Alberta Politics & Government Thread 3.0

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Mull

I think that math checks out GGG but my guess is the 5% supply increase would turn into a rounding error from the retirement factor.



And even if it doesn't, a second point was that a BA isn't required here, so I don't know where you reduced the years- a BA is only requried to pump up your resume due to high demand of spots.
You could propose a system where people get right into medical school from high school, therefore eliminating the benefits of a BA on the resume when applying but:

a) this would cancel out allowance from those who grew older and mature and decided to apply (like the old age of 25......) - you would need an allowance for these people (which may be done already not sure) instead of allowing them to use their experience as a factor

b) you would have less mature people jumping in with less life experience-is it really great we are "fixing" the system by reducing the value of more schooling


I don't know how to quantify these concerns.

I agree decreasing time doesn’t do much.

Hence why increasing spots in education is the only solution.

I don’t see why mandating certain work areas post education couldn’t be done. Perhaps create a school for rural medicine which has no government subsidy so students have to pay full cost but then have grants which forgive if you do 10 years in a rural area. This way you get around forcing people to work, it’s their choice where they work but it becomes a very expensive place to work if you don’t.

The point of this type of program wouldn’t be to get doctors who don’t want to work in rural areas to work in rural areas. It’s to get people who want to work in rural areas medical degrees. We know there is a far greater supply of applicants than spots so creating new spots and giving these spots to people who want to live in small towns seems like a good solution.

The only question would be how to legally make it happen.

The whole system should be designed to produce more doctors than Canada requires to create a surplus.

[Mull]

Originally Posted by GGG

I agree decreasing time doesn’t do much.

Hence why increasing spots in education is the only solution.

I don’t see why mandating certain work areas post education couldn’t be done. Perhaps create a school for rural medicine which has no government subsidy so students have to pay full cost but then have grants which forgive if you do 10 years in a rural area. This way you get around forcing people to work, it’s their choice where they work but it becomes a very expensive place to work if you don’t.

The point of this type of program wouldn’t be to get doctors who don’t want to work in rural areas to work in rural areas. It’s to get people who want to work in rural areas medical degrees. We know there is a far greater supply of applicants than spots so creating new spots and giving these spots to people who want to live in small towns seems like a good solution.

The only question would be how to legally make it happen.

The whole system should be designed to produce more doctors than Canada requires to create a surplus.

I don't know the answers to your points, they are good points. I do think it would be quicker and easier to see results however to simply increase perks and pay in rural areas vs a system overall which may have unintended consequences.

As for increasing spots, I am all for it... but remember, increasing spots in AB doesn't mean more doctors in AB - the resident placement program is nation wide and its quite common for students to be flying around the country interviewing. That said, direct forced placement would avoid this issue, if possible.

But like, you get into medical school, you learn what you like. You learn you have a passion for psych but because you qualified under the rural family medicine program, you can't take psych? It seems.... not right.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Dr. Heehaw got almost $600k in 2021. I hope she fixed Kenney's syphillis problem..

Pays to tow the UCP line. Don't and you get fired like Verna Yiu.

https://calgaryherald.com/news/local...onuses-in-2021

How much did the CEO of Suncor make? Which of them had the most impact on the province?

[GGG]

Originally Posted by Mull

I don't know the answers to your points, they are good points. I do think it would be quicker and easier to see results however to simply increase perks and pay in rural areas vs a system overall which may have unintended consequences.

The cost problem of health care isn’t solved buy increasing rural pay and the general shortage of workers is not solved by increasing rural pay.

I do like the idea in the short term of things like week in week out to service communities.

A massive investment in training or international recruitment are going to be required to meet demographic challenges.

I missed the last part of your post by relying early but in terms of people changing their minds I look at it as you made a decision to pursue your dream of medicine. You didn’t qualify for the more flexible options or you wanted to have the financial benefits in either scenario you made a decision because you didn’t have another option to pursue your medicine dream. So the theoretical person isn’t making a choice between their preferred major it’s a medicine degree or not having a medicine degree.

