Hockey Canada, CHL settle lawsuit over alleged sexual assault involving WJ players

[Krovikan]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Well, that’s not the case here. She filed criminal and civil complaints. The criminal one was never pursued.

I literally said in the post you quoted:

which imo it seems like it wasn't properly investigated.

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[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Well, that’s not the case here. She filed criminal and civil complaints. The criminal one was never pursued.

I thought the criminal case was originally pursued and the police found no evidence to lay charges?

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

I thought the criminal case was originally pursued and the police found no evidence to lay charges?

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ticle33891309/

66% of the time the police can’t be bothered to lay charges. The presumption of “meh” is high in Canada.

42 per cent of sex-assault complaints lead to a charge (Statistics Canada, which has data from all jurisdictions, reports 44 per cent). When unfounded cases are factored in as complaints, however, the charge rate drops to 34 per cent.

[IamNotKenKing]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ticle33891309/

66% of the time the police can’t be bothered to lay charges. The presumption of “meh” is high in Canada.

Sorry, but your statement, if relying upon your quoted statistics, is simply not accurate.

An accurate statement is that 66% of the time, including unfounded complaints, charges are not laid. It could be insufficient evidence, recanting, noncooperation, intimidation, desire for privacy…not simply “police can’t be bothered to lay charges”.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ticle33891309/

66% of the time the police can’t be bothered to lay charges. The presumption of “meh” is high in Canada.

So you are saying that if person A accuses person B of something and the police investigate and don't find enough evidence to lay charges they should do so anyhow? That isn't how it works. Not only that the police gather the evidence and present it to the Crown, if they don't feel there is a case they decide not to proceed.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

To be clear, you said you don't care if he was named as the 8 because there's no legal action to be taken, right?

I did not say any such thing. I said that he should not be punished just because you think that he might be one of the 8. And he should not be punished by random people on the Internet.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Aarongavey

I do not think there has been a single post in this thread that says they should be punished indiscriminately. Happy to be corrected if you can find a post like that though.

OptimalTates let it be known that he thinks Dube is guilty of rape because he can think of no other interpretation of a statement made by Dube's agent. That looks pretty damned indiscriminate to me.

EDIT to quote:

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Dube's agent trying to imply nothing wrong took place by bringing up no charges is very akin to calling the woman a liar. Pretty gross and only real reason to do that would be.....anyone want to play Occam's razor here?

[OptimalTates]

You sure love putting words in people's mouth and avoiding questions. I'll just assume you're a big Spacey fan since you won't comment on that. I'm guessing Tramp Stamp of his face on back?

Also even if I had said that, pointing to his statement compared to other players and alleging he was involved (which I didn't state) would be the opposite of indiscriminate. Like the very antithesis to it. Anything I believe about Dube is because of the statement he had his agent release. Not for being on the team.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

You sure love putting words in people's mouth and avoiding questions. I'll just assume you're a big Spacey fan since you won't comment on that. I'm guessing Tramp Stamp of his face on back?

Way offside dude, come on....

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

You sure love putting words in people's mouth and avoiding questions. I'll just assume you're a big Spacey fan since you won't comment on that. I'm guessing Tramp Stamp of his face on back?

What the #### is this even about? Word salad.

[OptimalTates]

I value the players who came out and said the acts alleged were reprehensible, appalling and other such words. Look at Mete's statement. He doesn't even preface it with "if" or "alleged" he just calls it out.

I don't like people who claim/imply that no wrongdoing occurred.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

OptimalTates let it be known that he thinks Dube is guilty of rape because he can think of no other interpretation of a statement made by Dube's agent. That looks pretty damned indiscriminate to me.

No, you let it be known that you think that he thinks that:

Originally Posted by Jay Random

OptimalTates said there was only one reason why Dube's agent would make the statement he did, and then slyly invoked Occam's razor while refusing to actually state what the reason was. I told him he was calling Dube guilty without using the word ‘guilty’, and he did not dispute it.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

So you are saying that if person A accuses person B of something and the police investigate and don't find enough evidence to lay charges they should do so anyhow? That isn't how it works. Not only that the police gather the evidence and present it to the Crown, if they don't feel there is a case they decide not to proceed.

If you think there is not a strong bias towards not laying charges, I got some beachfront property in Prince Albert to sell you. Police not laying charges in this case is almost meaningless when determining if there was wrongdoing. In this case, the woman at the time did not want to cooperate. Now she does so thankfully we will get the full story. I am sure all involved are pleased with that development, I know I am.

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

What the #### is this even about? Word salad.

Buddy I've continuously asked, and you've continuously avoided answering, if you think it was wrong Kevin Spacey suffered consequences for his actions outside of the law. Something you apparently don't agree with. So was it wrong he got canned from House of Cards because of rape allegations (allegations that had and would not been proven in court). If so, how is this not the same for the 8 John Does.

Legal consequences aren't the only consequences you should face with your actions.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by powderjunkie

No, you let it be known that you think that he thinks that:

Silence implies consent. At no point, in all his numerous posts, has OptimalTates said that he did not mean to imply that Dube is guilty.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by IamNotKenKing

Sorry, but your statement, if relying upon your quoted statistics, is simply not accurate.

An accurate statement is that 66% of the time, including unfounded complaints, charges are not laid. It could be insufficient evidence, recanting, noncooperation, intimidation, desire for privacy…not simply “police can’t be bothered to lay charges”.

30% of the time in London Ontario the police found claims to be unfounded. 3 out of every 10 times they were found to be unfounded there, highest rate in all of Canada for cities between 250,000 to 500,000. They blow second place away in that regard, second was only 22%. That probably is a statistical anomaly though and not a systemic issue.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...ticle33855643/

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Buddy I've continuously asked, and you've continuously avoided answering, if you think it was wrong Kevin Spacey suffered consequences for his actions outside of the law.

What? I don't know anything about Kevin Spacey. Why am I required to have an opinion on this? Get stuffed.

Something you apparently don't agree with. So was it wrong he got canned from House of Cards because of rape allegations (allegations that had and would not been proven in court). If so, how is this not the same for the 8 John Does.

All right, then. If that's what happened to Spacey, it sounds like he got a raw deal. Hollywood screws people over all the time. If you're looking for lessons on ethics there, then Mister or Ms., you are barking up the wrong tree.

Legal consequences aren't the only consequences you should face with your actions.

And if you did not commit the actions at all, what consequences should you face for merely being accused?

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

Silence implies consent. At no point, in all his numerous posts, has OptimalTates said that he did not mean to imply that Dube is guilty.

So you're clearly the president of both Bill Cosby and Kevin Spacey's fan clubs because you haven't denied that?

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

Silence implies consent.

Funny that's what the 8 John Does will say too!

Now your posts make a lot more sense to me.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

Silence implies consent. At no point, in all his numerous posts, has OptimalTates said that he did not mean to imply that Dube is guilty.

Also, do you want to reconsider the bolded three words, especially in this thread?