Don Imus dropped from MSNBC on Tv, maybe to lose job entirely

[RedHot25]

Cow, a question for you then. Not involving any other groups etc. What do you think, in a perfect world, should happen to this guy? Nothing? The book thrown at him? Or something inbetween?

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by RedHot25

Cow, a question for you then. Not involving any other groups etc. What do you think, in a perfect world, should happen to this guy? Nothing? The book thrown at him? Or something inbetween?

I have no problem with him being fired. None at all. Get rid of him.

Although I don't frequent his program, the denigration of others appears to be his common schtick and marks him as the original inventor of the trash talking radio show host.

Fire him for that. Generally, I don't like trash talking hosts.

I just find it odd that "nappy headed ho's," of all things, considering what blacks put forth as a community standard, is the trigger. That's my only point.

Now, "Jigaboo," that's a different thing. Fire him for that too. Way out of line.

Fire him for inspiring Mike Richards on 660CFR to think its fine to mock certain weight-challenged Maritime Folk singers . . . . . or inspiring a long line of questionable shock jocks on radio and tv.

Cowperson

[transplant99]

Now, "Jigaboo," that's a different thing. Fire him for that too. Way out of line.

I dont believe that was actually Imus....not sure he said that at all.

[Lurch]

Would Imus have been fired if he called Peyton Manning a dim-witted inbred southern cracker after the Super Bowl? I suspect he would have been, and this whole racism issue is entirely misplaced. To me, the fact that he insulted an entire team based only on their looks and background is the problem, and he will justifiably be fired (hopefully).

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by transplant99

I dont believe that was actually Imus....not sure he said that at all.

Ah, you're right . . . . I just flashed through the transcript you posted and got it wrong. Apologies to Imus!!!

So, we're back to "nappy headed ho's."

I'll stick with my argument on that basis.

Cowperson

[Winsor_Pilates]

so, the arguement here is that since some black rappers say stupid things about their own race, others can too? moreso, these innocent girls have to put up with it because of something Snoop dogg said?

brilliant.

So since, Eminem and many other white people have said stupid things about their own race too, I now have the right to call every white person I see a cracker, every white girls a bitch etc....
after all there's that musician Unkle Kracker... so all white people are fair game to be called Kracker now

great rules. This should be fun. Shall I start with those in this thread?

[troutman]

Originally Posted by Cowperson

how can you take black criticism of Imus seriously when guys like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson aren't raising the same hue and cry about their own community?

Cowperson

I think they did call (unsuccessfully) for a 40 day moratorium on the use of these words IIRC.

Operation Push?

http://www.fradical.com/Criticism_of_gangsta_rap.htm

Operation PUSH is calling for a 40-day "gangsta rap fast," asking music fans and radio stations to stop buying or playing rap recordings that PUSH says use profanity or promote violence. PUSH Executive Director Janette C. Wilson asked for the temporary moratorium while appearing on a local radio station. PUSH also is planning a seminar billed as a rap summit on February 4 and 5 at its headquarters in Chicago. The call has drawn criticism from fans of hip-hop music, which ranges from the alternative rap of Arrested Development to the gangsta rap of Ice Cube and Snoop Doggy Dogg.

[Cowperson]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

so, the arguement here is that since some black rappers say stupid things about their own race, others can too? moreso, these innocent girls have to put up with it because of something Snoop dogg said?

brilliant.

So since, Eminem and many other white people have said stupid things about their own race too, I now have the right to call every white person I see a cracker, every white girls a bitch etc....
after all there's that musician Unkle Kracker... so all white people are fair game to be called Kracker now

great rules. This should be fun. Shall I start with those in this thread?

You're missing the point . . . . or maybe we just disagree on the point.

I never said "nappy headed ho's" was acceptable . . . .

I said if you're going to say it's unacceptable, then there are a lot of non-white people you could also include in the conversation, people who seem to have some sort of exclusion rule applied to them because of their race.

And that would apply to Emimem too.

