Matthew Tkachuk & Johnny Gaudreau Signing Watch Thread

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

Can you give an example?

Sure, John Tavares.

[The Fonz]

Originally Posted by dissentowner

Sure, John Tavares.

The NYI were 7th in their division and sellers at the trade deadline. Tavares strongly implied he were re-signing, otherwise he’d have been dealt to a contender and would have net a massive return. He lied to management about his UFA intentions - burnt them on his way out.

The Flames were 1st in their division and widely agreed to be a cup contender. Whether Gaudreau were re-signing in Calgary or not was irrelevant - he was absolutely not being dealt either way.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

That's just it, if Tre makes him a great offer and he chooses to walk away, it's clearly about something other than money. Given how much he has expressed a desire to stay, if he walks despite the team doing all it can on their end I would be quite disappointed. It would tarnish the shine on feelings about cheering for him. That's all.

No, if we are losing Johnny, I would blame Treliving 100%
He lost the negotiation.

He can make it up depending on what he’d with Johnny’s money but that’s his only redemption

[Eric Vail]

I'm starting to remember what it was like being an Expos fan in 1994.

[JohnnyB]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

No, if we are losing Johnny, I would blame Treliving 100%
He lost the negotiation.

He can make it up depending on what he’d with Johnny’s money but that’s his only redemption

Uh, how I feel about things is pretty much up to me. Not really something to say 'No' to.

Anyways, I agree that Tre would deserve blame for mismanaging the situation, but that's a separate issue from how I would view Johnny's choices.

I don't even really care that much, but I will certainly feel better about Johnny if he's willing to match the commitment of the team in working towards what has been a shared goal for many years than I will if he's unwilling to. That's my personal response, not a statement of how others should feel or about how blame should be doled out.

[ComixZone]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

No, if we are losing Johnny, I would blame Treliving 100%
He lost the negotiation.

He can make it up depending on what he’d with Johnny’s money but that’s his only redemption

If he's spending that money elsewhere in free agency, it's still an absolute fail. Free Agency has no replacement for our Franchise player.

If we lose Johnny for nothing (or pennies in a rights trade), it's a full failure by Treliving because he should have never had Gaudreau in the final year of his contract with the ability to walk away for nothing. Treliving took a risk in keeping Johnny and it resulted in some measure of short term success, but if he walks? It's a failure. That's just what the job of being a GM at this level is. Risks and rewards. If Johnny signs, Treliving nailed it - but if he walks? Treliving blew it.

Same goes for Tkachuk with this upcoming season.

[dissentowner]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

The NYI were 7th in their division and sellers at the trade deadline. Tavares strongly implied he were re-signing, otherwise he’d have been dealt to a contender and would have net a massive return. He lied to management about his UFA intentions - burnt them on his way out.

The Flames were 1st in their division and widely agreed to be a cup contender. Whether Gaudreau were re-signing in Calgary or not was irrelevant - he was absolutely not being dealt either way.

The fans were still bitter, not that they didn't deal him and get a return, because he said he wanted to stay and he left. Just like Gaudreau if he left. . The whole conversation is moo, he isn't going anywhere.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by JohnnyB

Uh, how I feel about things is pretty much up to me. Not really something to say 'No' to.

Anyways, I agree that Tre would deserve blame for mismanaging the situation, but that's a separate issue from how I would view Johnny's choices.

I don't even really care that much, but I will certainly feel better about Johnny if he's willing to match the commitment of the team in working towards what has been a shared goal for many years than I will if he's unwilling to. That's my personal response, not a statement of how others should feel or about how blame should be doled out.

You are right. Badly worded by me.
I am just saying for me, I wouldn’t feel that bad about Johnny as he earned his right. It’s Treliving that mismanaged the situation.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

If he's spending that money elsewhere in free agency, it's still an absolute fail. Free Agency has no replacement for our Franchise player.

If we lose Johnny for nothing (or pennies in a rights trade), it's a full failure by Treliving because he should have never had Gaudreau in the final year of his contract with the ability to walk away for nothing. Treliving took a risk in keeping Johnny and it resulted in some measure of short term success, but if he walks? It's a failure. That's just what the job of being a GM at this level is. Risks and rewards. If Johnny signs, Treliving nailed it - but if he walks? Treliving blew it.

Same goes for Tkachuk with this upcoming season.

A team with Sutter and Treliving is not going to rebuild

You can bet your last dollar that they are going to find someone to fill in if Johnny walked. That’s the way it is, right or wrong.

And I dont disagree with you that we would find someone good from the FA

[The Cobra]

Originally Posted by ComixZone

If he's spending that money elsewhere in free agency, it's still an absolute fail. Free Agency has no replacement for our Franchise player.

If we lose Johnny for nothing (or pennies in a rights trade), it's a full failure by Treliving because he should have never had Gaudreau in the final year of his contract with the ability to walk away for nothing. Treliving took a risk in keeping Johnny and it resulted in some measure of short term success, but if he walks? It's a failure. That's just what the job of being a GM at this level is. Risks and rewards. If Johnny signs, Treliving nailed it - but if he walks? Treliving blew it.

Same goes for Tkachuk with this upcoming season.

Is it still a full failure if Ownership would not permit him to be traded?

[ForeverFlameFan]

Originally Posted by Reaper

My sad prediction? Johnny gets an eight year sign and trade deal that involves Monahan and a late pick going with him to the Flyers for Courturier, some middling players and an earlier pick. Monahan cries at the press conference. Treliving uses the cap space to try to plug the gaps in vain.

