Hockey Canada, CHL settle lawsuit over alleged sexual assault involving WJ players

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by chedder

Has Dube's representative come out and said he wasn't involved? It's brutal how the code of silence has been.

Not that I’ve heard. I suspect they all decided to stop saying anything.

[chedder]

Originally Posted by GioforPM

Not that I’ve heard. I suspect they all decided to stop saying anything.

I would sure rather his agent speak out like Makar's did if Dube was not involved. The silence speaks volumes.

[Eric Vail]

Any agent asked is going to say their player is not involved. It is meaningless. The agent's job is to protect the player.

[chedder]

Originally Posted by Eric Vail

Any agent asked is going to say their player is not involved. It is meaningless. The agent's job is to protect the player.

Pretty dangerous move when there's about a 50/50 chance that a player's guilty. I'd say it's no comment if they were involved or get out in front, like Makar, if they weren't. The names are going to come out. Just a matter of time.

[transplant99]

Originally Posted by chedder

Pretty dangerous move when there's about a 50/50 chance that a player's guilty. I'd say it's no comment if they were involved or get out in front, like Makar, if they weren't. The names are going to come out. Just a matter of time.

Im curious how saying "no comment" is better than not saying anything at all?

Particularly when no names are out and your client says he was not involved.

[chedder]

Originally Posted by transplant99

Im curious how saying "no comment" is better than not saying anything at all?



Particularly when no names are out and your client says he was not involved.

I didn't mean saying no comment. I meant silence. Which client are you talking about that said they weren't involved?

Guaranteed many insider people, agents included, know who the perpetrators are. So coming out and lying isn't going to go well.

I'll bet the Flames know whether their player was involved. All I'm saying is if the player isn't one if the perpetrators then why not come out and say it.

[Infinit47]

This is really tough and I have competing feelings.

On one hand I absolutely believe the victim should get to choose how this is handled. But on the other hand it's hard not to want some form of biblical justice handed out to these monsters.

Any player who was in that room should never play another NHL game. I really hope Dube wasn't there, but if we was you send him home and eat the dead cap space.

Like we have told our friends in Edmonton regarding Kane, some things are more important than sports.

[GioforPM]

Originally Posted by Infinit47

This is really tough and I have competing feelings.

On one hand I absolutely believe the victim should get to choose how this is handled. But on the other hand it's hard not to want some form of biblical justice handed out to these monsters.

Any player who was in that room should never play another NHL game. I really hope Dube wasn't there, but if we was you send him home and eat the dead cap space.

Like we have told our friends in Edmonton regarding Kane, some things are more important than sports.

Yeah, it’s clear the victim wanted a low profile. But Hockey Canada is a nationally funded entity and these were young men representing HC and the country really. Hopefully they can both do an investigation and keep as much confidentiality as possible.

[JohnnyB]

First I have read of this. The account of what happened is awful. If it comes out that Dube was a participant in that, I will be hoping we don't see him in a Flames jersey again. Hopefully he was not involved in anything like that.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by chedder

Has Dube's representative come out and said he wasn't involved? It's brutal how the code of silence has been.

He hasn't been accused of anything so I fail to see why he would need to make any public declarations.

[Buff]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

He hasn't been accused of anything so I fail to see why he would need to make any public declarations.

I assume that Makar's agent spoke out about Makar not being involved to get ahead of the situation. Makar is a high profile player in the middle of the playoffs and his agent wanted to remove any distractions for him by claiming his player's lack of involvement in this situation. I also assume that is true and why he did so.

[Knut]

Originally Posted by Buff

I assume that Makar's agent spoke out about Makar not being involved to get ahead of the situation. Makar is a high profile player in the middle of the playoffs and his agent wanted to remove any distractions for him by claiming his player's lack of involvement in this situation. I also assume that is true and why he did so.

There was a Journalist asking agents and Makar was one of the first. He ended up asking about 5 players and being told they were not involved and then stopped after tweeting there were "18 more to go". Ken Campbell is his name.

This was back in May.

