[PGT] Flames defeat Kings 6-5

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by AC

Honestly, I disagree to an extent about the toxicity in general. Criticism is certainly valid, because a game is never perfect from start to finish and from every player. But I think this fan base has turned pretty toxic in general; here on CP, on Twitter, Reddit, the Discord, etc. Maybe that's just social media in general now? I don't know.

A large contingent of fans seem to prefer when the Flames disappoint or a specific player struggles just so they can say "told you so" and rub it in people's faces.

The way the fanbase turned in the last couple years is largely why I gave up making videos. Just not worth the time and effort anymore. Game threads are ugly, and have been for years... but now even a lot of post game threads are just filled with bickering and are rarely enjoyable to participate in either.

I guess that's what people seem to want though.

I agree with everything you say, and I can't argue with your conclusion. But I will say that your videos are one of the things that make this site great and contribute to what makes coming here enjoyable.

I won't ask you to keep making the videos (because I would feel the same way you do and wouldn't bother either), but I really hope you do keep making them!

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

You can view some of the goals as "weak", but they were really the result of just a couple of bad decisions by skaters once the game was out of hand. Was the Kopitar goal even that bad? It was one of those perfect shots above the pad and below the blocker that went off the post and in. The other a brutal bounce off the boards, and the other a lucky deflection. These types of goals happen when you're playing good teams, with really good players.

The Flames have now put out 5 straight very consistent games compared to the earlier stages of the season and this last game was essentially still a 6-3 win without all the tomfoolery. Let's not dig much deeper than the team let up a little once the game was out of hand and also had some bad luck with bounces/deflections.

It was a well-placed shot, but it was from the top of the circle and 0 traffic. IMO NHL goalies should have that one almost every time. It got through him but it's still a bad goal. Kopitar is a great player but he typically a 25 to 30 goal guy. It's not like it was Ovechkin shooting.

IMO the team was better than Markstrom was. He's still looking like a goalie that is rattled from getting lit up last playoffs and it's a concern. Doesn't mean he won't find his game...but it's a concern.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

It was 5 on 4 IIRC (4 on 4 plus an extra man). He was deep to begin with because there was a fair bit of traffic. He was also likely worried about a cross crease, though the shot was the main threat. And it was still on the post. It was one of the harder shots I’ve seen all year.

It was a 4 on 4, and there was no traffic (everyone was tied up), and Kopitar had a clear lane. He skated in about 10 feet and was clearly going to shoot. Markstrom was set for the shot, and was at the top of his crease. However, when Kopitar shot, Markstrom collapsed backwards and was actually a couple feet inside his crease when the shot went past him. If he is at the top of the crease - and there was no reason not to be - he would have made that save. Great shot, yes. But there would have been no net if Markstrom played it properly.

I have referred to him collapsing inward a few times now - it has been an ongoing problem this year. When the shot comes, instead of pushing forward, aggressively, he is collapsing inward and as a result, is too small in his net.

I posted a pic of where he was in the crease when the shot was passing him. It shows that there were no other Kings to be concerned about. I wish I knew how to capture a video clip because a few frames earlier, when Kopitar is in the act of shooting, Markstrom is further out than he is in the pic.

[Infinit47]

I saw people celebrate every single Flames goal in the game thread, and get negative when what should have been an easy game to close out got extremely close.

After a 7 game losing streak is it surprising that people are sensitive to blown leads?

[TheIronMaiden]

This was a huge win! Go Flames Go!

[habernac]

Originally Posted by KootenayFlamesFan

Just finished wading through whatever this thread was.

PGTs after a win should not be this depressing.

I mean, 6 goals, yay? But they were so erratic. The 2nd period was glorious, then they fell asleep in the third. Markstrom is up and down like a yoyo. Sutter was so impressed with the win that he sent out someone else for the post game press conference.

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I see it as completely the opposite problem. People want a place to vent about things, that's exactly what this forum is. If you don't want to read it, don't. Don't engage with it. Provide commentary that instead guides the conversation in directions you would like.

All you do by pointing out the negativity and griping about it is elevate the level of conversation around it. That's the wallowing. If we're making it a pig metaphor, the negative posters are just farmers spreading manure, but the pigs wallowing in the manure and mucking it all around are the posters then making a fuss about the negativity.

Making posts that complain about people complaining about negativity seems like a very “have my cake and eat it, too” position. Based on your opinion that the most effective way to steer the conversation is to ignore what you don’t like and post about what you do like, it’s safe to assume you’re actually fine with people complaining about negativity.

However people want to spin it, the simple fact is that the GT and PGT have become mostly unreadable to people who want to ignore the negativity and resulting arguments about nothing.

[Toonage]

Markstrom has been bad this season and people are rightfully nervous when a shot approaches him. They anticipate a goal and when it happens they're vocally disappointed.

When he makes a great save, like the final save last night, it comes more as a surprise than whats expected.

Things get ugly when people jump on them for being upset or point out one spectacular if not fortunate save as proof that their concerns were unwarranted.

Maybe just let someone vent about a goal and move on?

