Training Camp Day 11 Notes - Flames assign 9 players to AHL. 6 players on waivers.

[TheScorpion]

Originally Posted by flamesfan6

what's the benefit of having the young players on line 4 playing a checking role for 5 minutes a game?

The idea is that you have a fourth line that is good enough not to just exist as a checking, mucking, no-mistake unit for five minutes a game.

Being able to roll four dangerous two-way units should be the goal.

[flamesfan6]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

The idea is that you have a fourth line that is good enough not to just exist as a checking, mucking, no-mistake unit for five minutes a game.

Being able to roll four dangerous two-way units should be the goal.

So you'd rather have our young prospects play 5 minutes a game in this role than be top line or two in the AHL for an entire season so they can be ready for more top 6 in following years?

[TheScorpion]

... I just said it shouldn't be on the ice for five minutes a game. Ideally, it's good enough that it can maybe even be deployed as a secondary "third line," as the Flames' fourth line was down the stretch in 2019. Some of the players on it could, theoretically, even receive PP/PK deployment.

The Flames' existing fourth line is a blank slate that tends to get caved in at both ends of the ice. Having Rooney on the third line is not great, either.

[DomeFoam]

Originally Posted by flamesfan6

what's the benefit of having the young players on line 4 playing a checking role for 5 minutes a game?

5 minutes? Lol, our fourth line averages 12-13 a game. Surely that’s enough to give guys looks and earn their way up the lineup. Sprinkle some line 3 and PP2 time in here and there. Give youth opportunities.


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[CF84]

Sutter is my favorite coach of all time, but I think he made a pretty stupid choice with Phillips. Especially with our RW depth. What is the harm in giving him a solid look? He is the answer to making the 2nd PP more dangerous. Yes he's small, but he has speed, vision, and offensive instincts that most players lack.

The posters that think he's finished before he was even given a shot are the same posters who would have been negative about Johnny making it in the NHL. And no, I'm not saying their talent is comparable, but Phillips has some grit that Johnny lacks to make up for it. I hope he is dominant enough in the AHL that he forces a call-up. Either that, or a team claims him and he becomes the next player that got away. I'm not saying I believe he will definitely succeed in the NHL, but I would not be surprised if he did.

Give the kid a chance.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by TheScorpion

You've been saying his NHL dream was dead since he was 21 and he's signed two NHL deals since.

Glenn Gawdin and Austin Czarnik were pursued by 20 teams as UFAs. Would be 0% surprised to see the same with Phillips a year from now.

Scorp, I know it's a rough day for you. I feel for you today. It's always terrible to see a player you've invested so much time and energy in to reach the end of the road, but this was a known a long time ago. I would hope that you are going to understand that the deals Phillps signed were development contracts, that anything associated to the NHL was a carrot and not a guarantee. The only guarantee Phillips had was his AHL salary and hopes for a cup of coffee. The guy never got a sniff of the NHL outside of that last game of the year "attaboy" for his play in the AHL. He was never going to be an NHL player and it was obvious early on. He was the longest-of-longshots and he never really showed he was capable, which is why he was always an early cut.

You can trot out all the players you like, but none of them are 140 pounds and can't get on the rides at Disneyland. The other guys you trotted out at least had NHL size or close to it. Phillips might coerce a try-out from a desperate bottom feeder if he has another big year, but as you pointed out, he'll be 25, have one NHL game under his belt, and be the smallest player in the league. Roll those descriptors around in your head, remove the player's name, and tell me you would be happy if the Flames extended a contract to a player like that? And be honest.

[TheScorpion]

Jesus, you are a sanctimonious ass.

[HighLifeMan]

We have a glaring hole in the top nine yet non of Pelletier, Milano, Ruzicka, Phillips got to play next to or alongside Kadri/Mangiapane or Backlund/Coleman. You are bouncing these guys all over the lineup with players they won’t be playing with. Sure, they haven’t blown the door off, but has anyone this pre-season? Put them in positions to succeed. I don’t like how Sutter handled this.

[Paulie Walnuts]

This years camp felt disjointed from the time Treliving had his presser announcing Mangiapane would be held out, Kylington was on a leave, and Tanev and Kadri would be eased into the preseason. All of that is understandable but it really hurt creating chemistry, and giving guys a chance in roles in games.