[chedder]

Originally Posted by Erick Estrada

He hasn't been accused of anything so I fail to see why he would need to make any public declarations.

8 unnamed members of the world junior hockey team. If you weren't involved you 100% say you weren't. Like Makar did.

The whole team has a shadow over them.

If you were not involved in something like this but all of your closest buddies were, wouldn't you want to make sure the world knew you weren't?

And I'm not saying in any words Dube was involved. I just find it curious that nobody from that team (world junior) is speaking out. It's like they're all covering for each other. All for one sort of thing hoping it will go away.

[OptimalTates]

NHL team's learned from the Brad Aldrich situation. Unfortunately, they learned better to cover their tracks and avoid responsibility. Plausible deniability. They don't want to know, they won't be asking their players, they'll let the NHL investigate and punish instead.

Keeping in mind that there's not much the NHL team's could do that wouldn't open themselves up for a possible lawsuit. None of the players have been convicted of a crime, I'm sure they all deny any criminal activity at the behest of their lawyers and agents. So even if Player X on Team Y was one of the 8 John Does, Player X vehemently denies any wrong doing, what can Team Y really do that doesn't open themselves up to some form of defamation litigation?

[OptimalTates]

Pretty much need everyone not involved, like Makar, to come forward in no uncertain terms that they were not one of the John Does. Not just that they deny any wrong doing, but that they weren't accused of wrong doing, so you can get the 8 by process of elimination and then have fans put pressure on teams who employ them in turn putting pressure on the John Does who will be required to come forward with their version of events which isn't really a great outcome either if you're just going to have 8 rapists forming a story together to put them in the best possible light.

[Eric Vail]

There might be players (or advisors to players) telling them not to say anything to protect their buddies.

If there are 23 players on the team and 15 say they didn't do it with verifiable alibis, then we have our 8. However, if only a handful say anything, they have to find another way to discover who the guilty 8 were. I suspect some want to simply protect the players and hope this goes away.

[powderjunkie]

Originally Posted by PeteMoss

It is being investigated by London police.

That said - without the victim cooperating - it won't go anywhere unless there was video or something. Its hard enough to get sexual assault crimes prosecuted even with full cooperation.

Not necessarily. We know sexual assault investigations are complex and difficult, but this isn't a he-said/she-said; there are a lot of people involved.

If you can build a strong case without involving the victim then it may change their decision to participate or not. Breaching their confidentiality is definitely a concern, but it should be manageable.

I'm not sure if anything like this already exists, but there should be criminal and civil repercussions to leaking victim identity (and hopefully as a society we can have other ways of making that a bad option - if a name leaks focus should turn to who did it and they should face the full force of 'consequence culture').

Is it possible to have a publication ban/sealing order at this stage of a case? If not, that is also something that needs to changed. And it could/should extend to the naming of rumoured perpetrators, too.

[powderjunkie]

I'd add that media practices need to evolve here. Sadly, it'll be tough to do much about reporting salacious details, but the media can easily reduce the specificity of details related to the victim - no need for age, gender, or hometown. 'Adult' or 'minor' is really all we need to know - but even just saying 'Ontario woman' would be a significant improvement.

[Erick Estrada]

Originally Posted by chedder

8 unnamed members of the world junior hockey team. If you weren't involved you 100% say you weren't. Like Makar did.

The whole team has a shadow over them.

If you were not involved in something like this but all of your closest buddies were, wouldn't you want to make sure the world knew you weren't?

And I'm not saying in any words Dube was involved. I just find it curious that nobody from that team is speaking out. It's like they're all covering for each other. All for one sort of thing hoping it will go away.

I assume the Flames have used due diligence investigating this matter seeing they are employing Dube. Unless you are of the belief that this would not matter to the Flames you would have to assume that he was not directly involved as it would certainly be a bad look on the organization if they knew and did not act in any way.

[powderjunkie]

IF there is anything to be done I bet most teams will draw out investigations and not take any actions until early August when the hockey world is in its deepest hibernation.