We already do this all the time where we deny people placement into various specialties and programs and even access to university because they didn’t qualify. We think it’s fair because we believe that grades are self determined and people have control so we wash our hands of it. I see this as no different if you wanted to have flexibility you should have qualified for the flexible program it’s cold but no different than discipline selection based on academics.

[Mull]

Originally Posted by edslunch

How much did the CEO of Suncor make? Which of them had the most impact on the province?

Positive or negative impact?
Did Hinshaw have a positive impact compared to an average peer in her role? I remember when she issued a memo to family docs in Aug 2021 saying they were to do the covid testing in clinic and they weren't going to require isolating of positive cases ... when delta was rampant. Not the same COVID as it is today. Glad to know family doctors safety matter so little to her!


Now, this eventually was withdrawn but still....

[Mull]

Originally Posted by GGG

The cost problem of health care isn’t solved buy increasing rural pay and the general shortage of workers is not solved by increasing rural pay.

I do like the idea in the short term of things like week in week out to service communities.

A massive investment in training or international recruitment are going to be required to meet demographic challenges.

I wonder if big data/AI will help here , at least on the family doctor side to help identify and predict issues, lessening the family doctor load. The problem is sensitivity of data and privacy.

[Johnny Makarov]

Originally Posted by edslunch

How much did the CEO of Suncor make? Which of them had the most impact on the province?

Did the CEO of Suncor impact the millions of lives in Alberta?

She sure had the most impact but it was mostly negative in 2021.

[PeteMoss]

Originally Posted by Johnny Makarov

Did the CEO of Suncor impact the millions of lives in Alberta?

She sure had the most impact but it was mostly negative in 2021.

If you aren't going to give a big bonus to the person leading public health in the province during a pandemic then I don't know who you would ever give a bonus to.

[Mull]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

If you aren't going to give a big bonus to the person leading public health in the province during a pandemic then I don't know who you would ever give a bonus to.

So I don't think she did good work but to be fair this wasn't a "bonus" as most Albertians think of when they hear or read that word, it was a contractually agreed to incurred OT which she is allowed to clock up during emergencies as per the long standing policy. She worked the hours to get paid more, as any nurse or other staff. It's just not typical of management incurring OT.

They didn't release her hours but I have no doubt she worked a huge amount of hours given what we saw of her. I have issue with the policy allowing so much given the lack of OT paid out to other Chief Medical officers from other provinces, and higher pay didn't lead to a higher quality performance - from the little we can see as a lot of what she does would be behind the scenes work that gets filtered through the elected officials.

But, its not her fault she has a good contract.

[Ozy_Flame]

I think Hinshaw is a coward and should have whistleblown everything going on with that band of circus clowns running the show, but the OT thing doesn't bother me. She was doing OT for 18-24 months constantly as part of her job description, which no doubt had to occur given the pace of change and public health policy decision-making.

I also hate the way this is being framed, as a "bonus" to make it sound like she deserved all the accolades for her great work. It's her contract that stipulated it. Can't fault her for that.

In addition, $500k isn't really all that different from many other docs. In fact there are docs out there that make way way more than that (based on their disciplines) and we collectively don't bat an eye.

[Amethyst]

What I find interesting, is that for a provincial government that is always trying to cut back others' salaries, because "people doing that job in New Brunswick make less," they don't seem to mind paying the CMOH close to double what other provinces are paying. She certainly didn't stand out to me as so much better than any other CMOH.

[Amethyst]

Originally Posted by GGG

I missed the last part of your post by relying early but in terms of people changing their minds I look at it as you made a decision to pursue your dream of medicine. You didn’t qualify for the more flexible options or you wanted to have the financial benefits in either scenario you made a decision because you didn’t have another option to pursue your medicine dream. So the theoretical person isn’t making a choice between their preferred major it’s a medicine degree or not having a medicine degree.

We already do this all the time where we deny people placement into various specialties and programs and even access to university because they didn’t qualify. We think it’s fair because we believe that grades are self determined and people have control so we wash our hands of it. I see this as no different if you wanted to have flexibility you should have qualified for the flexible program it’s cold but no different than discipline selection based on academics.

