[Trade] Tkachuk (8 yrs x $9.5 mil) + `25 4th to FLA for Huberdeau, Weegar, Schwindt & `25 1st

[Dan403]

Originally Posted by BlindMilwaukee

To add to the above, once a player ages a bit and loses their explosive speed what are they left with?

We are hoping to be left with those other tools, hockey IQ, good hands, accurate passer.

I still have a Lombardi jersey but that's really all he was - fast.

Paul Ranhiem

[Classic_Sniper]

Originally Posted by timbit

He played with Bennett and Reinhart ( 2 prior massive underachievers), primarily, last season and “crushing it out of the park”, he most certainly did.

115 points.

We’re talking about a well over a point a game player ,over the last 5 seasons.
Like, more points than Johnny or any other Flame in the last five seasons.

But, let the negative spinners carry on.

A phenomenal haul by Tre.

Right, but based on our experience as Flames fans, we’ve seen guys like Iginla, Fleury, Gaudreau and go from 90+ points to 60ish points or 60ish points back up to 90 points in any given year. That’s hockey, dynamics can change all the time and that’s especially the case when you’re traded to a new team.

For myself personally, I’m going to temper my expectations on Huberdeau who won’t be playing the same style of hockey as he did in Florida. That was a run and gun team offense all the time style which is just about the opposite from the type of game Darryl generally tries to deploy.

[Electricprez]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

He may very well.

But I don’t think it’s necessarily up to Darryl, it’s ultimately up to Huberdeau and how his game responds and reacts to his new line mates. For instance, Monahan under Sutter, couldn’t find a fit with anybody. He sort of just played with everybody until he found his way onto the 4th line one day.

Monahan was recovering from a major injury directly related to his skating that also impacted his ability to take faceoffs.

He suffered that injury early in the season and by all accounts should've gotten proper attention for it far, far earlier than he did.

I don't think he would've fared better under a coach not named Sutter, and I don't expect a rebound to top-line form. Two hip surgeries is no joke.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Right, but based on our experience as Flames fans, we’ve seen guys like Iginla, Fleury, Gaudreau and go from 90+ points to 60ish points or 60ish points back up to 90 points in any given year. That’s hockey, dynamics can change all the time and that’s especially the case when you’re traded to a new team.

For myself personally, I’m going to temper my expectations on Huberdeau who won’t be playing the same style of hockey as he did in Florida. That was a run and gun team offense all the time style which is just about the opposite from the type of game Darryl generally tries to deploy.

Flames were 6th in goal scoring out of 32 teams...its not like they were the 1995 Devils

even higher in 5 on 5 goals

I mean he probably won't score 115

Tkachuk probably wont score 104
Gaudreau probably wont score 115

[PepsiFree]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Right, but based on our experience as Flames fans, we’ve seen guys like Iginla, Fleury, Gaudreau and go from 90+ points to 60ish points or 60ish points back up to 90 points in any given year. That’s hockey, dynamics can change all the time and that’s especially the case when you’re traded to a new team.

For myself personally, I’m going to temper my expectations on Huberdeau who won’t be playing the same style of hockey as he did in Florida. That was a run and gun team offense all the time style which is just about the opposite from the type of game Darryl generally tries to deploy.

If Huberdeau is a poor/slow skater, though, moving away from a run and gun style which prioritises speed, zone entries, and pressure is probably beneficial, no?

If he’s slow, hitting 115 points in a run and gun style is probably an incredible feat. Imagine how he would do with more time.

[the-rasta-masta]

With Huberdeau’s speed and playmaking, I’m interested in a rehabbed Monahan playing on the top line with him and Lindholm. Give Huberdeau two finishers to work with.

[Bingo]

Originally Posted by Classic_Sniper

Right, but based on our experience as Flames fans, we’ve seen guys like Iginla, Fleury, Gaudreau and go from 90+ points to 60ish points or 60ish points back up to 90 points in any given year. That’s hockey, dynamics can change all the time and that’s especially the case when you’re traded to a new team.

For myself personally, I’m going to temper my expectations on Huberdeau who won’t be playing the same style of hockey as he did in Florida. That was a run and gun team offense all the time style which is just about the opposite from the type of game Darryl generally tries to deploy.

The Panthers were 1st in xGF60 in all situations.

The Flames were 4th

This isn't penthouse to the outhouse for Huberdeau ... so no I wouldn't say opposite.

Caveat being Gaudreau and Tkachuk out, Huberdeau in, forwards a step back, Weeger making the D more offensive and transitional.

[midniteowl]

Originally Posted by Saqe

Lol, I watched the guy since he entered the league. He's never been a good skater. That's why he doesn't carry the puck up the ice a la Gaudreau, it was always Barkov/Trocheck/Bennett in Florida.

LOL, this is very easy to type.

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by Bingo

The Panthers were 1st in xGF60 in all situations.

The Flames were 4th

This isn't penthouse to the outhouse for Huberdeau ... so no I wouldn't say opposite.

Caveat being Gaudreau and Tkachuk out, Huberdeau in, forwards a step back, Weeger making the D more offensive and transitional.

Panthers also lost their leading scorer by 30 points

[Calgary4LIfe]

I wouldn't worry about Huberdeau's production. He is a top-end player in the league, and has been for a number of years. I cringe when someone says that Calgary is a defensive team - they aren't. They are a team that prefers to go on the offensive. It is just that when they don't have the puck, they go and do whatever they can to win that puck back.


