 4-5 years to begin construction based on current ECCC and other regulatory review timelines. The VOPAK facility, finally announced today, has been undergoing that review process since 2018. This ECCC site says start 2021- that's when they finally accepted the application. It took 3 years to process it to the acceptance point.

https://iaac-aeic.gc.ca/050/evaluations/proj/81744

So, in short, we will NEVER meet our commitments to global partners about supplying secure and fairly sourced energy, because there's no way for us to get it to them. Building wind farms tied to electrolyzers in Newfoundland is ####ing assinine- not only do you lose a huge amount of efficiency by compressing it and putting it on the boat, but the boat is absolutely not carbon neutral, so you're defeating the purpose as soon as you set sail to another market. Further, and this is the big one, WIND EXISTS EVERYWHERE. So you can just build a bunch of windfarms and electrolyzers at the point of delivery if that's what you desire. The investment case is stupid and non-existant. Again, suppport for this project is entirely political and not well thought out: How can we get more jobs for our energy minister's riding??!? Boom, thanks Seamus.

[peter12]

The regional roundtables are probably a good idea to fix some of the jurisdictional stuff but as usual, no urgency from Ottawa.

[Yoho]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1597652005044068352

[KootenayFlamesFan]

As long as they’re not doing something stupid like shutting down or occupying cities or trying to shut down border crossings, I agree.

[Fuzz]

Yoho and their ilk are still confused as to what constitutes a protest and what constitutes a bunch of children having a tantrum and shutting down a city and borders.

[Wormius]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Yoho and their ilk are still confused as to what constitutes a protest and what constitutes a bunch of children having a tantrum and shutting down a city and borders.

He has this fantasy in his head that if a BLM group did that, nothing would have happened.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Yoho and their ilk are still confused as to what constitutes a protest and what constitutes a bunch of children having a tantrum and shutting down a city and borders.

Actually you appear to be the one who is confused... the whole convoy thing, including the shutting down of the city, was clearly a protest. That of course does not mean that you don't get arrested for protesting in those circumstances, but it was really obviously a politically motivated demonstration.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Actually you appear to be the one who is confused... the whole convoy thing, including the shutting down of the city, was clearly a protest. That of course does not mean that you don't get arrested for protesting in those circumstances, but it was really obviously a politically motivated demonstration.

You're right, we should not be so dismissive. It is worth discussing the meaningful differences between the two.

For one, Canada used due process and moved slowly to break up the protest and were for the most part non violent. As for those they arrested they are going through court publicly in a fair trial.

China, is not doing that.


That is a big, huge, gaping difference.

While folks are protesting for similar things, the response is not as similar as some are trying to suggest.

[CorsiHockeyLeague]

I mean no one in their right mind would suggest that the right to protest is unlimited regardless of the form the protest takes. You could protest the actions taken by this government by lighting the Parliament buildings on fire, and that would almost certainly be protected expression under the Charter, from a constitutional law perspective.. but that doesn't mean you don't still go to jail for it; of course you do.

[Wormius]

I have so missed those pedantic responses.

- said no one ever.

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by CorsiHockeyLeague

Actually you appear to be the one who is confused... the whole convoy thing, including the shutting down of the city, was clearly a protest. That of course does not mean that you don't get arrested for protesting in those circumstances, but it was really obviously a politically motivated demonstration.

Sigh, OK LEGAL protest.

See, out pedantic'ed again.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Fuzz

Sigh, OK LEGAL protest.

See, out pedantic'ed again.

What's the difference between a protest and "illegal occupation"? Were the civil rights activists in the US engaged in an "illegal occupation" when they were involved in a sit-in?

I'm not a big fan of the end goals of the convoy, but that's a protest. And yeah, civil disobedience and non-violent protest is frustrating, inconvenient and angering for other people...that's the entire point.

[peter12]

Funny how some of the most pedantic people on this board react when they get a taste of their own medicine...

[Fuzz]

Originally Posted by Slava

What's the difference between a protest and "illegal occupation"? Were the civil rights activists in the US engaged in an "illegal occupation" when they were involved in a sit-in?

I'm not a big fan of the end goals of the convoy, but that's a protest. And yeah, civil disobedience and non-violent protest is frustrating, inconvenient and angering for other people...that's the entire point.

Are you doing something illegal in the act of your protest? That's an illegal protest. There were no shortage of illegal acts taking place in Ottawa and at our borders. They were given plenty of leeway. So much so that the police backed themselves into a corner they couldn't get out of.