Better Call Saul - New TV Series 2014

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by nfotiu

Where does it rank in terms of best ever? Is it better than Breaking Bad? I kind of think of them as a single entity now.

I'd put it solidly as my favorite show ever. GOT was better for a while, but got so bad. The Wire was close at times, but drifted at times. Sopranos was ground breaking and all, but this was far better overall IMO. What else is up there? Seinfeld?

There's absolutely no way this show is better than breaking bad. Maybe as good? Maybe?

For me it's (and im trying to aco#### for recency bias):

1. Breaking Bad
2. Sopranos
3. Band of Brothers
4. Better Call Saul
5. True Detective season 1

[direwolf]

Originally Posted by White Out 403

There's absolutely no way this show is better than breaking bad. Maybe as good? Maybe?

For me it's (and im trying to aco#### for recency bias):

1. Breaking Bad
2. Sopranos
3. Band of Brothers
4. Better Call Saul
5. ??

True Detective season 1 is better than all of those IMO. That show blew my socks off.

[mikephoen]

Originally Posted by nfotiu

Where does it rank in terms of best ever? Is it better than Breaking Bad? I kind of think of them as a single entity now.

I'd put it solidly as my favorite show ever. GOT was better for a while, but got so bad. The Wire was close at times, but drifted at times. Sopranos was ground breaking and all, but this was far better overall IMO. What else is up there? Seinfeld?

My personal top 5 includes The Wire, Better Call Saul, Breaking Bad, Band of Brothers and Buffy/Angel. Probably in that order.

Hard to rank comedies in with dramas, but Seinfeld would easily make my top 10. Also Dexter makes the top 10 for sure, as does Twin Peaks.

Maybe Friday Night Lights. Maybe Walking Dead, but after the first few seasons it really got repetitive.

The first seasons of West World and True Detective were amazing, but the following season(s) were trash, so it's hard to include them. Game of Thrones and Lost had such horrible last seasons that I'll never rewatch those series and they kind of make me angry now.

I'm interested to see other people's lists.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by direwolf

True Detective season 1 is better than all of those IMO. That show blew my socks off.

That's what I was missing. I'll slot that in at #5. But ya no offense, BoB is hands down #1. It's a masterpiece in story telling and the art.

[mile]

BCS had less filler and better visuals/cinematography than BB IMO. The highs on BB were better than those of BCS though, which feels like a slow burn at times. It all comes down to personal preference. For me, I think I'm much more likely to rewatch BCS than BB

My current top 5

1. The Wire
2. Better Call Saul
3. Breaking Bad
4. The Sopranos
5. Peaky Blinders

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by nfotiu

Where does it rank in terms of best ever? Is it better than Breaking Bad? I kind of think of them as a single entity now.

I'd put it solidly as my favorite show ever. GOT was better for a while, but got so bad. The Wire was close at times, but drifted at times. Sopranos was ground breaking and all, but this was far better overall IMO. What else is up there? Seinfeld?

It is 100 times better than Breaking Bad! I just rewatched BB a few months back.

Getting rid of Skylar, Walt Jr, Marie and putting in Howard, Nacho, Chuck, Kim, Lalo and effing Carol Burnett puts it over the top by far!

1. Better Call Saul

2. Breaking Bad
3. Band of Brothers
4. Westworld Season 1
5. True Detective Season 1
6. The Apprentice Season 1.... lol /Game of Thrones

[mikephoen]

I'm not sure where to fit South Park and The Simpsons in. I don't regularly watch either any more, but it's impossible to not recognize their cultural impact. Especially The Simpsons.

[Matata]

Jimmy will be out in 6 months due to overcrowding, good behaviour and slick-talking. They'll get together because they're finally over their baggage and can be content.

It's really bittersweet to see this series end. At no point did I have any idea where the story was going, even though we all knew where it ends. Making the focus of the series about the journey made it impossible to predict the direction the story would go, which really created a unique viewing experience and probably couldn't have been done without an audience that's already deeply invested in the characters. Deep down I wanted a simple happy ending, but that wouldn't have felt authentic and I've got a lot of respect for the show-runners to go out this way.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

I don’t know, this was a bit of a “tidying things up” rather than “hard won truth”. A guy like Jimmy admittedly having only one regret over not making more money from a scam suddenly turning on a dime, repenting and choosing life sentence over seven years in a “luxury” prison - how believable is this ending?..

Overall, I think think was unquestionably the best television show of the past decade. I am really sorry it’s over.

Throwing himself on the sword, felt to me almost like something Saul wanted to do, but would never have actually done. Almost like a fantasy of his.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by Matata

Jimmy will be out in 6 months due to overcrowding, good behaviour and slick-talking. They'll get together because they're finally over their baggage and can be content.

