Matthew Tkachuk & Johnny Gaudreau Signing Watch Thread

[TOfan]

Originally Posted by Royle9

If Johnny walks and this team doesn't rebuild it would the the most Calgary Flames thing to happen since well.. the Calgary Flames.

What an absolute dumpster fire this would cause, similar to Iginla going for nothing because this Franchise held on to him for too long and didn't do enough around him during the prime years.

If Johnny walks you absolutely have to deal Tkachuk for A+ prospects and top picks in the draft and rebuild from there. Something like Tkachuk to NJD for 2OA + Holtz or Mercer + perhaps Ty Smith maybe.

I think you then try and avoid any big UFA's unless you can somehow convince Forsberg to come over to team Sweden and re-build on the fly between this draft and the next. I would look to unload Tanev and other depth guys at the deadline for more picks and hope we get a top 3 pick in 2023.

I would argue that NOBODY is untradeable if Johnny walks.

Now the GOLDEN question is: Will the Flames do this? Highly unlikely, as we've seen time and time again they refuse to go full rebuild the proper way which is why we've been stuck in this mediocrity train for what feels like eternity.

But if Johnny does walk (god help us) this team needs to thank Sutter for his time (cant seem him wanting to coach a rebuild) and do the right thing and start over.
This is why the Flames need to know his intentions before Thursday.
We simply cannot go into the draft 2 days from now and have both Johnny and Mathew as question marks on the roster sheet for next year. It would be the absolute worst thing we could do and based on everything being said to date including this morning with quite a few "insiderrrrs" it sounds like Johnny has no intentions to rush anything and wants to hear what's out there.

I’m not sure there is a ‘proper’ way to rebuild.

[howard_the_duck]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

I wonder if Tkachuk would look at it and say "well this is my team now, i'm the guy" and maybe relish that opportunity?

If Johnny leaves I think the Flames double down on focusing on Tkachuk as the central figure on this team and they build around him. All assuming he wants to stay long-term. Which is clarity they need to get this summer.

That’s the scenario I see playing out. Tkachuk has an ego, thinks he can be the guy, and wants to be paid/regarded as such, is my hunch.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I’m not sure there is a ‘proper’ way to rebuild.

Whatever it is, it involves a lot of luck with timing.

[Duffalufagus]

Originally Posted by Bingo

Not sure it's in Gaudreau's best interest to close the door with the Flames prior to free agency. You never know how it will pan out, no point in closing off options.

They could be close, they may be timing an announcement. Or the Flames may have been told that he intends to test free agency but will circle back.

I'd doubt very much they know for certain he's not staying in Calgary.

Agree. How can he know without seeing what the offers out there look like?

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

I think a lot of the NJD discussions hinge on what they do with Bratt.

I don’t see the incentive for NJ to grab Tkachuk. The more you think about it the more it doesn’t make sense:

A) NJ can easily take Slafkovsky or Nemec at #2, both are future needs
B) They likely pursue Gaudreau and/or using $’s for a goalie, which is at no draft capital cost

If the Flames are trading Tkachuk, it would make sense to do it with either Arizona (Keller and father connection) or Ottawa (brother connection). Plus, both teams have a top 10 pick in the draft and can add to it. Or, the Flames can make a hockey trade with St. Louis if we can get Kyrou or Thomas in return. Lots of routes but I think it’s more likely the Devils land Gaudreau than Tkachuk based on cost.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Duffalufagus

Agree. How can he know without seeing what the offers out there look like?

The risk is indeed that if he waits until then the Flames start to move on to plan B. That's what happened to Freeman and the Braves and he regrets it now.

[Royle9]

Originally Posted by TOfan

I’m not sure there is a ‘proper’ way to rebuild.

You're not wrong, but mostly when I say proper I refer to the following:

1. Good timing (see next years draft)
2. Not signing horrible UFA contracts - Kadri's next one for example
3. Moving any player you can for favorable returns
4. Growing your prospect base and graduating players who deserve it - Jacob P for example

There's obviously a lot to it, but you have to start there.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by ForeverFlameFan

I don’t see the incentive for NJ to grab Tkachuk. The more you think about it the more it doesn’t make sense:

A) NJ can easily take Slafkovsky or Nemec at #2, both are future needs
B) They likely pursue Gaudreau and/or using $’s for a goalie, which is at no draft capital cost

If the Flames are trading Tkachuk, it would make sense to do it with either Arizona (Keller and father connection) or Ottawa (brother connection). Plus, both teams have a top 10 pick in the draft and can add to it. Or, the Flames can make a hockey trade with St. Louis if we can get Kyrou or Thomas in return. Lots of routes but I think it’s more likely the Devils land Gaudreau than Tkachuk based on cost.

No I was talking about their plans to get Gaudreau. I’m not sure they can afford what Bratt wants and what Gaudreau wants.

