Matthew Tkachuk & Johnny Gaudreau Signing Watch Thread

[DiracSpike]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

General consensus from twitter is that’s a mega overpay lol. No one in the league appreciates what Gaudreau is.

It is an overpay though. The general consensus is right because everyone doesn't have emotional attachments to the player like some here do.

I can see why people who love gaudreau want him on that contract, and I can see why ownership wants him on that contract, but for the life of me if you're a fan who wants to win a championship anytime soon you're dreaming if you think we get remotely close with Gaudreau as our top, highest paid player. We didn't win #### for 8 years with him making .9 and 6.7, but somehow we'll win a cup with him making over 10?? How's that going to happen. Be realistic. The only way it happens is if we somehow luck in to another top tier, top 10, better than gaudreau player who's on a rookie or RFA salary structure.

Am I saying Gaudreau will never win a cup? No. Am I saying the playoff failure was all his fault? No. I'm saying we've seen the ceiling of this team with him as its best player. If we somehow found a player better than him and added that person it's a different story to the team's ceiling but that's tough to do in any circumstance, and esp so with johnny making 10 instead of 6.7. If all you care about, as some people seem to do, is having gaudreau on this team then I guess it's literally impossible to overpay him but in reality I don't think most johnny fans here are more about him than the Flames. You're being prisoners of the moment. Trust me though, just like with most big FA entering their 30s we'll all be happy we're not tied to Johnny until the dawn of the next decade, and sooner than you all think.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by SuperMatt18

What does Gaudreau get in a trade last offseason?

Probably a bit more than a Buchnevich or Reinhart. Which I'm sure some will scoff at, but their recent numbers weren't very different, and those 2 guys came in with more term at better AAVs.

Originally Posted by Lonestar

It's been discussed a lot on local and national outlets. The notion that UFAs don't know exactly who is interested and possess at least the framework of any potential deals until 12pm ET tomorrow is laughable. Gross has talked to other teams. There's no other explanation for 100 page contracts and tens of millions of dollars being accepted by central registry minutes after free-agency officially opens year after year.

Lots of middling players have permission to explore the market early. Those are the deals we see immediately. The superstars usually take several hours if not days.

And contracts are standard - there are only a few possible variables to worry about.

[JohnnyB]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

And Gross would have said no, and reminded Treliving of the only 5 teams he was allowed to speak to without a waiver.

What other signings? Mangiapane and Tkachuk? Treliving isn't allowed to sign other players yet and certainly wasn't allowed to talk to pending UFAs a month ago or even now.

Yeah, Gross could say no in the understanding that no further offers would be coming for his client, and Treliving could have started making plans, going into the draft ready to make moves. Five teams is also better than nothing.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Sec214

If Johnny walks it’s not because of money or lack of desire from the organization, fan base or anything alike. It’s 100% Johnny’s choice and where he and his wife wants to spend the rest of his career, raise their children ect. It’s no different from the rest of us.

Yeah I actually can’t imagine making a decision like this.

[Lonestar]

Originally Posted by Zoller

Don't they have from midnight to noon to strike a deal?

Not from what I've gathered from reading on/listening to the topic but I've absolutely been wrong before.

[Mathgod]

https://www.timeanddate.com/countdow...=cursive&csz=1

[Buff]

I have had a feeling all day that Johnny will sign. I had lunch and still have that feeling so we can rest easy. He's signing!

[SuperMatt18]

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

Yeah I actually can’t imagine making a decision like this.

And especially if the rumors are true and Gaudreau's wife is pregnant.

It's quite possible that they were happy to stay here and re-sign in Calgary, but having a kid on the way could change that completely.

Suddenly more pressure from the family to be closer to home.

You're more worried about what type of support system your wife and kid will have when you're on the road.

It really does change everything.

If I was an NHLer, my wife was pregnant with our first child, and I was a UFA then I'd probably be leaning towards signing with my childhood team and closer to home and my family as well. I could never sign in Edmonton but if Calgary was an option I would try to go there for sure, even if it was for a little less money.

[Heavy Jack]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1546944643186577408

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Lonestar

It's been discussed a lot on local and national outlets. The notion that UFAs don't know exactly who is interested and possess at least the framework of any potential deals until 12pm ET tomorrow is laughable. Gross has talked to other teams. There's no other explanation for 100 page contracts and tens of millions of dollars being accepted by central registry minutes after free-agency officially opens year after year.

NHL standard player contracts are 12 pages long. And they are all already drafted except for some blanks for amounts. They carry no addendums unless there are no trade clauses. There can be no deviation from them because it's a breach of the CBA.

https://edndr2nohos1v0p513541p71-wpe...22-reduced.pdf

The SPC is at page 310.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

Yeah, Gross could say no in the understanding that no further offers would be coming for his client, and Treliving could have started making plans, going into the draft ready to make moves. Five teams is also better than nothing.

