[Signing] Gaudreau to Columbus (7 x $9.75 million)

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

I just still can't make sense of why he didn't sign in NJ for the same or better money, that's what bugs me the most. I refuse to believe that NJ wouldn't have given him 10M x 7yrs.

Unless he legitimately believes that the future is brighter for the Jackets? And maybe it is - I'm not overly familiar with either roster TBH.

The latest reports had Jersey around $9M.
If they were at 10, he'd be a Devil right now.

He went with the only offer that was in that division (kind of close to home) and in the price range he wanted.

I have no doubt he expected $10M+ offers to be there from multiple teams and they didn't come. I think most of us expected that too.

[Ford Prefect]

I keep seeing the defense made for Gaudreau that it was his right to decide what he was going to do. That is without question. But there’s a classy way to do things and a classless way to do things. Gaudreau definitely took the low road.

Bottom line though is he’s gone, and leaving the way he did makes it easier to swallow.

I don’t get how anyone can put this on Tre. I can only assume that point of view is triggered by a deep-seated and perhaps subconscious hatred of Tre. Might as well blame the wind.

On that note…peace out. This thread was good yesterday but now it is headed for the same quagmire as the previous thread. I don’t care to watch that train wreck again.

[Delthefunky]

I don't blame Treliving at all the more I learn about this. I think the flames try to be a model organization, and negotiated in good faith and gave Johnny the benefit of the doubt. He used that and screwed us royally, and now he gets to finish his career in Columbus. Good riddance, turns out he is a dumb ass.. let's move on.

[devo22]

Originally Posted by Ford Prefect

I keep seeing the defense made for Gaudreau that it was his right to decide what he was going to do. That is without question. But there’s a classy way to do things and a classless way to do things. Gaudreau definitely took the low road.

Bottom line though is he’s gone, and leaving the way he did makes it easier to swallow.

this is where I am at too. If he had really gone home, I'd have understood it, but I'd have played "what if?" in my head for years to come. The way he actually went out makes it easier for me as a fan to move on, honestly.

[Winsor_Pilates]

Originally Posted by Delthefunky

I don't blame Treliving at all the more I learn about this. I think the flames try to be a model organization, and negotiated in good faith and gave Johnny the benefit of the doubt. He used that and screwed us royally, and now he gets to finish his career in Columbus. Good riddance, turns out he is a dumb ass.. let's move on.

I think it's time to move on from Treliving, but even as someone who wants him out, you have to admit he's now vindicated to a large degree on what happened this past week.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by transplant99

It's a fact is it?

How do you know that?

It's a fact because he allowed the player to take right up to the last hours to decide. Nobody was stopping him for making a deadline. If you allow someone as long as possible to make a decision don't get mad at them for taking every second of that time to make it. Johnny didn't handcuff the Flames. Treliving did and maybe owners if they were involved. Fold your cards and play the next hand if the stakes are getting so high that you have more to lose.

[BurningSteel]

I love the player and skills he possesses but I don't think I'll ever wear his jersey again. Going back to the goat �� #12.

[Strange Brew]

Kekalainen “ok wow, is this real?”

LOL

[Saqe]

Originally Posted by Winsor_Pilates

I think it's time to move on from Treliving, but even as someone who wants him out, you have to admit he's now vindicated to a large degree on what happened this past week.

IMO as soon as Gaudreau wasn't extending before his NTC kicked in he should've been traded. There was enough smoke already that Calgary isn't a destination and that Gaudreau was interested to play closer to home.


Now if Treliving was fine with using Johnny as a one year rental then that's another thing, it's a reasonable argument. But otherwise either he completely lacks pulse on his players or he was too overconfident in thinking he could re-sign Gaudreau.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by iamca

I like this snippet from Traikos:

“So Gaudreau turned down $15.75-million to play in Columbus rather than Calgary. And possibly more had he gone to the Devils or the Islanders.

How bizarre.

Money aside, the contract is even more perplexing when you consider what else he turned down. A chance to play in a city where he was treated as a superstar. A chance to play on a team that finished first in the Pacific Division last year. A chance to continue playing alongside Matthew Tkachuk and Elias Lindholm on what was the best line in hockey last season.

Good luck finding any of that with the Blue Jackets, a nondescript team in a college football town, which lacks a No. 1 centre and has spent its existence as a bubble team at best.

That last part should change with Gaudreau’s addition, although don’t be so sure.”


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I liked that too.

