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Old 07-08-2022, 08:47 AM   #21
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Well you see....there is a system of economics in which a valuable asset, which in this case we'll call 'money' which is backed by the state, can be exchanged for goods or services.

You simply find the good or service that you require and if you have sufficient 'magic government paper' you can exchange it for that which you desire.
It’s extremely difficult to purchase a gun in Japan. Many stages of applications, background checks, and interviews. Take years. Which is probably why this guy made his own.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...olerance-japan
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Old 07-08-2022, 09:09 AM   #22
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Wow, that’s someone who really wanted him dead.

Hopefully just a Japanese guy, and no Chinese or Russian involvement. Otherwise things get messy.

I can't see Nation State involvement, the risk is pretty high. I mean especially since they caught the assassin alive.



Killing a former national leader is as act as war as it gets.



Russia would have no reason to do it, Just because Abe spoke out against Russia, Japan could do little to hurt Russia.


China wouldn't want to increase readiness against them by the bordering states.
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Old 07-08-2022, 09:15 AM   #23
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Yup, he was a member of Nippon Kaigi in Japan, a right-wing extremist group that has never been ashamed to share their nationalist views publicly including the denial of Japan's rape of Nanking, China. He had his fair share of enemies for those same beliefs, which included the desire for Japan to have the chains removed from them militarily so they can rise back up to the power they once were.

On a related note, I love Japan and have been there 6 times. Amazing food, wonderful people and endless unique neighborhoods to explore. Just don't stay at any hotels affiliated with APA - it supports the denial and refrabication of Japan's cruel history to the rest of Asia and is backed by hardcore nationalists like Abe.

https://www.ft.com/content/d35ec458-...c-f253db7791c6
The extremism in Japan is very concerning. They were downright fanatical in WWII, and trying to whitewash that is scary. Not sure I want to see Japan rearm itself then have internal warhawks try some ####. Every country has war hawks.
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Old 07-08-2022, 09:29 AM   #24
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I can't see Nation State involvement, the risk is pretty high. I mean especially since they caught the assassin alive.



Killing a former national leader is as act as war as it gets.



Russia would have no reason to do it, Just because Abe spoke out against Russia, Japan could do little to hurt Russia.


China wouldn't want to increase readiness against them by the bordering states.
Not only that, but Abe being killed seems more likely to make a martyr of him and empower the right wing movement.
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Old 07-08-2022, 10:07 AM   #25
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The extremism in Japan is very concerning. They were downright fanatical in WWII, and trying to whitewash that is scary. Not sure I want to see Japan rearm itself then have internal warhawks try some ####. Every country has war hawks.
Be that as it may, I would rather have a balance of power that favours Japan than one that favours China. Heck, the way things are trending, Japan might even be preferable to the USA.
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Old 07-08-2022, 10:23 AM   #26
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Be that as it may, I would rather have a balance of power that favours Japan than one that favours China. Heck, the way things are trending, Japan might even be preferable to the USA.
We can agree to disagree. The war crimes carried out by Japan are amongst the very worst, ever. Full stop. Most in the west just don't learn or even know about this because they are allies of the west and the Americans actively tried their best to keep the events on the down low in exchange for Japan to forever do their bidding. Look up Unit 731 and comfort women. The current people can't be blamed for what happened back then, but they can certainly be blamed for covering up and denying these things happened.
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Old 07-08-2022, 10:29 AM   #27
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Not denying that Japan was awful. So was Germany. A lot has changed since 1945.
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Old 07-08-2022, 10:34 AM   #28
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Not denying that Japan was awful. So was Germany. A lot has changed since 1945.
Difference is Germany completely owns their history and works hard to ensure it can never be repeated
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Old 07-08-2022, 10:39 AM   #29
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Sorry to hear, seemed like a nice person.
RIP

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Old 07-08-2022, 10:42 AM   #30
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I would rather an outcome that doesn't increase nationalism or militarism anywhere. Denial of atrocities on top of that is no small concern.
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Old 07-08-2022, 10:43 AM   #31
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I'm going to be rude about this and say this isn't a guy I'm going to miss. I mean I don't think it was okay to shoot him or anything of course, but it happened, they caught the one who did it, and I'm going to decide to not feel bad about this happening.

I also wouldn't worry too much about martyrdom. That tends to be more of a thing on the left than on the right.
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Old 07-08-2022, 10:51 AM   #32
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We can agree to disagree. The war crimes carried out by Japan are amongst the very worst, ever. Full stop. Most in the west just don't learn or even know about this because they are allies of the west and the Americans actively tried their best to keep the events on the down low in exchange for Japan to forever do their bidding. Look up Unit 731 and comfort women. The current people can't be blamed for what happened back then, but they can certainly be blamed for covering up and denying these things happened.
The crimes are, of course, awful. But in addition to that, what is sometimes lost on people is the sheer aggressiveness of their national policy/direction for the entire first half of the century. Their entire culture and identity was focused solely on becoming a great power. It was mass production of warships and warplanes, and marching into any country they laid eyes on. It was staggering.

