Matthew Tkachuk & Johnny Gaudreau Signing Watch Thread - Page 297 - Calgarypuck Forums - The Unofficial Calgary Flames Fan Community

djsFlames · 07-07-2022, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cole436

Well, that doesn’t sound great.

Huh? Sounds about exactly right at this juncture. No surprises in that statement.

Take off your boo-hoo glasses.

Hot_Flatus · 07-07-2022, 10:47 AM

^^Lanny's post.

I agree. Allowing the team to get to this point where the entire competitive future is essentially a high stakes poker game where the team is short stacked is just brutal asset management as you say.

He might get lucky in the end, but the odds are increasingly in both players favor as this drags on. Worst yet, this may play out where he is forced to sell his soul to keep both at untenable AAVs simply to salvage the situation.

Is that worse than seeing both leave for nothing or pennies on the dollar? Hard to call.

AltaGuy · 07-07-2022, 10:47 AM

I'd prefer to trade Tkachuk for futures and I would use the extra to give Gaudreau more money. I don't see Tkachuk as very important for the franchise.

blankall · 07-07-2022, 10:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

Sure, but the fact there has been no discussion on the initial offer tells you a lot. Someone committed to staying would probably be working hard over the last month hammering out terms that work for both sides so that they are happy and they are sure that the team can remain competitive.

We can all hope this is a case of him simply wanting to see what's out there like Stamkos or Landeskog(?) but those cases are pretty few and far between.

This isn't how negotiations are going to work. The Gaudreau camp will hold their cards tight to squeeze out what they can. $9.5 x 8 is on the table....they probably want $10.5 x 8. The longer things go on the, the more likely the Flames are to up their offer.

The silence could be promising, as it shows that Gaudreau is intent on the Flames and trying to squeeze out more. However, this all could be just a ruse for Gaudreau to use as leverage in negotiations with other teams. $9.5 x 8 couldn't get it done for the Flames....so you'd better offer more.

GioforPM · 07-07-2022, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

Why would they do that? The GM is trying to squeeze value and has now lost the battle by not getting a deal done ahead of time. Their best option now is to test the market (Gaudreau) and/or wait until the other signs or walks (Tkachuk).

I have never been his biggest fan, but at this point, if Treliving pulls this off and retains both players long term, I will be seriously impressed because it's looking very grim at this point.

why would that be? the biggest money is still from Calgary.

I read this as Treliving using what public pressure he can legitimately use to get a response. He's basically saying they need to come back with a counter. Or a "no, please improve your offer".

You see this all the time from player agents. "We put our request in but haven't heard back". It's an attempt to put the other side into the bad guy role.

GioforPM · 07-07-2022, 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hot_Flatus

^^Lanny's post.

I agree. Allowing the team to get to this point where the entire competitive future is essentially a high stakes poker game where the team is short stacked is just brutal asset management as you say.

He might get lucky in the end, but the odds are increasingly in both players favor as this drags on. Worst yet, this may play out where he is forced to sell his soul to keep both at untenable AAVs simply to salvage the situation.

Is that worse than seeing both leave for nothing or pennies on the dollar? Hard to call.

The only time that he could trade JG was prior to the LNTC kicking in and that was a looong time ago. Coming off a bad season, with JG's production over two season being pretty low. The return would have been crappy for a player with his ability. I suspect he quietly asked around and didn't like the return. Once that deadline passed, no point in any trade.

Flabbibulin · 07-07-2022, 10:54 AM

How great would it be if we were all just being played and a deal is announced tonight or in the morning, followed by Gaudreau being in the parade.

Jiri Hrdina · 07-07-2022, 10:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flabbibulin

How great would it be if we were all just being played and a deal is announced tonight or in the morning, followed by Gaudreau being in the parade.

Gary: "We have a trade to announce. The Calgary Flames have acquired the 18th overall pick in exchange for ???"

BT: "And now to make our first pick in the 2022 draft, please welcome Johnny Gaudreau and Matthew Tkachuk to the stage who have both just inked new 8 year deals with our club".

That would be neat.

Lanny_McDonald · 07-07-2022, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flabbibulin

How great would it be if we were all just being played and a deal is announced tonight or in the morning, followed by Gaudreau being in the parade.

That would be the best thing we could imagine. Hope it happens.

Flabbibulin · 07-07-2022, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Gary: "We have a trade to announce. The Calgary Flames have acquired the 18th overall pick in exchange for ???"

BT: "And now to make our first pick in the 2022 draft, please welcome Johnny Gaudreau and Matthew Tkachuk to the stage who have both just inked new 8 year deals with our club".