No offense to Gaudreau, but he's kind of an idiot.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

It's hard to find a set of facts that makes all of this make any sense.

Other than how much Johnny's social anxiety played into this decision.

Perhaps he was conflicted about leaving Calgary, because he liked Calgary so much and how well he was treated. And especially because he dreaded telling Calgary he was turning his back on them.

Perhaps he hoped that coming back to Calgary would become an option for him, but as time got closer to making a decision, his anxiety increased and he couldn't do it.

Columbus then became his preferred destination, where he can play with less pressure.

The latest playoff "run" and loss to hated rivals Edmonton may have clinched him going, as opposed to the prevailing thought that a long run would make him more likely to stay. I expect losing to Edmonton has resulted in a number of (differing) feelings among the Calgary players. I'm not sure we ever considered the fact that a player may be is thinking "I sure don't want to go through that again", losing to a hated rival in a rabbit Canadian market.

That should drive players. Gaudreau is not a man. That's my conclusion, I'm glad he's gone.

[The Big Chill]

The part I don’t get is why announce to CGY that they are no longer an option before you have real deals on the table from the teams you want? Why would they not want that as a fall back plan, or at the very least a bargaining chip with NJ or whoever else was involved.

Either JG’s side were way over confident, or this CBJ deal really is something he wanted.

[Lanny_McDonald]

Originally Posted by transplant99

It's a fact is it?

How do you know that?

Because it's his job to know to these things. It is his job to understand the players he employs, have an idea about what makes them tick, and if they are viable for this team in the long run. I think this is a major failing of most managers and an area where teams/organizations that employ the right support professionals have a distinct advantage.

Is it not entirely possible that ownership insisted that BT try and re-sign him when BT wanted to possibly trade him?

Then Treliving didn't prepare them with the right information that would have properly informed their understanding of the situation. I'm not sure Treliving understood the situation completely.

Is it not possible that JG assured his teammates and/or management he wanted to return but did not really have that inclination?

Or it is more likely that he was prepared to return under certain conditions that the team was not prepared to meet? What I heard was the Flames selling legacy to Gaudreau. They pushed hard on him achieving the status of the all-time greatest Flames in almost all measures, all but guaranteeing his jersey be retired and him being Mr. Flame - like Lanny - for the next few decades. That was the pitch I heard, and for someone with any form of social anxiety disorder this would be more than enough to send them running in the opposite direction. I have a feeling that Gaudreau wanted to come back, but not as the face of the franchise and Mr. Flame. It is not who he is and something his personality could support.

I mean this thing should have been dealt with last summer IMO and if he wasnt signing...then see ya.

Agreed. I wonder what our sports psychologists do for this team and if they are not asked to inform certain decisions?

Something prevented/handcuffed them from accomplishing that. I'm going to assume it wasn't management doing it to themselves, so it was another force at play. I think that is a reasonable/logical position...no?

Management needs to understand these forces. Like it or not they are supposed to understand and deal with every potential influence on these players. These are multi-million dollar investments and the management team is supposed to treat them as such.

Either way, yes its a bad look...for every single entity involved other than the Blue Jackets. They are the only winners in all of this.

Agreed. Everyone looks bad here, which is why there is more to the story than meets the eye. I think the responses from the team and the player, along with where he ended up, should provide some insight.

Im not defending BT as a GM here as I think its time for a change and a fresh approach among the braintrust, but in this particular case I cant lay the blame at his feet when the player was literally negotiating to the last day and then turns around and leaves for 15 million dollars less.

Yes and no. I give Treliving some slack as he put forward the best package available, but the big question is what did the sell job look like? Was he selling something that appealed to the player, or feeding an anxiety that would ultimately force the player out? Something went wrong someplace and it forced Gaudreau out and for him to take less money. I think it was Gaudreau's desire to be just one of the boys instead of being the face of the franchise that scuttled this.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by Strange Brew

Kekalainen “ok wow, is this real?”

LOL

To be a fly on that wall lol.

[Leeman4Gilmour]

There's 60 pages of commentary, so this will be nothing more than an agreement to what I'm sure someone else has said;

Most baffling decision by a person I've ever seen. Leaving $15M on the table is significant. I think it was Covid. I believe he and his wife are fearful of starting a family, something like Covid happening again, or another wave of Covid itself, and being caught in Canada and it being very difficult to get back to family or family up to them. I think this, because it's the closest thing I can come up with that is kind of logical. Still, $15M

I agree it was unfair of Gaudreau and Gross to take it to the wire when they had to have known he wasn't staying in Canada. They didn't need to do that to establish a market value.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Well, the Columbus Blue Jackets for one.

