[Trade] Fiala to Los Angeles for 2022 1st round pick + Brock Faber

[AT77]

Originally Posted by dino7c

28 goals in 52 games last season, 7th in the NHL
and then 14 points in 22 playoff games

12 seasons in his career and only 1 30 goal season, 2 if you count the 28 goals in 52 games two seasons ago now with Montreal and consider it over an 82 game pace. Last season was 20 goals in 74 games split with Montreal and Calgary. You keep mentioning his 28 goals in 52 games every time I talk about Toffoli like he does that every season lol. That was literally one season, and as I mentioned earlier, one 31 goal season...7 years ago lmao. He has a whopping 193 goals in 651 career games, damn what a sniper eh? Ovechkin better watch out, or Toffoli might break Gretzky's record goal record first! That's 24 goals over an 82 games average in his career. How that translates to a "pure goal scorer" that he's been labelled as is beyond me. The only reason I can think of why he's considered that is because he sucks at everything else even more than scoring goals.

I can tell you're one of those homer fans that simply cannot criticize anything the Flames do as negative or wrong, such as the Toffoli trade, and think everything they do is right. He ####ing sucks man, just accept and admit it. Nice try though, I'll give you an A for effort just to keep your spirits and hopes up.

[cam_wmh]

Have you considered, debating your points with unbridled, gratuitous, hyperbole?

Originally Posted by AT77

12 seasons in his career and only 1 30 goal season, 2 if you count the 28 goals in 52 games two seasons ago now with Montreal and consider it over an 82 game pace. Last season was 20 goals in 74 games split with Montreal and Calgary. You keep mentioning his 28 goals in 52 games every time I talk about Toffoli like he does that every season lol. That was literally one season, and as I mentioned earlier, one 31 goal season...7 years ago lmao. He has a whopping 193 goals in 651 career games, damn what a sniper eh? Ovechkin better watch out, or Toffoli might break Gretzky's record goal record first! That's 24 goals over an 82 games average in his career. How that translates to a "pure goal scorer" that he's been labelled as is beyond me. The only reason I can think of why he's considered that is because he sucks at everything else even more than scoring goals.

I can tell you're one of those homer fans that simply cannot criticize anything the Flames do as negative or wrong, such as the Toffoli trade, and think everything they do is right. He ####ing sucks man, just accept and admit it. Nice try though, I'll give you an A for effort just to keep your spirits and hopes up.

oh good.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by AT77

12 seasons in his career and only 1 30 goal season, 2 if you count the 28 goals in 52 games two seasons ago now with Montreal and consider it over an 82 game pace. Last season was 20 goals in 74 games split with Montreal and Calgary. You keep mentioning his 28 goals in 52 games every time I talk about Toffoli like he does that every season lol. That was literally one season, and as I mentioned earlier, one 31 goal season...7 years ago lmao. He has a whopping 193 goals in 651 career games, damn what a sniper eh? Ovechkin better watch out, or Toffoli might break Gretzky's record goal record first! That's 24 goals over an 82 games average in his career. How that translates to a "pure goal scorer" that he's been labelled as is beyond me. The only reason I can think of why he's considered that is because he sucks at everything else even more than scoring goals.

I can tell you're one of those homer fans that simply cannot criticize anything the Flames do as negative or wrong, such as the Toffoli trade, and think everything they do is right. He ####ing sucks man, just accept and admit it. Nice try though, I'll give you an A for effort just to keep your spirits and hopes up.