Sad prediction? That would be a home run.

[bubbsy]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

No, if we are losing Johnny, I would blame Treliving 100%
He lost the negotiation.

He can make it up depending on what he’d with Johnny’s money but that’s his only redemption

I have been a vocal questioner of treliving, even at the best of times, but treliving squeezed the negotiations in the last rfa deal, got a tremendous value aav in my opinion. The only issue is that treliving failed to bring in a coach for much of the term of the deal, and perhaps not adding enough skill to the group, leaving the results over the term of the deal pretty lack lustre.

I firmly believe that the decision to stay or go is completely on Gaudreau. The desired Money/term is likely on the table, all the leverage is with the player. Hope he signs, but he's also earned the right to make this decision.

Can't really blame treliving if the flames lose gaudreau. I also have more sympathy for treliving. I'm sure the "5 year plan" he set out with didn't include the top 2 highest drafted centers by the franchise to basically become non-factors for the team's trajectory (monahan and Bennett).

[mile]

https://twitter.com/user/status/1540789195303690240

No news, just thought it was interesting that Steinberg is still optimistic about this.

[Reggie Dunlop]

My take is that the Flames will match financially (or exceed) any other offer Johnny receives. Therefore, it's all in Gaudreau's hands.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by The Fonz

The NYI were 7th in their division and sellers at the trade deadline. Tavares strongly implied he were re-signing, otherwise he’d have been dealt to a contender and would have net a massive return. He lied to management about his UFA intentions - burnt them on his way out.

The Flames were 1st in their division and widely agreed to be a cup contender. Whether Gaudreau were re-signing in Calgary or not was irrelevant - he was absolutely not being dealt either way.

It's just a massive bungle by NYI - if he won't put down ink you gotta move him.

NYI were basically one of 5 teams competing for the last wildcard spot; day before TDL:
NJD .580 (WC 1)
CBJ .540 (WC 2)
FLA .525
CAR .516
NYI .515
DET .500

CBJ had 2 more pts and 1 game in hand. NYI was 0-2-1 in their last 3 games before TDL; 4-7-2 since the all star break.

The end result:

CBJ .591 97 pts WC1
NJD .591 97 WC2
FLA .585 96
CAR .506 83
NYI .488 80
DET .445 73

NYI went 6-10-3 after the TDL. Wilting like that probably wasn't particularly inspiring for Tavares to stay, but it was moronic for Snow to cling to such false hope. Any anger towards Tavares was misdirected.

FWIW TOR finished with 105 pts (3rd in ATL, 5th in EC, 8th in league) before losing in hilarious fashion to higher seeded BOS.


I've advocated for trading Gaudreau since before TDL 2020, but I think it would have been silly to move him this year. I think everyone MMQBing right now would have lost their minds if he was traded.

[Flamesfan05]

Originally Posted by bubbsy

I have been a vocal questioner of treliving, even at the best of times, but treliving squeezed the negotiations in the last rfa deal, got a tremendous value aav in my opinion. The only issue is that treliving failed to bring in a coach for much of the term of the deal, and perhaps not adding enough skill to the group, leaving the results over the term of the deal pretty lack lustre.

I firmly believe that the decision to stay or go is completely on Gaudreau. The desired Money/term is likely on the table, all the leverage is with the player. Hope he signs, but he's also earned the right to make this decision.

Can't really blame treliving if the flames lose gaudreau. I also have more sympathy for treliving. I'm sure the "5 year plan" he set out with didn't include the top 2 highest drafted centers by the franchise to basically become non-factors for the team's trajectory (monahan and Bennett).

Nah it’s on Treliving. He got to be able to read and act appropriately. Don’t tell me at the last minutes he learned that Johnny didn’t want to sign.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Flamesfan05

Nah it’s on Treliving. He got to be able to read and act appropriately. Don’t tell me at the last minutes he learned that Johnny didn’t want to sign.

I suspect that last offseason JG said (as he hinted in public) “yeah, if we get the right deal I would be willing to stay”. And then they agreed not to talk during the season, as they said. No way did he tell Treliving he had no intention of staying. If I hear that, knowing that the Flames likely can’t be beat financially, I can understand Treliving being pretty confident.

[TherapyforGlencross]

I’d love it if Tkachuk and Gaudreau signed a 1-year deal. Each get 10-11M. Ends perfectly with Sutter re-retiring. Then, allows the Foames to commit to a rebuild, with Wolf coming into the scene. Obviously wouldn’t happen.

[Flabbibulin]

Originally Posted by mile

https://twitter.com/user/status/1540789195303690240

No news, just thought it was interesting that Steinberg is still optimistic about this.

This is refreshing to hear and will relieve my anxiety about this a little bit. I would suggest Steinberg has a better sense of what is going on behind the scenes than any of the obscure sources referenced around here.

[butterfly]

Originally Posted by TherapyforGlencross

I’d love it if Tkachuk and Gaudreau signed a 1-year deal. Each get 10-11M. Ends perfectly with Sutter re-retiring. Then, allows the Foames to commit to a rebuild, with Wolf coming into the scene. Obviously wouldn’t happen.

If Johnny signs a 1-year deal it's going to be way more than that. The $10-11M is for a long-term deal. But I would be fine giving Tkachuk 1-year at $9M and dealing with that problem again next year when the bad contracts expire.