Hockey Canada, CHL settle lawsuit over alleged sexual assault involving WJ players

[Goriders]

I thought the event was a golf tournament?

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Yeah, the golf club thing doesn’t make sense. This was a hotel room no? Seems far more likely the guy had his clubs with him. I mean if intimidation is the goal, wouldn’t 8 large men be enough?

[FlamesAddiction]

Originally Posted by Fighting Banana Slug

Yeah, the golf club thing doesn’t make sense. This was a hotel room no? Seems far more likely the guy had his clubs with him. I mean if intimidation is the goal, wouldn’t 8 large men be enough?

I guess it depends on the context. The scenario leaves a lot up to the imagination. If someone, in the middle of a group sexual encounter (whether an assault or consensual) just got up, went and got some golf clubs and brought them into the room, then that is weird. If someone pulled one out and brandished it somehow, that is far more sinister. If they just happened to be in the room, a rape victim might worry about the implication, but the motive to actually use them to intimidate wouldn't be there.

So many questions in this story. There seems to be a lot of possibly incriminating evidence, but without more details, it is difficult to figure out if there is a reasonable doubt as well.

[Aarongavey]

https://twitter.com/rwesthead/status...616884229?s=12

5% of sexual assault survivors report their sexual assaults to the authorities.

In other news, the lawyers for the 8 players say the players will participate in the NHL investigation but say there should be no consequences because it was consensual. The woman also made videos saying it was consensual (standard post coitus stuff, although she says that she was forced to make the video taped statements by the players).

Rick Westhead is one of the best hockey journalists around, thankfully he has the hockey beat at TSN.

Lawyers representing a group of former Canadian Hockey League players accused of sexually assaulting a woman in 2018 say the players will cooperate with the National Hockey League’s investigation into the incident and that the league should not discipline the players because any sexual contact between the players and the woman was consensual.

https://www.tsn.ca/players-will-coop...-say-1.1826655

[Aarongavey]

https://www.tsn.ca/timmins-denies-in...team-1.1826846

Connor Timmins sent out a statement saying he was not involved in any way

I am aware of the allegations made against some of the members of the 2018 Canadian World Junior Hockey team at the London, Ontario gala event in June of 2018. I was not involved in any way in the incident that gave rise to the allegations that have been reported.
"No one alleges that I was present or involved and I have no personal knowledge of what occurred. I cooperated fully with the initial Hockey Canada investigation and will continue to cooperate in any other investigations as required as investigations are ongoing.

[GioforPM]

See now that’s a pretty clear statement. I wish Dube’s said that.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

See now that’s a pretty clear statement. I wish Dube’s said that.

By not saying that is it not automatically saying he was there?

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

By not saying that is it not automatically saying he was there?

No. But it just doesn’t shut the door on it.

[TheIronMaiden]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

By not saying that is it not automatically saying he was there?

don't you know, silence implies participation.

[Boblobla]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

No. But it just doesn’t shut the door on it.

I don't know...

Other statements, paraphrasing:
"I was not there, unequivocally"
"I was out of the country"
"I was not there, no-one said I was there, I fully cooperated with the investigation"

Dube
"I didn't do anything wrong, and if you say I did I will sue your pants off"

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

I don't know...

Other statements, paraphrasing:
"I was not there, unequivocally"
"I was out of the country"
"I was not there, no-one said I was there, I fully cooperated with the investigation"

Dube
"I didn't do anything wrong, and if you say I did I will sue your pants off"

Dube said no such thing, his agent did.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Dube said no such thing, his agent did.

The appropriate English definition of the word agent in the sports agent context is

Agent - one who is authorized to act for or in the place of another: such as

c : a business representative (as of an athlete or entertainer)

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/agent

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Dube said no such thing, his agent did.

The whole concept of an agent is that if they say something, it's you saying something.

[OptimalTates]

So where we at?

22 players, six have said they weren't involved in no uncertain terms, six others represented by Wasserman Hockey have a non-committal statement that their clients were "not involved in any wrongdoing and police cleared the players (not clear if addressing the six players represented or all players on the team)" released by a lawyer for one of the players, eight have not provided a statement, one has said he fully cooperated and left it at that and another has said he cooperated and pointed out that the police cleared all players of wrongdoing.

Presuming that not all six clients of Wasserman Hockey were involved, if I was represented by Wasserman Hockey and not involved in the allegations, I would be looking for new representation. They are lumping in all their clients together, and only doing so to protect those involved, not those who wouldn't be. I don't know why you would want that cloud above you simply because another player(s) represented by the company was involved in an alleged rape. I also wouldn't like that they used ambiguous "police cleared them of any wrongdoing" when really the police just didn't charge anyone with a crime, which isn't really the same as clearing anyone of wrongdoing.