[Kasi]

I think people who were annoyed at Markstrom for the most part were also happy with how Calgary dominated play and how the lines looked. Yes there are some posters who only post when the Flames lose and we know who those are but there are many in the middle who both praise and criticize the team. I think that’s fine and I don’t like the trolls for sure. I also don’t agree the the tone should just be on if the flames won or lost. Some of our better games were losses and worse games were wins.

[Enoch Root]

When did venting become a socially acceptable behavior?

And why is criticizing venters not acceptable?

[sketchyt]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

Was the Kopitar goal even that bad? It was one of those perfect shots above the pad and below the blocker that went off the post and in. The other a brutal bounce off the boards, and the other a lucky deflection. These types of goals happen when you're playing good teams, with really good players.

I remember Mitch Korn reframing Holtby's game by categorizing goals into three types:

1. Should have had
2. Could have had
3. No chance

The idea was to shake off the no chance ones, eliminate the should haves and minimize the could haves.

The Kopitar goal (fourth goal) is definitely a high danger opportunity but Markstrom doesn't give himself a fair chance. He's very deep (sinks in too) and is way too late to get his feet set. Doesn't mean he stops the shot if he corrects those two things but he also doesn't help himself there.

I'd also argue the fifth goal is in a similar vein (could've had) but he doesn't track the puck well across and is not in a tight butterfly coming across.

He's struggling right now for whatever reason but the team is also allowing a high number of high danger scoring opportunities.

[N-E-B]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

There were like 2.5 pages worth of negativity then about 9 pages of people complaining about that negativity. It's actually the second bit that creates the blackhole of suck, imo.

Just ignore people you don't agree with. I don't even mean the ignore feature. Just scroll past. Or better, start a conversation about a positive thing and move the narrative away.

The people fed up with the negativity are more annoying than the people literally calling for a buy out of our goaltender who was a Vezina finalist last year...?

That's certainly a take.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by N-E-B

The people fed up with the negativity are more annoying than the people literally calling for a buy out of our goaltender who was a Vezina finalist last year...?

That's certainly a take.

I can ignore people who want to buyout Markstrom because there's only 1 or 2 posts suggesting that stupidity.

I can't ignore the subsequent 9 pages of people complaining about negativity (thus increasing the negativity logarithmically)

I don't see how this is so difficult to understand.

[Enoch Root]

Originally Posted by Textcritic

I am pretty stoked about Ruzicka. He has looked fantastic on the top line, and if he can play that role all year, what an incredible find for the Flames!

Sent from my SM-G986W using Tapatalk

Ruzicka's play is probably the biggest positive from the last 3 games - if anything, he was even better last night than the prior 2.

I thought Huberdeau was really good as well - especially in the 1st. He had more jump, and made some beautiful passes. Only the one point, but he was also instrumental in Lindholm's PP goal, but was the 3rd assist on it.

And for me, Toffoli is everything we thought we were getting when Treliving acquired him last year. He, along with Backlund, have been the best, and most consistent forwards so far this year, IMO.

[Monahammer]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

Making posts that complain about people complaining about negativity seems like a very “have my cake and eat it, too” position. Based on your opinion that the most effective way to steer the conversation is to ignore what you don’t like and post about what you do like, it’s safe to assume you’re actually fine with people complaining about negativity.

However people want to spin it, the simple fact is that the GT and PGT have become mostly unreadable to people who want to ignore the negativity and resulting arguments about nothing.

Yes, I contemplated exactly this as I made the post, but decided to engage in it out of necessity, but it will be my last endeavor! All positive from now on.

[Kasi]

Maybe I needed to put a sarcasm font on that post about buyout if it wasn’t evident. He has been really bad though and is costing this team games. But it’s also true this team is also just not playing Sutter hockey as well as last year.

[D as in David]

Has anyone yet complained about the complainers complaining? It's hard to know which level we're on.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Enoch Root

Ruzicka's play is probably the biggest positive from the last 3 games - if anything, he was even better last night than the prior 2.

I thought Huberdeau was really good as well - especially in the 1st. He had more jump, and made some beautiful passes. Only the one point, but he was also instrumental in Lindholm's PP goal, but was the 3rd assist on it.

And for me, Toffoli is everything we thought we were getting when Treliving acquired him last year. He, along with Backlund, have been the best, and most consistent forwards so far this year, IMO.

Yeah I think for the most part the forwards looked good last night.

Huberdeau's skating seemed a bit labored though, which I guess is to be expected coming off a foot injury.

[N-E-B]

Originally Posted by Monahammer

I can ignore people who want to buyout Markstrom because there's only 1 or 2 posts suggesting that stupidity.

I can't ignore the subsequent 9 pages of people complaining about negativity (thus increasing the negativity logarithmically)

I don't see how this is so difficult to understand.

It's not difficult to understand, I just don't agree with the assertion that the pushback is more annoying than the negativity. The pushback can't happen without the negativity, thus the resulting 9 pages of annoyance is also the fault of the posters dropping over-the-top ridiculous takes. I can't fault people for being annoyed at reading drivel, but I can fault people for posting drivel.

[bdubbs]

Ruzicka is coming into his own on that line. He looks so confident with the puck right now. I hope he keeps it up because that's found money if he has chemistry with Lindy and Toff.