It's really bittersweet to see this series end. At no point did I have any idea where the story was going, even though we all knew where it ends. Making the focus of the series about the journey made it impossible to predict the direction the story would go, which really created a unique viewing experience and probably couldn't have been done without an audience that's already deeply invested in the characters. Deep down I wanted a simple happy ending, but that wouldn't have felt authentic and I've got a lot of respect for the show-runners to go out this way.

IRL guys like Jimmy get out all the time for informing on the actual gangsters. All it would take is picking up one of the actual cartel members Jimmy worked with and the FBI would be throwing deals at Jimmy.

[dobbles]

One downside of the wire is it finished pretty weak in its last season. I didn't feel like that storyline has near as much greatness to it as the others. It certainly was nowhere near what would later become the GoT debacle, but I think if the wire were on TV right now, it would have gotten a pretty big pushback for ending like that.

As I type this, what came to mind was the fact that so many shows start strong and can't sustain. And part of what I think makes Breaking Bad so great is that it was really peaking as it ended. Both in terms of popularity and quality. So it is fondly remembered just like a musician that dies young. In terms of BCS, while it was similar in length to BB, it was held to that same high standard the entire time. It stood up to high expectations and in most cases surpassed them. To me that really says something.

[Matata]

While I can concede that The Wire had a relatively weak 5th season, I thought that it had the best ending for TV show: It showed how all the characters had grown into roles that had been filled by other characters at the beginning of series, illustrating the hopeless cycle of poverty and violence they were all trapped in, reinforcing all the main themes in the show. It was a huge bummer, but a perfect ending.

[CaptainYooh]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1559418255646679046

[manwiches]

Hot take. The Wire sucked. I really didn't enjoy it. Was one of the most overhyped and overated shows I've ever watched.

[White Out 403]

Originally Posted by manwiches

Hot take. The Wire sucked. I really didn't enjoy it. Was one of the most overhyped and overated shows I've ever watched.

yup

i think its something people say to sound like they're hip tbh

i tried watching it and would sooner be waterboarded

[MegaErtz]

Season 5 was definitely the worst season. They really jumped the shark with the fake serial killer storyline. For me, still the best television show by a mile.

1) The Wire
2) The Sopranos
3) The Americans
4) The Shield
5) The Leftovers

[Hemi-Cuda]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

I don’t know, this was a bit of a “tidying things up” rather than “hard won truth”. A guy like Jimmy admittedly having only one regret over not making more money from a scam suddenly turning on a dime, repenting and choosing life sentence over seven years in a “luxury” prison - how believable is this ending?..

Overall, I think think was unquestionably the best television show of the past decade. I am really sorry it’s over.

The guy telling that story to Walter was Saul, not Jimmy. When Kim left that killed Jimmy completely and only Saul was left, and had Kim not confessed it would have stayed that way and Saul would have been out of prison in a few years. But when he learned of Kim's penance, that was enough to break through Saul and find Jimmy again. She was the one truly good thing he ever had, there's no way he was going to let her suffer atonement alone

One of the primary themes of BCS was showing how Saul was the true mastermind behind Walter White, but the last half of the final season showed that Kim was ultimately the creator and destructor of Saul Goodman. And really this is as good of an ending that Jimmy McGill could have gotten. He finally showed Kim that he still has a soul, he's finally dropped the Saul and Gene masks, and life in prison for him will likely be as good as it could be with the amount of respect he has among the criminal population

[troutman]

How does Kim avoid jail? Because Saul transparently lied about Howard committing suicide? And what Bar Association would ever re-admit her?

[mile]

Originally Posted by troutman

How does Kim avoid jail? Because Saul transparently lied about Howard committing suicide? And what Bar Association would ever re-admit her?

There's zero evidence against her. Mike got rid of all of it. She said it herself to Howard's wife, she gave an affadavit to the DA but it's unlikely she will be prosecuted. She still has to deal with a civil suit though.

Nothing suggested that she will be re-admitted to the bar, the closest she'll get to that is volunteer work most likely.

[timun]

Originally Posted by timun

I predict Kim doesn't get prosecuted, which puts her into an interminable spiral. She ends up an alcoholic just like her mother.

I predict Jimmy is caught by police and ends up in prison, serving a long sentence.


Both outcomes are precisely what the characters don't want to happen to themselves. Unhappy endings all around.

Called it!

Although I obviously got one big detail wrong, in that this isn't an unhappy ending. In fact it's about as happy an ending as possible under the circumstances. Kim isn't going into a death spiral: her atonement had saved her. I like to imagine she'll stick around and visit Jimmy in future. Jimmy, while obviously not happy at his situation, found atonement by finally confessing and doing it in front of Kim. I think he came to realize that living out his days as Gene was as bad a figurative prison as actual prison anyway.

What a great show. I still haven't seen all of Breaking Bad—a whole bunch got spoiled watching this last episode of BCS!—but I've enjoyed BCS a lot more and think it's the superior show by far. Better characters with far more complex motivations, and better acting all around.