Cowperson

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

so, the arguement here is that since some black rappers say stupid things about their own race, others can too? moreso, these innocent girls have to put up with it because of something Snoop dogg said?

brilliant.

So since, Eminem and many other white people have said stupid things about their own race too, I now have the right to call every white person I see a cracker, every white girls a bitch etc....
after all there's that musician Unkle Kracker... so all white people are fair game to be called Kracker now

great rules. This should be fun. Shall I start with those in this thread?

Yes!!....I need a good laugh.

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

so, the arguement here is that since some black rappers say stupid things about their own race, others can too? moreso, these innocent girls have to put up with it because of something Snoop dogg said?

brilliant.

So since, Eminem and many other white people have said stupid things about their own race too, I now have the right to call every white person I see a cracker, every white girls a bitch etc....
after all there's that musician Unkle Kracker... so all white people are fair game to be called Kracker now

great rules. This should be fun. Shall I start with those in this thread?

IMO either get rid of racial slurs said by anyone of any race or let it all in. you can't pick and choose who can say what words based on skin colour.

i'd prefer to get rid of it all, but that's just me.

edit: well, just to correct myself - yes you CAN pick who can say what words based on skin colour - that's the social norm right now. you can't do it without being racist though.

[arsenal]

The issues is that people have to stop looking at who said the word and focus on the word itself.
If a phrase or word is considered "racist" then it needs to be racist regardless of who says it.

In this case, the black community needs to get up in arms when people of their own community use the racially charged words and phrases, as well as when any other community uses them. And not only when someone outside of the black community uses such words and phrases.

Until that happens, the issue of "race" will never be gone.

[habernac]

Originally Posted by arsenal

The issues is that people have to stop looking at who said the word and focus on the word itself.
If a phrase or word is considered "racist" then it needs to be racist regardless of who says it.

In this case, the black community needs to get up in arms when people of their own community use the racially charged words and phrases, as well as when any other community uses them. And not only when someone outside of the black community uses such words and phrases.

Until that happens, the issue of "race" will never be gone.

excellent post.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Phaneuf3

IMO either get rid of racial slurs said by anyone of any race or let it all in. you can't pick and choose who can say what words based on skin colour.

i'd prefer to get rid of it all, but that's just me.

edit: well, just to correct myself - yes you CAN pick who can say what words based on skin colour - that's the social norm right now. you can't do it without being racist though.

I'd agree with get rid of it all together. Allow it all in is the point many here seem to be making and I can't agree with that.
2 wrongs don't make a right.

and I would argue using racist words against your own race, while extremly stupid is far different then using racist words against another race.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Cowperson

You're missing the point . . . . or maybe we just disagree on the point.

I never said "nappy headed ho's" was acceptable . . . .

I said if you're going to say it's unacceptable, then there are a lot of non-white people you could also include in the conversation, people who seem to have some sort of exclusion rule applied to them because of their race.

And that would apply to Emimem too.

Cowperson

I guess I did miss the point. It seemed a lot like you were making excuses for his words based on the fact "blacks" do it too.

It also seems a lot like you're generalizing "blacks" into this one community who all are responsible for the use of these words in "their" community. I'm sure there are plenty of black people who don't use these words and they shouldn't be held responsible for it based on some song lyrics they never wrote.

[troutman]

Recent guest on the Daily Show:

http://www.amazon.ca/N-Word-Who-Can-...6404323&sr=8-1

The N-Word : Who Can Say It, Who Shouldn't and Why (Hardcover)
by Jabari Asim (Author)