So let me get this straight. Because he's not Ovechkin, he sucks? A player who scored 28 in 52 the last year before being traded, and 193 in his career, is simply useless? And anyone who finds any use in him at all is a blind Flames homer, including the GMs who traded for him previously? Good to know.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by AT77

12 seasons in his career and only 1 30 goal season, 2 if you count the 28 goals in 52 games two seasons ago now with Montreal and consider it over an 82 game pace. Last season was 20 goals in 74 games split with Montreal and Calgary. You keep mentioning his 28 goals in 52 games every time I talk about Toffoli like he does that every season lol. That was literally one season, and as I mentioned earlier, one 31 goal season...7 years ago lmao. He has a whopping 193 goals in 651 career games, damn what a sniper eh? Ovechkin better watch out, or Toffoli might break Gretzky's record goal record first! That's 24 goals over an 82 games average in his career. How that translates to a "pure goal scorer" that he's been labelled as is beyond me. The only reason I can think of why he's considered that is because he sucks at everything else even more than scoring goals.

I can tell you're one of those homer fans that simply cannot criticize anything the Flames do as negative or wrong, such as the Toffoli trade, and think everything they do is right. He ####ing sucks man, just accept and admit it. Nice try though, I'll give you an A for effort just to keep your spirits and hopes up.

I agree with you that he is massively overrated however I would say he is a solid / very good 3rd liner but maybe a middling to iffy 2nd liner. He was incredibly disappointing over his Calgary tenure and anyone arguing the alternative is being disengenuous.

Toffoli’s problem is conditioning and overall laziness (as usual, like most people that get paid big NHL contracts). Toffoli just isn’t interested in putting forth the CONSISTENT work ethic needed over a season. 82 games, Toffoli will come to work about 1/4 of them. Because his talent level is insane, he gets away with it. It’s pretty obvious he’s just one of those guys that won’t compete when you need them to.

[Mr.Coffee]

Originally Posted by Jay Random

So let me get this straight. Because he's not Ovechkin, he sucks? A player who scored 28 in 52 the last year before being traded, and 193 in his career, is simply useless? And anyone who finds any use in him at all is a blind Flames homer, including the GMs who traded for him previously? Good to know.

He does kinda suck for the acquisition cost.

Sorry, just true. You need more from those picks than the stats you’re trotting out if you wanna win.

[Jay Random]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

He does kinda suck for the acquisition cost.

That wasn't the argument being made, though, was it? Apparently we're supposed to believe he is no use at all.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by Mr.Coffee

I agree with you that he is massively overrated however I would say he is a solid / very good 3rd liner but maybe a middling to iffy 2nd liner. He was incredibly disappointing over his Calgary tenure and anyone arguing the alternative is being disengenuous.

Toffoli’s problem is conditioning and overall laziness (as usual, like most people that get paid big NHL contracts). Toffoli just isn’t interested in putting forth the CONSISTENT work ethic needed over a season. 82 games, Toffoli will come to work about 1/4 of them. Because his talent level is insane, he gets away with it. It’s pretty obvious he’s just one of those guys that won’t compete when you need them to.

Toffoli and Jarnkrok turned out to be massive failure by Treliving. It’s not even debatable. You can argue that he had to make some deals to go for it but that’s about it. Now shut up or you get labeled as being negative. It’s never a Flames fault.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Toffoli and Jarnkrok turned out to be massive failure by Treliving. It’s not even debatable. You can argue that he had to make some deals to go for it but that’s about it. Now shut up or you get labeled as being negative. It’s never a Flames fault.

Labeled as negative?
Surely you must have some level of self awareness to see that you ARE negative

For instance you chose to make the point in this thread that BT gave up must as much for Toffoli which is off-topic, and a poor comparison given one was acquired at the deadline and the other in the off-season.

That's the type of unnecessary negativity you bring to every thread.

So yeah. Wear the label man. It is earned.

[transplant99]

Toffoli is a 25G 50pt winger who plays both ends of the ice effectively and costs 4.25 a year.

And people are whining about HIM?

Wut?

[Burning Beard]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Toffoli is a 25G 50pt winger who plays both ends of the ice effectively and costs 4.25 a year.

And people are whining about HIM?

Wut?

It's what people on here do. Most days it's a negativity contest on here.