When Kadri suits up he's flanked by Backlund and Coleman. Why not try out some wingers he might play with like a Dube, Phillips, and Milano. We also get Ekain up in the lineup every game, and now we know as he was gifted a spot on the roster after doing nothing.

Not a great camp by Sutter standards, some in his control and some not.

It feels like none of the AHL guys, and PTO really got a real chance outside of Eakins.

[flamesfan6]

I laugh every time people complain about Phillips being on waivers or that we should guarantee him a spot in the top 6 .. he was a 6th round pick that is massively undersized, who really only last year had a good strong year in the AHL.

For the most part he's still 25+ pounds lighter than any other small player in the league, no level of "grit" can overcome that.

If I didn't have context, according to this forum he's a 1st overall pick we are wasting...

[Harry Lime]

Phillips isn't 140 pounds. Maybe right out of juniors he was. Not the smallest player in the league. Showed he was good enough in the ahl to warrant a callup and performed well pre season.

I also hope he gets claimed. Easy to slot in 3rd line in Chicago or Arizona.

[Paulie Walnuts]

No one is saying to gift a spot to Phillips, but as you can see they clearly do play favorites with Eakin getting a legit shot, and bumping up Rooney to make room for him.

They talked about a hole on the roster, and yet they never even tried anyone out instead rolling lineups of AHL guys. If you want to see what they can do, you might want to play them with the guys they are to play with and not random combinations of AHL guys, and Eakins.

[calculoso]

Originally Posted by flamesfan6

If I didn't have context, according to this forum he's a 1st overall pick we are wasting...

flamesfan05 get a new number?

[Flaming Horse]

Originally Posted by Paulie Walnuts

This years camp felt disjointed from the time Treliving had his presser announcing Mangiapane would be held out, Kylington was on a leave, and Tanev and Kadri would be eased into the preseason. All of that is understandable but it really hurt creating chemistry, and giving guys a chance in roles in games.

When Kadri suits up he's flanked by Backlund and Coleman. Why not try out some wingers he might play with like a Dube, Phillips, and Milano. We also get Ekain up in the lineup every game, and now we know as he was gifted a spot on the roster after doing nothing.

Not a great camp by Sutter standards, some in his control and some not.

It feels like none of the AHL guys, and PTO really got a real chance outside of Eakins.

Exactly. Good points. Put a guy like Milano with Kadri and Mang for a game at least and see what he can do. I agree and have thought the same thing myself that Sutter could have given some of these guys a better chance.They have not done anything to stand out but put them in a better position to have some success.

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Naitix

Sure but Ruzicka is not a tweezer imo, he has been dominant in AHL and barely given a shot in the NHL, the only reason he might not make the team is because we are one of the deepest teams at Center. There is no reason for a team that is looking to add a 3rd line Center to not give him a shot. He has all the right tools and skill, just needs to build consistency. I would bet a lot of money that he gets claimed, just needs to watch his play from last year to understand that he might be able to make it as a skilled top 9 Center.

His lack of consistency makes him not worthy of the NHL. NHLers bring a consistent effort 9 out of 10 nights, but with Ruzicka it's like 60/40 at best, even in the AHL. Other teams will view him the same way. He'll pass.

[boogerz]

The Rooney signing is still incredibly puzzling. $1.3M on a multi-year deal for a guy that can be so easily displaced by someone on a PTO...

[TheScorpion]

I don't understand the appeal of Rooney at all, and having him on the third line — especially after an incredibly underwhelming camp — is pretty disappointing. Hoping he can prove his worth in the regular season.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Size. Defensive awareness. Physical presence. That's it. Rooney is here because he's a Sutter player. He may not score much, but he won't get scored on very often. At least that's the hope.

[TheScorpion]

The thing is, his defensive results last year were terrible and he only threw 84 hits. So I'm not sure I believe it ... but we'll see.

[scobel]

I don’t really know if any of the players that were in the organization last year stood out to warrant a further look. I think Zary was the best and for his development it makes sense to go down for another year. The Flames already know what they have in those players and if there was huge strides like Kylington, last year then they would have gotten more games.

As for the tryout players I think Calgary isn’t as familiar with them from a personal stand point and a little bit on ice so makes sense to keep them around for a few more days. It is also important that some of these players get a good start in the AHL for further development, as for the tryout players if they don’t make it to the big club Calgary really isn’t invested in their development.