What if the list is Edmonton, Tampa Bay, Colorado, Buffalo and Toronto.

[Fire]

I am kind of hoping they go the blow up route but I just don't think the Flames would be able to commit to a complete teardown.

Trade Markstrom, Tkachuk, Tanev, basically anyone with value they won't be around after a rebuild is done.

[Aarongavey]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Everyone agrees that Panarin was overpaid when he signed. I suspect most GM still think he is.

Is Draisaitl 75% as good as Gaudreau?

I think you are talking about the Draisaitl that was a RFA and signed for 8.25 million a year after a year where he averaged 0.94 PPG.

Johnny is a UFA coming off a season where he averaged 1.40 PPG. In Draisaitl’s contract year he scored at about 67% the rate Johnny did in his contract year, so ya having Draisaitl sign for about 75% of Johnny’s rate makes sense. I agree with you.

[Hot_Flatus]

Originally Posted by Heavy Jack

https://twitter.com/user/status/1546944643186577408

Holding out hope that he's suddenly going to change his tune and sign is a fools errand at this point. With all the media around this something would be out there by now that there are at least serious and meaningful discussions ongoing between both parties.

Honestly, if Treliving is still beating this drum and hasn't assessed the situation to be hopeless it would be equally as inexcusable from a management perspective.

[Lonestar]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

NHL standard player contracts are 12 pages long. And they are all already drafted except for some blanks for amounts. They carry no addendums unless there are no trade clauses. There can be no deviation from them because it's a breach of the CBA.

10-4 thanks for the info, although I still think there's some shenanigans that take place.

Salary breakdowns by year, NMC/NTC, signing bonuses. It seems like a lot to iron out in minutes. I have no inside knowledge, just parroting what guys in the business have alluded to and it makes sense.

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by littlereddevil

To be honest, as much as Philadelphia makes sense, they have no cap space to sign him. New Jersey are still years away from even making the playoffs.

With Gaudreau? Nah.

Hughes, Hisochier and Bratt took big leaps and posted near point-per-game numbers. A top four with a duo of Gaudreau-Hisochier and Hughes-Bratt being complemented by Tatar and Sharangovich is a solid top 6. Zacha scoots down to a more third line checking role, powerplay big body instead of being relied on as a top six winger. Holtz still waiting in the wing.

Hamilton and Severson get L. Hughes and Nemec in the next year or two to form a decent looking top four pushing Graves back down to a really good bottom pair with Smith.

It's their goalie situation that keeps them as a maybe, but if Blackwood hasn't been solved and can bounce back to 2019 level play, that's an easy playoff team with Gaudreau and a couple years from now from peaking. (Nemec, L. Hughes on ELC, Holtz, Smith on low level bridge contracts, other major players signed long-term).

Keep in mind that there's very few teams that could acquire a Hart level player and still remain terrible outside of massive budget constraints. The Devils are young, but they partially struggled because they rarely had the team firing on all cylinders. Their newly acquired 9M defenseman missed 20 games, their top line center on pace for almost 100 points missed half the season. Add Gaudreau and full season of those guys, along with the aging of their young core and top prospects expected to make the team and make noise in the next couple years, seems like an amazing destination for Gaudreau. Just whether he would still prefer to play for Philly.

[Textcritic]

Originally Posted by nik-

Yeah, you're gonna have to elaborate on that one.

This is a colossal asset management blunder. He gambled and lost.

Just read the thread. Numerous posters have already pointed out precisely why the options for both signing or moving Gaudreau last summer were almost non-existent. The right decision was always to negotiate in good faith in hopes of making a deal.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by Fire

I am kind of hoping they go the blow up route but I just don't think the Flames would be able to commit to a complete teardown.

Trade Markstrom, Tkachuk, Tanev, basically anyone with value they won't be around after a rebuild is done.

Why do people think a rebuild is the answer? It usually isn't.

[Racki]

Not that it matters, well maybe it does...I wonder if Sutter plays a role in this? Does Darryl make a phone call to help push this past the finish line? I feel like the Gaudreau family has a lot of respect for Darryl.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

Holding out hope that he's suddenly going to change his tune and sign is a fools errand at this point. With all the media around this something would be out there by now that there are at least serious and meaningful discussions ongoing between both parties.

Honestly, if Treliving is still beating this drum and hasn't assessed the situation to be hopeless it would be equally as inexcusable from a management perspective.

Change his tune? What’s his tune? We have no idea what is happening internally.