But 16 players now who have yet to confirm they weren't involved, 8 John Does. Not the greatest odds anymore.

[Calgary4LIfe]

Obviously I hope that they get to the bottom of this and that the guilty parties end up being criminally charged and so on.


If these 8 players are guilty (I don't want to jump the gun here - they seem to be at this point, but there hasn't been charges laid AFAIK, and no trial yet, so I am using the word 'if' here), and if there were coaches/executives/anyone else employed by Hockey Canada that knew what went on and chose to help hide the events of that night, I hope they are terminated.


In this thread, there are a few posts about the toxicity of culture in hockey. It isn't just about the people who do those things - it is the people who by helping to hide or minimize these actions, make it impossible to stamp out this toxic culture. If you are employed by Hockey Canada and know firsthand some of the stuff that happened and chose to help keep it quiet, you need to be fired. You are a major cog in this toxic environment. Incidents will always happen from time to time - happens all over the place. The reason why some places have it happen more of often is because of enablers that help to hide these incidents. They are part of the problem and need to be pushed aside. Just my two cents.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Calgary4LIfe

Obviously I hope that they get to the bottom of this and that the guilty parties end up being criminally charged and so on.


If these 8 players are guilty (I don't want to jump the gun here - they seem to be at this point, but there hasn't been charges laid AFAIK, and no trial yet, so I am using the word 'if' here), and if there were coaches/executives/anyone else employed by Hockey Canada that knew what went on and chose to help hide the events of that night, I hope they are terminated.


In this thread, there are a few posts about the toxicity of culture in hockey. It isn't just about the people who do those things - it is the people who by helping to hide or minimize these actions, make it impossible to stamp out this toxic culture. If you are employed by Hockey Canada and know firsthand some of the stuff that happened and chose to help keep it quiet, you need to be fired. You are a major cog in this toxic environment. Incidents will always happen from time to time - happens all over the place. The reason why some places have it happen more of often is because of enablers that help to hide these incidents. They are part of the problem and need to be pushed aside. Just my two cents.

I have real doubts about a criminal investigation being (re)opened. Unless it's clear that the original investigator brushed everything aside and ignored key evidence, prosecutorial discretion is generally upheld. Unfortunately as the stats show, this happens a lot. It stinks. I suspect the cops/Crown took statements, said "well, it's her word against theirs, no other evidence plus we have this video where she says she consented, so we can't get a conviction". Even though a video like that is totally abnormal and suspect, and even though there was alcohol involved. It's always an issue where the victim is willing at first and then events change.

[Boblobla]

I would be very surprised if there are any sort of criminal convictions for this. It will turn into a he-said, she-said unless there is some deleted cell video recovered that provides some clarity.

The cynic in me thinks the players will issue some sort of a non-committal apology, say how much they have grown since the event and promise to engage in the community to educate male youth on consent while intoxicated.

[Coach]

Originally Posted by Boblobla

I would be very surprised if there are any sort of criminal convictions for this. It will turn into a he-said, she-said unless there is some deleted cell video recovered that provides some clarity.

The cynic in me thinks the players will issue some sort of a non-committal apology, say how much they have grown since the event and promise to engage in the community to educate male youth on consent while intoxicated.

Not a parent, but I wouldn’t want my kids learning about consent from people who so clearly don’t understand it and (presumably) received no consequences for their own actions.

Remember kids, don’t rape. Unless you’re a hockey star. Then you can be like me!

[Aarongavey]

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/spor...ments-suggest/

Hockey Canada had abuse claim reserve fund, court documents suggest

The detail is included in a July 2021 affidavit sworn by Glen McCurdie, who was then Hockey Canada’s vice-president of insurance and risk management, as part of a lawsuit launched by an injured player in Ontario.

“Hockey Canada maintains a reserve in a segregated account to pay for any such uninsured liabilities as they arise,” McCurdie’s affidavit said. It goes on to say that “uninsured liabilities include potential claims for historical sexual abuse.”

[Fighting Banana Slug]

Unless I am mistaken, this is really an investigation of Hockey Canada and how they treated the investigation and subsequently spent tax dollars on a settlement. I don't expect more on the criminal front. On the civil front, there is a settlement, so I don't see anything else that can be done.

I understand why people are confused by the noncommittal nature of Dube's statement and flat out silence from others, but I don't think they are actually the subject of the investigation. This is why their representation doesn't want any names disclosed. The settlement is done, presumably with an NDA. We might not like it, but it is what the parties agreed to.