[CalgaryFan1988]

I can appreciate the disappointment in Toffoli in the last month of the season and playoffs, but he is a Sutter player and was lights out in Montreal the previous season.

Always easy to play hindsight armchair GM.

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Toffoli and Jarnkrok turned out to be massive failure by Treliving. It’s not even debatable. You can argue that he had to make some deals to go for it but that’s about it. Now shut up or you get labeled as being negative. It’s never a Flames fault.

I see Toffoli and Jarnkrok as being massive failures by Toffoli and Jarnrock.

There was no logical reason to expect them to play as poor as they did, IMO.

It's on them.

[Jiri Hrdina]

Toffoli generated a ton of chances against Dallas, just didn't finish.
Similarly I thought Jarnkrok was generally good except for the total lack of produciton.

But yeah at some point the GM brings in players and they are the ones that have to perform.

Not everything is the GM's fault.

[PepsiFree]

Why we’re talking about them, I don’t know, but both Toffoli and Jarnkrok were fine, just unlucky. Jarnkrok’s was less noticeable because his game was really great away from the puck and that’s what he was brought in for, while Toffoli was brought in for offense and just didn’t contribute much of it even if the rest of his game was sound.

Criticism of Toffoli is fair, but usually seems hyperbolic. Criticism of Jarnkrok makes no sense to me. Either you didn’t watch any games or your expectations of him were wildly inconsistent with any possible reality.

But you know… something something Fiala.

[EldrickOnIce]

If you were to have made a list of quality available players at last year's deadline Toffoli and Jarnkrok would have been near top of list. Flames acquired both. Both sucked. It happens
The alternative was to do nothing, which was not an option.

[Macho0978]

Originally Posted by EldrickOnIce

If you were to have made a list of quality available players at last year's deadline Toffoli and Jarnkrok would have been near top of list. Flames acquired both. Both sucked. It happens
The alternative was to do nothing, which was not an option.

And Toffolli has 2 years left at 4.25 mil. When free agent frenzy starts and similar players get $6 mil or more we will be ok having Toffolli. Lots of players of his caliber struggling on new teams post trade deadline. Let’s give him next year before we say he sucks

[Sidney Crosby's Hat]

Originally Posted by jay random

by way of comparison, does anybody have a jfresh card for toffoli? I'd like to have some data other than ‘y'all, he ####ing sucks’.

https://twitter.com/user/status/1493279689103880195

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by Macho0978

And Toffolli has 2 years left at 4.25 mil. When free agent frenzy starts and similar players get $6 mil or more we will be ok having Toffolli. Lots of players of his caliber struggling on new teams post trade deadline. Let’s give him next year before we say he sucks

Yeah the saving grace is that his contract is decent for the goal production he can provide. My major beef with the acquisition is that his skating is so bad and this is a team that needs to get faster not slower. Also it seems like they really didn't take a good look at where he was going to fit on their roster as the coach didn't play him top 6 and he's one of those players where you aren't going to get value out of him in a bottom 6 role.

[ricardodw]

Clear and simple Tofolli has become a cheaper Mangiapane replacement in the top 6.


Mangiapane has been undervalued at each step in his contract dealings with the Flames and is likely looking at getting paid far more to stay in Calgary than the Flames have in their cap if they keep Gaudreau and Tkachuk.

The Flames have played hard ball on contracts with him (first non-elc contract was a 2-way with 70K in minors) In a very similar situation the Flames gave Dube a 3x 2.3 M rather than a $715K/70K slap in the face they gave Mangiapane.

The Flames likely don't want to take a chance with their tight cap letting Mangiapane go to arbitration.

[ricardodw]

Back on topic. The Athletic has Corey Pronman, Dom Luszczyszyn and Sean Gentille all liking what the trade does for LA.

NHL trade grades: Wild send Kevin Fiala to Kings for first-round pick and a prospect

I found the sub-text of the article setting up that the Pacific might have 4 teams that might be contenders.