If you don't want the benefit of having your spot paid for, don't sign up for the program. Or go back and do a new specialty after you've done your rural practice agreement. It's not like people are being forced to do that, whether they want to or not. They get the benefit of getting a spot that wasn't previously available, or getting their costs covered, or whatever, in exchange for working in this location for X number of years.

[powderjunkie]

Hinshaw deserves another bonus for having to deal with the Unsane Clown Posse.

[Zarley]

I can't believe people are criticizing Dr. Hinshaw. If anyone deserves a bonus it's her - I'm sure she's had a stressful couple years with near daily press conferences, constant scrutiny, and having to make decisions that are bound to be criticized extremists on both sides regardless of outcome.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by Zarley

I can't believe people are criticizing Dr. Hinshaw. If anyone deserves a bonus it's her - I'm sure she's had a stressful couple years with near daily press conferences, constant scrutiny, and having to make decisions that are bound to be criticized extremists on both sides regardless of outcome.

It's been true since the pandemic started, everyone wants someone else to blame for a freak of nature event.

[Sliver]

Originally Posted by Zarley

I can't believe people are criticizing Dr. Hinshaw. If anyone deserves a bonus it's her - I'm sure she's had a stressful couple years with near daily press conferences, constant scrutiny, and having to make decisions that are bound to be criticized extremists on both sides regardless of outcome.

I don't believe people should have to work for free since that's slavery. If her contract was for 45 hours per week and she was working 70 hours per week, she should get paid. Anybody on a salary should be paid for work over and above a standard work week. She's earned it imo.

As for the criticism. I think she is a dope of the highest order based solely on allowing exemptions to the mandates limiting the size of groups for religious services. That still bothers me that we had spread back when covid was way more dangerous in fataing churches of all places...the least important group gatherings ever. That was so stupid and she should have been fired for even contemplating something so asinine; however, looks like her bosses supported the same foolishness so she kept her job, worked crazy hours, and should be paid for those hours.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Ozy_Flame

I think Hinshaw is a coward and should have whistleblown everything going on with that band of circus clowns running the show,.

But then where does that leave the public.

The UCP would have ####canned her and potentially replaced her with a UCP shill.

[undercoverbrother]

Originally Posted by Sliver

As for the criticism. I think she is a dope of the highest order based solely on allowing exemptions to the mandates limiting the size of groups for religious services. That still bothers me that we had spread back when covid was way more dangerous in fataing churches of all places...the least important group gatherings ever. That was so stupid and she should have been fired for even contemplating something so asinine; however, looks like her bosses supported the same foolishness so she kept her job, worked crazy hours, and should be paid for those hours.

I want to think that was pushed on her.

My very basic understanding is the Gov't made the decisions, she provided recommendations. It is possible she said that the religious exemption was dumb, but they ignored her. In fact, as I type it I fully believe she recommended against it and the UCP ignored her.

[Slava]

Originally Posted by Sliver

I don't believe people should have to work for free since that's slavery. If her contract was for 45 hours per week and she was working 70 hours per week, she should get paid. Anybody on a salary should be paid for work over and above a standard work week. She's earned it imo.

As for the criticism. I think she is a dope of the highest order based solely on allowing exemptions to the mandates limiting the size of groups for religious services. That still bothers me that we had spread back when covid was way more dangerous in fataing churches of all places...the least important group gatherings ever. That was so stupid and she should have been fired for even contemplating something so asinine; however, looks like her bosses supported the same foolishness so she kept her job, worked crazy hours, and should be paid for those hours.

I think it's entirely fair to criticize those things and still have no issues with the wage though. She could go be a doctor in private practice with much less stress and things to deal with (and a correspondingly lower wage), or take on all the other responsibilities as CMOH and get paid this amount. It makes sense to me.

And as far as the restrictions and politics, that's basically on the UCP. She gave them the information and they made those decisions.

[CliffFletcher]

Exemptions for religious gatherings were make all over the world. It wasn’t just an Alberta thing.