Treliving gambled that Gaudreau was being up front with him, while in the knowledge that Johnny’s stock was at an all time low, and the return on a trade would be very unsatisfactory. If someone is still negotiating with you it normally means that they are prepared to accept an offer if it’s the right amount.

Basically you want Treliving to assume Gaudreau is lying and negotiating in bad faith.

I think any competent GM should assume that the players are going to do what's best for them and nothing more. There's a reason long tenured GM's like Lamoriello are cut throat. We always talk about players taking team friendly deals but the reality is that rarely ever happens because teams take full advantage of the situation when players are under team control and players do the same when they hold the power. That's the dynamic and if Johnny told Treliving everything he wanted to hear last summer then why couldn't' they come to an agreement last summer? Anytime a player says he doesn't want to negotiate until the end of the season on the last year of his deal it's a bad sign. Treliving is paid to read the room. I'm not posting today in the Fire Treliving thread because that's not my point here. My point is that that the GM really didn't handle this situation well at all.

[edslunch]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Because it wasn’t his fault. Tell me how he avoids it without being a mind reader when Johnny (a) misled him a year ago or (b) told the truth a year ago but changed his mind in the interim. Make sure you tell us all how Treliving does in a rental trade for a guy who has a 5 team NMC that probably only has one team he wants to go to, which also can’t afford him, and 4 which are no gos in a trade.

He could have taken action before the NMC kicked in. He could have traded him as a rental. He could have traded his rights. He could have evaluated JG as a really skilled player but not one to build around, even several years ago.

I can certainly see the perspective that it’s not Tre’s fault, and once the NMC kicked in maybe that’s true. But great leaders in any walk of life don’t settle for ‘not my fault’. They make things happen and importantly have the foresight and cold-bloodedness to avoid being put in these situations.

What was his plan with JG….’we hoped he would sign’. What’s his plan with MT…’we hope he’ll sign’. What’s his plan C…no idea. I think Tre is an ok GM but is pretty far from a great one and doesn’t deserve a lot of slack.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by TOfan

You seem incapable of acknowledging that this was not Treliving’s decision alone. Ownership is equally responsible, a twelve year old should be able to see that.

What decisions are Treliving’s alone? Or does ownership make every general manager decision? Was the Hamonic trade his decision alone or was that the owners? Was the Neal signing his? The Brouwer signing? Does Brad only make the good decisions like the Lindholm trade? Which decisions are the GM’s decisions by himself and which ones are the owners and GM? Cause I have been told that it was Brad’s decision to get Sutter. Now that seems like a pretty big decision, one up there with the negotiating plan for Gaudreau. Seems like that one was likely an ownership decision to me. But I am confused as to which decisions are Brad’s and which decisions are Brad’s and the owners.

[GirlySports]

Originally Posted by Leeman4Gilmour

There's 60 pages of commentary, so this will be nothing more than an agreement to what I'm sure someone else has said;

Most baffling decision by a person I've ever seen. Leaving $15M on the table is significant. I think it was Covid. I believe he and his wife are fearful of starting a family, something like Covid happening again, or another wave of Covid itself, and being caught in Canada and it being very difficult to get back to family or family up to them. I think this, because it's the closest thing I can come up with that is kind of logical. Still, $15M

I agree it was unfair of Gaudreau and Gross to take it to the wire when they had to have known he wasn't staying in Canada. They didn't need to do that to establish a market value.

Players have the right to do this, take it to the wire and have all options available. Gaudreau and Gross definitely did not want to be traded. But it was up to Tre to sense the room and pull the trigger last summer. By the trade deadline, it's too late, the Flames are in first place.

[djsFlames]

Originally Posted by The Big Chill

The part I don’t get is why announce to CGY that they are no longer an option before you have real deals on the table from the teams you want? Why would they not want that as a fall back plan, or at the very least a bargaining chip with NJ or whoever else was involved.

Either JG’s side were way over confident, or this CBJ deal really is something he wanted.

I'm gonna go with saw Philly clearing cap, got giddy and told the Flames peace out without considering the possibility that Philly might still not being able to make it happen.

Then was left with a burnt bridge and took the best of the "meh" suitors remaining.

I don't know what Lewis Gross was telling him through this but either Johnny really doesn't take counsel/advice or Gross is an abysmal agent.