That would be neat.

Kevin Costner pulled off this type of sorcery in Draft Day.

Johnny Makarov · 07-07-2022, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flabbibulin

How great would it be if we were all just being played and a deal is announced tonight or in the morning, followed by Gaudreau being in the parade.

and at a parade where you don't risk getting shot at. Stay in a 1st world country Johnny!

Johnny Makarov · 07-07-2022, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flabbibulin

Kevin Costner pulled off this type of sorcery in Draft Day.

haha i just watched that like a month ago. It was pretty terrible though..

GKDarts · 07-07-2022, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bingo

So which way are you going?

They didn't understand?
They ignored it?

Neither make any sense.

Do you think Treliving just went rogue?

You just love the negative drama so much ...

The management group talked to Gaudreau through last summer and didn't get a deal done. They would have kept the ownership group apprised at all times on how those talks were going. Ultimately the ownership group would have signed off on the plan to let it ride, and they did.

There's nothing new today. There's no realization of having painted themselves into a corner without knowing it.

If anything the season went better than expected with winning a division and a playoff series, so if they were comfortable going for it last summer they are likely prepared for whatever happens now.

It comes down to a colossal bungling and asset mismanagement. A GM and ownership cannot find itself in the position that the Flames are in. The conversation prior to the draft last year (Or even 2021 trade deadline) should ultimately have been.... Johnny, here is our best long-term deal. If you don't sign it we will trade you before your limited NTC kicks in. If he didn't sign, you follow through and get value for the asset when you have some leverage.

Treliving should be fired for putting the club into this situation, regardless of the outcome. It's inexcusable to lose all leverage and risk losing the crown jewel for nothing. Its how mediocre/poorly run teams remain mediocre.

SuperMatt18 · 07-07-2022, 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GKDarts

Treliving should be fired for putting the club into this situation, regardless of the outcome. It's inexcusable to lose all leverage and risk losing the crown jewel for nothing. Its how mediocre/poorly run teams remain mediocre.

The last three cup champions have had the exact same situation play out, with the player re-signing coming right down to the last minute.

Tampa Bay with Stamkos.

Colorado with Landeskog.

The Islanders did it with Tavares too, and actually lost him - and then made the 2nd round, Conference Finals, and Conference finals in three successive seasons.

I think there is an argument to be made that any chance of keeping Gaudreau is probably worth more than the couple of picks they could have got for him as a rental would have been.

nfotiu · 07-07-2022, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bingo

If anything the season went better than expected with winning a division and a playoff series, so if they were comfortable going for it last summer they are likely prepared for whatever happens now.

I agree with this. This was probably the 4th or 5th best Calgary Flames season out of about 40 and with a little good fortune could have been higher. Even with 20/20 hindsight it was worth hanging on to Johnny to experience this season as a fan vs what the season would have looked like without Johnny and whatever return we got for a year or two of him.

Lanny_McDonald · 07-07-2022, 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scroopy Noopers

It would be nice if at least one of the two of them got back to Treliving with some idea of their intentions before the draft starts….

Treliving:

Ugh. That is not a great statement. Pretty much admits he has no plan or willingness to explore all options.

SuperMatt18 · 07-07-2022, 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Ugh. That is not a great statement. Pretty much admits he has no plan or willingness to explore all options.

Not really.

It's media talk. All he can do at this point is say how much he wants to keep the players. He can't really talk about exploring trade options for them publicly while trying to re-sign them (more in regards to Tkachuk)

I'm sure they have all options mapped out behind the scenes.

VilleN · 07-07-2022, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Ugh. That is not a great statement. Pretty much admits he has no plan or willingness to explore all options.

Uhhh no, no it doesn't. He's simply told you his top priority - which is a completely obvious statement.

Roof-Daddy · 07-07-2022, 11:16 AM

I'd imagine neither Gaudreau or Tkachuk want to stay in Calgary unless the other one stays, and then they look at the cap situation and realize it's going be hard for them both to stay, get paid market value, and then still have a decent team around them.

I mean, if rumors earlier were true that Gaudreau's camp wants another reliable puck carrier added, he's probably thinking there is no way the Flames can afford to add one, keep him, keep Tkachuk and not have the rest of the roster crumble around him.

KootenayFlamesFan · 07-07-2022, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanny_McDonald

Ugh. That is not a great statement. Pretty much admits he has no plan or willingness to explore all options.

Not sure you can come to a conclusion about anything from a statement like that. Basically just saying they're still trying to sign both. I'm sure they have a Plan B and C.