[NewFan]

I think Johnny will sign here for 8 years with full protection. And he will play 2-3 years with Flames and if the team fails he will ask a trade to the team he chooses.
Anyway Flames really need to try to build a real contender team.
Needs to find/draft elite C, elite D and a good G. This team failed to find elite C many years and those ones really hard to find. I hope BT and whole management team should try everything to find upcoming young Cs and Ds in all cost.

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

I wonder if Tkachuk would look at it and say "well this is my team now, i'm the guy" and maybe relish that opportunity?

If Johnny leaves I think the Flames double down on focusing on Tkachuk as the central figure on this team and they build around him. All assuming he wants to stay long-term. Which is clarity they need to get this summer.

While I am just fine with that happening, I also don’t want Tkachuk struggling out the gate and now we are stuck with a long term contract and it actually turned out that Johnny was the reason Tkachuk hit 100 points. We will have to rely on Mangiapane to be a first line winger if that’s the case.

[nickerjones]

Originally Posted by Jiri Hrdina

Someone give Johnny Freddie Freeman's phone number!

Exactly. I spoke of this situation earlier in the thread. I guess it now comes down to what are his hockey motivations. Does he want to win? If so, what other team that can afford 10 million/year has a window in the next 4 years or so that is better than the Flames?

I dont think there is that many of those teams.

Does he want to cement a legacy and be remembered forever? I firmly believe if he comes back to Calgary he will be immortalized in Flames lore forever. If he goes to say Philly or NY or even Detroit, he is just going to be another good hockey player that played there for a while.

But maybe it is all about being close to family back home and raising kids around that family atmosphere. If it is, I totally get and respect that. However as an American that moved to Canada ..... There isn't much you could do to get me to move back to the States and raise my family right now.

Maybe 8 years/11.5 million would do it

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by NewFan

I think Johnny will sign here for 8 years with full protection. And he will play 2-3 years with Flames and if the team fails he will ask a trade to the team he chooses.
Anyway Flames really need to try to build a real contender team.
Needs to find/draft elite C, elite D and a good G. This team failed to find elite C many years and those ones really hard to find. I hope BT and whole management team should try everything to find upcoming young Cs and Ds in all cost.

It sounds weird but that really is the best strategy for JG: sign an 8 year contract with Calgary for the most money (which no team can match), play with a good team for a few years, and then be snapped up by an eastern team because the AAV will be better than other similar players by then.

[Royle9]

I just feel like if he really wanted to be a Flame and legacy was important to him (more so than being close to Family) he would have signed already.

Every day this goes on, I think the chance he signs goes down.
Right now I'd say 60/40 or maybe even 70/30 in favor of him leaving.

Hope I'm wrong.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Royle9

I just feel like if he really wanted to be a Flame and legacy was important to him (more so than being close to Family) he would have signed already.

Every day this goes on, I think the chance he signs goes down.
Right now I'd say 60/40 or maybe even 70/30 in favor of him leaving.

Hope I'm wrong.

Why? The earlier he signs the more $$ he leaves on the table. He may have full intentions on signing and may have gotten an offer he can live with but why not see if he can get a half million more per year? You can buy a fair number of airline tickets with that money.

[Flame On]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

It sounds weird but that really is the best strategy for JG: sign an 8 year contract with Calgary for the most money (which no team can match), play with a good team for a few years, and then be snapped up by an eastern team because the AAV will be better than other similar players by then.

Yeah like why can't they have a sort of unsaid, gentleman's agreement, where he signs with the Flames but they agree (maybe even with no trade clause control) to move him in a couple/few years? Sort of a longer term sign-and-trade?

[OptimalTates]

Originally Posted by Flame On

Yeah like why can't they have a sort of unsaid, gentleman's agreement, where he signs with the Flames but they agree (maybe even with no trade clause control) to move him in a couple/few years? Sort of a longer term sign-and-trade?

I don't think they even need a gentleman's agreement. Luongo had a "trade me now clause" in his contract didn't he? It was very unique but not sure if they changed rules around it.

[OptimalTates]

Hmm, maybe misunderstanding: https://www.nucksmisconduct.com/2009...ongos-contract

A misunderstanding regarding Luongo is the "out clause" in his 12-year contract extension.
No such clause exists.

What Luongo has after five years is the right to ask for a trade. But the Canucks are under no obligation to grant one. If they do not, the team loses its option to trade him later in the contract.

[OptimalTates]

If I ask for a trade and you don't trade me then you can't trade me has to be a weird ass clause though lol.

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by The Cobra

Whatever it is, it involves a lot of luck with timing.

I always think about if Edmontons three 1OA’s in a row were three years prior.
Kane, Stamkos, Tavares…

[Scroopy Noopers]

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

I don't think they even need a gentleman's agreement. Luongo had a "trade me now clause" in his contract didn't he? It was very unique but not sure if they changed rules around it.

Originally Posted by OptimalTates

Hmm, maybe misunderstanding: https://www.nucksmisconduct.com/2009...ongos-contract

Whoa this is brand new information to me. Cool.