I have absolutely zero concern with Germany ever becoming aggressive again because they came to terms with their past, and actively take steps to prevent extremists from rising up again. Japan actively denies their past, so if they rearmed, I would be more than a little concerned that they would start "liberating" their Asian neighbors.
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Old 07-08-2022, 11:01 AM   #33
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I also wouldn't worry too much about martyrdom. That tends to be more of a thing on the left than on the right.
Tough for either the media or political opposition to be hard on a former PM and his views when he has just been murdered. There will likely be a lot more celebration of him and his accomplishments now than there would have been, and much less critique. That will be taken advantage of in an election and beyond.
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Old 07-08-2022, 11:07 AM   #34
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I also wouldn't worry too much about martyrdom. That tends to be more of a thing on the left than on the right.
Not in Japan. There is a good history of this with right wing activism wanting to return Japan to military power, bushido, conservative ways, celebrating WWII shrines, denying war crimes, etc.

One 17 year old stabbed a socialist leader on TV (Pulitzer winning photo as well) and then hung himself in prison . Another very famous intellectual championed a return to the samurai spirit of Japan, stormed an office, and committed seppuku as an embodiment of the classic ideals.
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Old 07-08-2022, 11:24 AM   #35
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The crimes are, of course, awful. But in addition to that, what is sometimes lost on people is the sheer aggressiveness of their national policy/direction for the entire first half of the century. Their entire culture and identity was focused solely on becoming a great power. It was mass production of warships and warplanes, and marching into any country they laid eyes on. It was staggering.

I have absolutely zero concern with Germany ever becoming aggressive again because they came to terms with their past, and actively take steps to prevent extremists from rising up again. Japan actively denies their past, so if they rearmed, I would be more than a little concerned that they would start "liberating" their Asian neighbors.
Yup, great post and I agree with your opinion 100%. A lot is the way in which they did things and their pursuit of being an aggressive power in Asia. A lot is said about China and even N. Korea in the west, but if Japan were allowed to rearm, I'd be very concerned for my family and friends in Asia - not because of what they did in the past, but because current leadership in Japan supports a return to that.
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Old 07-08-2022, 11:42 AM   #36
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I also wouldn't worry too much about martyrdom. That tends to be more of a thing on the left than on the right.

Cut to a clip of modern day rallies in the U.S. with dudes dressed in SS uniforms with uncle Adolf getting his salutes.
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Old 07-08-2022, 11:49 AM   #37
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From PM Kishida
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“We lost a great leader who loved the nation, looked to the future and made great achievements in various fields for the future of this country.”
From Rham Emmanuel, US Ambassador to Japan
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“I, along with all Americans, am deeply saddened by the news that former Prime Minister Abe Shinzo has passed away,”

“A Japanese statesman. A world leader. A friend of America. The clarity of his voice will be truly missed.

“The United States has lost a trusted partner and an outspoken advocate for our shared ideals.”
https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/20...nara-shooting/
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Old 07-08-2022, 11:59 AM   #38
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Mario!

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Old 07-08-2022, 12:30 PM   #39
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The crimes are, of course, awful. But in addition to that, what is sometimes lost on people is the sheer aggressiveness of their national policy/direction for the entire first half of the century. Their entire culture and identity was focused solely on becoming a great power. It was mass production of warships and warplanes, and marching into any country they laid eyes on. It was staggering.

I have absolutely zero concern with Germany ever becoming aggressive again because they came to terms with their past, and actively take steps to prevent extremists from rising up again. Japan actively denies their past, so if they rearmed, I would be more than a little concerned that they would start "liberating" their Asian neighbors.
It's not a time where you can just do immediately to turn yourself into some kind of powerful military from having basically no uber military at this point in time. We are well past the time where you can just roll up with a zillion guys and have a good army.

They are also a rapidly aging population and shrinking population as it is. If they just throw a bunch of people into an army and lost a bunch of them - their problems gets worse.

And yes - they should admit to what they did, but in the grand scheme of things - it doesn't matter that much. As we've seen in the US - it doesn't take a heck of a lot for people to decide that something they've always valued (fair democratic elections) to something they don't care about.
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Old 07-08-2022, 12:55 PM   #40
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It's not a time where you can just do immediately to turn yourself into some kind of powerful military from having basically no uber military at this point in time. We are well past the time where you can just roll up with a zillion guys and have a good army.

They are also a rapidly aging population and shrinking population as it is. If they just throw a bunch of people into an army and lost a bunch of them - their problems gets worse.

And yes - they should admit to what they did, but in the grand scheme of things - it doesn't matter that much. As we've seen in the US - it doesn't take a heck of a lot for people to decide that something they've always valued (fair democratic elections) to something they don't care about.
Really? I would say that what people believe to be true about history is really important in the grand scheme of things. The divisions in the US between people who believe Biden won the election vs those who believe Trump won is a prime example. People having different beliefs about what took place has the potential to result in outcomes as different as those between a peaceful transfer of power or the overthrow of a government.
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