Defensive teams sit back. Calgary does not sit back. I think Huberdeau and Weegar will both thrive in Calgary.

[GreenLantern2814]

Originally Posted by dino7c

Flames were 6th in goal scoring out of 32 teams...its not like they were the 1995 Devils

even higher in 5 on 5 goals

I mean he probably won't score 115

Tkachuk probably wont score 104
Gaudreau probably wont score 115

Nobody’s going to score like last year.

The league got a three week break in the middle of the year.

COVID decimated rosters and had lots of guys who wouldn’t be in the lineup in the lineup.

8 guys scored 100+, 16 guys scored 90+.

That isn’t going to happen this year.

It didn’t even happen in 2006, the gold standard for offensive hockey in the modern era.

[blankall]

Originally Posted by PepsiFree

If Huberdeau is a poor/slow skater, though, moving away from a run and gun style which prioritises speed, zone entries, and pressure is probably beneficial, no?

If he’s slow, hitting 115 points in a run and gun style is probably an incredible feat. Imagine how he would do with more time.

Huberdeau scored a lot of points on the transition. He has an amazing ability to draw multiple defenders in as he enters the zone. That typically leaves a linemate open for the tap in goal. Huberdeau, despite not having the highest end top speed is also great at moving with the puck at speed. So when he's moving forward with the puck, he's still doing it relatively fast.

Huberdeau is one of the best at creating space and then finding the open man. He can do it a lot different ways. While on the transition, from behind the net, or slowing the play down with possession.

Huberdeau just set a record for LWs in assists, he can score all sorts of ways. Unlike Gaudreau, Huberdeau does not spin away from the play with the puck to avoid defenders, and instead drives towards the net.

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Nobody’s going to score like last year.

The league got a three week break in the middle of the year.

COVID decimated rosters and had lots of guys who wouldn’t be in the lineup in the lineup.

8 guys scored 100+, 16 guys scored 90+.

That isn’t going to happen this year.

It didn’t even happen in 2006, the gold standard for offensive hockey in the modern era.

Big part was goaltending too.

Shots per game were pretty flat at 31.3 to 31.4 per game in 18-19, 19-20, and 21-22 (ignoring the weird short bubble season)

But save percentage was .910, 910, .907 respectively. That 3 points is a big difference over the course of a season across the league and why goals per game was the highest it’s been since 05-06

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by CaptainYooh

Is this for real? If yes, hilarious.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1551604069353095168

Oh man, I'm all about this. Hook it to my veins!!!

[topfiverecords]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Explosive and fast are not what makes someone a good hockey player, or even a good skater. It just makes them fast. Matt Lombardi was fast. Rico Fata was SO fast.

How fast is Bergeron? Marchand? Draisaitl? Matthews? Zibanejad? Barkov? Sid? O’Reilly?

Whatever Huberdeau’s limitations, they haven’t stopped him from being incredibly effective his entire career.

McDavid is a great skater too and all it does is make him look like a wind up toy that ends up crashing into the wall or falling down the stairs.

[Tbull8]

Schwindt apparently knows Ben Jones, sweet!

[dino7c]

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Nobody’s going to score like last year.

The league got a three week break in the middle of the year.

COVID decimated rosters and had lots of guys who wouldn’t be in the lineup in the lineup.

8 guys scored 100+, 16 guys scored 90+.

That isn’t going to happen this year.

It didn’t even happen in 2006, the gold standard for offensive hockey in the modern era.

covid thing is actually pretty big, good point

Flames really went on a tear during their 10 game homestand of makeup games or whatever it was

[Cali Panthers Fan]

Originally Posted by Tbull8

Schwindt apparently knows Ben Jones, schweet!

fixed that for you.

[Bingo]

The Coxe article reeks of a piece ready to go to print for Saturday but then the deal happens Friday night and Calgary isn't dumping Tkachuk for futures, so no you have to edit it to say "got back some key players, but that doesn't count because they haven't signed"

Send!

[powderjunkie]

I see a Rich Man's Tanguay:
- pass first guy with cerebral vision who can bury it when he needs to (more true for Tanguay before he left COL)
- not as physical as you'd like, though Hubes definitely seems rougher/tougher than Tanguay
- average skaters; not particularly noticeable in other facets of the game, but not a liability, either

I'm shocked to see that Tanguay was only 27 when we got him for his first stint; he was age 31-33 for his second stint and that's probably stronger in my memory.

Originally Posted by Mull

Regarding skating- do none of the advance metrics measure skating as a metric to allow us to have some sort of semi-empirical data point to compare the players?


I tried using "the google" but came up short

This can't come soon enough...I think it's close, though I'm not sure if all of the data will be publicly available, or if it's just gonna be for Mavi Kph fap sessions in intermission replays.

Originally Posted by GreenLantern2814

Nobody’s going to score like last year.

The league got a three week break in the middle of the year.

COVID decimated rosters and had lots of guys who wouldn’t be in the lineup in the lineup.

8 guys scored 100+, 16 guys scored 90+.

That isn’t going to happen this year.

It didn’t even happen in 2006, the gold standard for offensive hockey in the modern era.

It was the highest goal rate league wide since '95-96 (when Pens set some of the records we approached/matched/beat for most players with __ goals/pts/etc).