From Publishers Weekly
Midway through Washington Post columnist Asim's history of the "N" word in America, readers may conclude it should not be uttered by anyone, anymore, for any reason. Essentially, this 400-year chronology is an exhaustive history of white supremacist ideology, showing that the word is as American as "liberty, freedom, justice and equality." He sweeps over this sensitive and contradictory terrain—including black Americans' use of the word—with practicality, while dispensing gentle provocations. Asim notes, for example, that popular civil rights presidents like Thomas Jefferson, Abraham Lincoln and Lyndon B. Johnson used the N word all the time. Bicycling in Africa in 2004, a young black American encounters a black-owned hip-hop clothing store called "s." Children growing up during the latter half of the 19th century sang "The Ten Little s" nursery rhyme. Asim is at his best when offering his opinion—"in the 21st century, to subsist on our former masters' cast-off language... strikes me as... an immense, inscrutable, and bizarre failure of the imagination." Still, he concludes, the word is indispensable in certain endeavors. His analysis of 19th- and 20th-century pop culture phenomena may too fine-toothed for general readers, but clear, engaging writing increases the pleasure. (Mar.)
Copyright © Reed Business Information, a division of Reed Elsevier Inc. All rights reserved.

From Booklist
Asim addresses the root of this controversial word in American rhetoric and contemporary experience. Just as our founding fathers tried to dodge the issue of race and slavery by only hinting around it, the current debate often suggests that by not using the "N word," the race issues will remain dormant. Asim looks back at Thomas Jefferson's essays on slavery, his justification of the misuse of slaves on pseudoscientific bases, and continued denigration of blacks in word and deed. He traces the use of the word through popular entertainment from minstrel shows to films (notably Birth of a Nation) to current comedy routines and rap music. Despite attempts by hip-hop culture to reverse the impact of the word, and remove the sting of racial hurt, the result has been to maintain socioeconomic distance among the races, Asim maintains. Still, he argues that the word has had a long history of powerful impact in more responsible hands as a reminder of the troubled legacy of race relations in the U.S. Vernon Ford
Copyright © American Library Association. All rights reserved

[RougeUnderoos]

Context is everything. If a white buddy of mine says "damn, you really are a honky. That was some bad dancing", that's one thing.

If a non-white guy with a stick in his hand says "hey honky, you better get out of my neighbourhood" the word takes on a slightly more serious meaning.

And if a young black guy says "nappy headed hos" in a generic way (he isn't talking about anyone in particular) in a rap song, that's maybe not a good thing, but it's certainly different than a 70 year old white guy singling out 10 specific young women and calling them nappy headed hos on a national radio broadcast.

I've never understood this "they can say it, why can't I" argument. It's really saying "they say the N word, so I should be able to express my racism without everyone getting mad".

[transplant99]

Good post Rouge and I agree for the most part.

What I cant really get my head around though is what cow has been saying as well...they need to start with themselves and cleaning up their own "violators" if they expect anyone else too. Particularly 70 year old guys who grew up in an era when the sterotyping name-calling was somewhat acceptable.

[Phaneuf3]

Originally Posted by RougeUnderoos

Context is everything. If a white buddy of mine says "damn, you really are a honky. That was some bad dancing", that's one thing.

supoose i'm a black guy. if i say to a black guy "damn, you really are a [n word]. that was some really awesome dancing"
everything's a-ok.

supoose i'm a black guy. if i say to a white guy "damn, you really are a cracker. that was some really bad dancing"
still, a-ok

supoose i'm a white guy. if i say to a black guy "damn, you really are a [n word]. that was some really awesome dancing"
would that be ok?

all i did was take your example, switch some of the races and insert the appropriate racial slur to reflect the changes and suddenly it wouldn't be ok.



edited to more closely match your example.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by fotze

I agree, I've always said call me a cracker, it has absolutely no negative connotation to me. Honky too.

I think calling me a racist though would have the same effect as calling a black fellow the N word.

I've been called racist on this very board before, which is just hilarious if you know me or anything about my life in North carolina.

Just as a point...my wife's matron of honor was a black woman whom I consider one of my best friends met down here, along with the rest of her family we get together several times a year in various circumstances.

3 summers ago at the conclusion of the annual Goomaby Festival (http://www.ymicc.org/goombay.html), we were invited to a house party of her current boyfriend. There were well over 200 people there...I was the only white man and my wife the only white female.

it was an experience to say the least.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Phaneuf3

supoose i'm a black guy. if i say to a white guy "damn, you really are a cracker. that was some really bad dancing"
still, a-ok

Since when is that ok?

your whole arguement is based on something that isn't true